In your opinion who do consider the best qb ever?

**imprtkillr2810** · 10-06-2009, 12:54 PM

Originally Posted by 310stanger

Burress had the game winner, who threw him the ball? What happened the play before that? Eli evaded getting sacked by like 3 people. The Giants have NO recievers, there top ones are all hurt. Steve Smith is playing well but hes not an elite WR. Jacobs is huge but has been tiptoeing instead of driving through the hole. The he's got good receivers statement makes no sense at all. Thats the whole point of the game, the Qb throws the ball to the WR, TE, and sometimes the RB. The offense won that game. The Giant defense is, well Giant defense. Kickass. You dont like Eli, hell nobody seems to. But to call him a joke? The kid is tough as nails, doesnt say shit, and just plays the freakin game. Won the super bowl and was MVP, give him a lil credit

The Qb/ receiver thing goes both ways man...they have to be able to catch the ball. So if he doesnt have any good receivers how is he getting the yards??

**camaroz98** · 10-06-2009, 01:01 PM

if you look at what they have done off the field as a person in life bart starr would win this hands down!

**Neo** · 10-06-2009, 04:36 PM

Starr had all sorts of talent around him, and his coach just plain knew how to win. So did Montana.

Look at brady, he got it all done with shit receivers. Jabar Gaffney? Troy Bown? C'mon. Hell, he made Deion Branch look elite, he blows now in Seattle. Once he got the tools, look what happened: 50 TDs, and an undefeated regular season. Damn good.

**andrew rs** · 10-06-2009, 05:00 PM

Originally Posted by Neo

Starr had all sorts of talent around him, and his coach just plain knew how to win. So did Montana.

Look at brady, he got it all done with shit receivers. Jabar Gaffney? Troy Bown? C'mon. Hell, he made Deion Branch look elite, he blows now in Seattle. Once he got the tools, look what happened: 50 TDs, and an undefeated regular season. Damn good.

uhhh they cheated big time that year... taping other teams practices is a huge advantage in games.. you know all of their plays and mechanics.

**Neo** · 10-06-2009, 05:31 PM

Originally Posted by andrew rs

uhhh they cheated big time that year... taping other teams practices is a huge advantage in games.. you know all of their plays and mechanics.

That's regardless. They didn't tape save for that one or two weeks "maybe" the year they went 16-0.

What they did was bad, but it's no HUGE advantage. They taped the Rams walkthrough (allegedly) before the superbowl. They had a full year of tape to run through, and there is nothing they could have done in one day to alter their game plan to fit anything different that the rams ran during practice. Not enough time.

It may have helped them for one or two plays, but other than that, the taping was minimal.

Tape from the previous week and the weeks beforehand (that ALL teams get on each other) is going to effect it the most.

Brady's just a great QB. You don't go 18-0 without a great qb making plays.

I'm a full time football coach. Trust me, I know what I'm talking about here.

**andrew rs** · 10-06-2009, 05:33 PM

Originally Posted by Neo

That's regardless. They didn't tape save for that one or two weeks "maybe" the year they went 16-0.

What they did was bad, but it's no HUGE advantage. They taped the Rams walkthrough (allegedly) before the superbowl. They had a full year of tape to run through, and there is nothing they could have done in one day to alter their game plan to fit anything different that the rams ran during practice. Not enough time.

It may have helped them for one or two plays, but other than that, the taping was minimal.

Tape from the previous week and the weeks beforehand (that ALL teams get on each other) is going to effect it the most.

Brady's just a great QB. You don't go 18-0 without a great qb making plays.

I'm a full time football coach. Trust me, I know what I'm talking about here.

not doubting your knowledge of the game but you cant say they went undefeted un helped just because of tom brady. They did infact cheat giving them some sort of advantage, big or small cheating is cheating.

**blackSS01** · 10-06-2009, 06:05 PM

Originally Posted by Neo

Starr had all sorts of talent around him, and his coach just plain knew how to win. So did Montana.

Look at brady, he got it all done with shit receivers. Jabar Gaffney? Troy Bown? C'mon. Hell, he made Deion Branch look elite, he blows now in Seattle. Once he got the tools, look what happened: 50 TDs, and an undefeated regular season. Damn good.

Yup and their one loss was a GIANT of a loss

Losers

**blackSS01** · 10-06-2009, 06:05 PM

Originally Posted by andrew rs

not doubting your knowledge of the game but you cant say they went undefeted un helped just because of tom brady. They did infact cheat giving them some sort of advantage, big or small cheating is cheating.

**imprtkillr2810** · 10-06-2009, 06:42 PM

Whats the big difference between filming a practice or watching game film? I dislike the Pats more than any other team, but what they did wasnt really that big of a deal. I played ball in high school and EVERY team taped EVERY other team. We traded films around with all the teams in the area. Anyway this is just all opinions and some have really good arguments to who should win. But nobody wins simply because its all opinions.

310 you did make a good point about Eli not having very good receivers around him now. When he won the SB though he did have some pretty good one in my opinion. In my opinion Strahan should have won MVP in that game for keeping pressure on Brady.Thats just it though its my opinion and you have yours. To each his own man

**310stanger** · 10-06-2009, 06:54 PM

Originally Posted by imprtkillr2810

Whats the big difference between filming a practice or watching game film? I dislike the Pats more than any other team, but what they did wasnt really that big of a deal. I played ball in high school and EVERY team taped EVERY other team. We traded films around with all the teams in the area. Anyway this is just all opinions and some have really good arguments to who should win. But nobody wins simply because its all opinions.

310 you did make a good point about Eli not having very good receivers around him now. When he won the SB though he did have some pretty good one in my opinion. In my opinion Strahan should have won MVP in that game for keeping pressure on Brady.Thats just it though its my opinion and you have yours. To each his own man

Dude i wish we still had Strahan. To me Giants football is rushing the qb. I'm convinced thats how you win. With a defense that is predicated on blitzing the qb. However, i truly believe that Eli doesnt get enough credit. People hate on him and thats one thing, but then lots say hes shit. The guy is good. Hes not everybodies cup of tea but to say that hes a joke, i just cant agree with that. Hes a true team kind of qb, hes tough as nails. You ever see all the hits he gets where he gets rocked and pops right back up? He just plugs away and he thrives under pressure. He makes mistakes here and there in regular season games, but one thing i noticed about him is hes relatively unfazed in big situations. His big saying amongst the giants in the huddle in a big situation is "Lets win this thing". It is what it is. I love em and im glad hes the qb of my team. Greatest ever at this given point? Fuck no. His brother? You can make a strong argument on that....

**310stanger** · 10-06-2009, 06:56 PM

The Tom Brady thing...... You can watch all the film you want and know all the plays you want of another team..... YOU STILL GOTTA EXECUTE AGAINST ANOTHER TEAM THAT IS TRYING TO WIN! people forget that. Everybody that says the Pats cheat have no clue what actually is involved in playing a football game. Its more complicated then any sport in all of sports. Football knowledge is worthless without execution

**imprtkillr2810** · 10-06-2009, 07:10 PM

I shouldnt have used the term "joke" about Eli. Hes a good qb but hes not great. Maybe in time who knows. Favre pissed alot of people off, but we all know he is going down and one of the greats in the history of the sport. You wanna talk about another future hall of famer?? Drew Brees, the man came back from surgery with a bionic arm. When he has an off day its usually for 300+ yards. I bet the Bolts kick themselves everyday for getting rid of him.

**310stanger** · 10-06-2009, 07:13 PM

Originally Posted by imprtkillr2810

I shouldnt have used the term "joke" about Eli. Hes a good qb but hes not great. Maybe in time who knows. Favre pissed alot of people off, but we all know he is going down and one of the greats in the history of the sport. You wanna talk about another future hall of famer?? Drew Brees, the man came back from surgery with a bionic arm. When he has an off day its usually for 300+ yards. I bet the Bolts kick themselves everyday for getting rid of him.

Drew Brees has to win a super bowl...... Yes the bolts are kicking themselves twice.....Wish they still had Drew Brees and...... They wish a certain, why yes ELI MANNING would have elected to be on their team lmao Philip Rivers sucks and hes overrated

**imprtkillr2810** · 10-06-2009, 07:19 PM

Haha I agree that Brees needs to win a SB, and I agree that Rivers is overrated. Ya know when I think about it, I guess my biggest beef with Eli was the whole "I wont play for the Chargers" thing. That and the Giants beat the Packers to go to the Super Bowl. Im not a Packers fan, but ive always liked Favre. On another Brees note, he doesnt really HAVE to win a Bowl to be in the HOF. Look at Barry Sanders...

**310stanger** · 10-06-2009, 07:27 PM

Originally Posted by imprtkillr2810

Haha I agree that Brees needs to win a SB, and I agree that Rivers is overrated. Ya know when I think about it, I guess my biggest beef with Eli was the whole "I wont play for the Chargers" thing. That and the Giants beat the Packers to go to the Super Bowl. Im not a Packers fan, but ive always liked Favre. On another Brees note, he doesnt really HAVE to win a Bowl to be in the HOF. Look at Barry Sanders...

If you can play at an elite level on a team like the Lions.... You deserve to be in the hall of fame. Can you imagine how sick Barry Sanders would have been had he been on the cowboys, Giants, Broncos, Niners (when they were an elite team), etc

**Neo** · 10-06-2009, 07:28 PM

Originally Posted by imprtkillr2810

Whats the big difference between filming a practice or watching game film? I dislike the Pats more than any other team, but what they did wasnt really that big of a deal. I played ball in high school and EVERY team taped EVERY other team. We traded films around with all the teams in the area. Anyway this is just all opinions and some have really good arguments to who should win. But nobody wins simply because its all opinions.

310 you did make a good point about Eli not having very good receivers around him now. When he won the SB though he did have some pretty good one in my opinion. In my opinion Strahan should have won MVP in that game for keeping pressure on Brady.Thats just it though its my opinion and you have yours. To each his own man

Filming a practice, especially the week that they play you, can potentially reveal a TON about their game plan. That's when you put in certain plays and formations developed specifically FOR that team.

For instance, one time in the 60s, the Bills played the Dolphins in Miami, so they practiced all week in Vero. Little did they know, the Dolphins had a spy over there watching everything they did. The Bills got killed.

The next year, the Bills upped security in Vero, and absolutely destroyed the Dolphins.

Filming a practice is bad bad bad for the team being filmed. They could be totally fucked.

**allbaugh_04** · 10-06-2009, 07:31 PM

I never got to see Joe Montana play but I know he is good.

It's between:

Joe Montana
Dan Marino
Peyton Manning

Peyton Manning will go down as one of the best QBs of all time for sure. It's hard to say who is the best, because some guys just get stuck with shitty players...Dan Marinos stats really tell a tale.

**Neo** · 10-06-2009, 07:32 PM

Originally Posted by 310stanger

If you can play at an elite level on a team like the Lions.... You deserve to be in the hall of fame. Can you imagine how sick Barry Sanders would have been had he been on the cowboys, Giants, Broncos, Niners (when they were an elite team), etc

I dunno if he would've had as good stats as he ended up havng. Wheh he was with the Lions, it was all they had, so they ran him to death and he racked up a shit ton of stats.

But that mighta been the reason why he walked away so early, he just got tired. Mayb if he were on a more balanced team, he woulda lasted longer, and hence got better stats?

**imprtkillr2810** · 10-06-2009, 07:37 PM

I think if Sanders was on a team than had an o-line and could pass the ball, it would have really opened up the run game for him even more. He was awesome with the crappy lions o-line, and every team knew all they could do was RUN. So just think what would have happened if they could have passed too...

**FasstChevys** · 10-07-2009, 05:28 AM

I'm totally laughing at all of these bullshit arguements about, "this QB had better receivers" etc etc etc.....

every one of the QB's that are even in the running for the title of "Greatest QB ever" had great receivers.......who the hell is anyone trying to kid here????

Montana - Rice, Taylor, B. Jones, R. Craig
Favre - Driver, Sharpe, Freeman
P. Manning - Harrison, Wayne, Clark
Marino - Duper, Clayton
Young - Rice, Owens, B. Jones, Watters

Without having anyone that can catch the ball, none of these guys are in the discussion.