Dead Future Camaros

**matthewaqui** · 02-06-2008, 12:33 PM

Thinking of it now..... have you ever watched Mad Max, Beyond Thunderdome, etc? How did they ever power their vehicles if the world fell apart and everyone fended for themselves in the Madland?

By the way, our vehicles are only good until gasoline is no longer produce. Probably not in our lifetime huh?

**346ci** · 02-06-2008, 12:51 PM

I hope I never see a day without gasoline

**Firebirdjones** · 02-06-2008, 04:54 PM

Originally Posted by WARP211

Yeah I hear ya.. thery are not a family car 4 sure them vettes.. But i was talking bang for your buck.. it would have to be a vette for me.. Cuz i'm solo.. and i plan on be that way for awhile. I guess if you had a family it would be kool. but then again thats why they make suv's and minivans for. I can't really picture me and my kids (if i ever have any) riding in something with 400HP or even 500HP.. Maybe wit a chick but not a family.. I'd be too tempeted to just punch it and let it rip...

We will never be caught jumping on the minivan bandwagon,,,thats for sure. I pick my son up from school all the time in the chevelle, (638 hp car) and he loves it. We as a family tool around in it all the time. No big deal really. I'll haze the tires once and a while and my son loves it,,,he'll even ask me to do it. It's already in his blood

**Firebirdjones** · 02-06-2008, 05:01 PM

Originally Posted by matthewaqui

Torrance Sepulveda....... I am familiar with the Area. I used to teach in Carson........ I work in Parmount now and drive to Carson everyday to pick up the children from their school. I used to live in Garden Grove, Orange County.

I have been in Lakewood since 2001 when I was singled and purchased a home there. Same year I picked up my 1st TA. To purchase a home and a TA in the same year was like being in Heavan to me!!!!

Ahhhhh the single life.... Man, the children came to being in 2002... short lived hahahah!

Baby Carseats don't do well in TA passenger seats!

At any rate, Arizona is somewhat warm in the summer... as I heard, certain areas in Arizona is heavily smog polluted.

At any rate, that's part of life.

Matthew

I guess certain areas may be smog polluted in Arizona, I wouldn't know for sure. I do know that smog testing is in 2 counties,,,Maricopa and Yuma counties,,,,which is primarily Phoenix and all the suburbs around it,,,and down a little south around Tuscon.

Which is why we avoided these areas and bought a house up in Prescott Valley. Currently Yavapai county up there doesn't have smog tests, and at 5,000 feet up they haven't found it necessary,,,guess the air at 5,000 feet has some advantage. Has mild climates,,,,usually no more than 100 in the summer, but mid 90's are the norm. Winter is high in the 50's most days, very little snow, and if it does it doesn't stay more than a day,,,and best part,,,,,they don't use salt on the roads,,,wooohooo.

**peteSS** · 02-06-2008, 05:24 PM

i know all this fuel economy crap's going to screw everything up.. it's only going to get worse too

**WARP211** · 02-06-2008, 07:43 PM

Originally Posted by Firebirdjones

We will never be caught jumping on the minivan bandwagon,,,thats for sure. I pick my son up from school all the time in the chevelle, (638 hp car) and he loves it. We as a family tool around in it all the time. No big deal really. I'll haze the tires once and a while and my son loves it,,,he'll even ask me to do it. It's already in his blood

+1... 4sure.. Gotta get jr. started early..

**matthewaqui** · 02-07-2008, 07:05 AM

Man this thread has to do with everything to anything hahahaha!!! Especially with raising the youngins hahahah!

This thread has much to do with reality and future of transportation. I'm biting my nails given the dent in the manufacturing and pricing of this Camaro.

GM has dented my plans big time when it comes to updating my DD.

Yesterday I drove past a Ford dealership that was close....The dealership is on the corner of Avalon by the 405. Not only did they offer consumer but also commercial trucks, one of the biggest in SoCal. They are a big dealership that closed down. This tells us that even Ford is being hit hard with the current status of the economy!

Originally Posted by WARP211

+1... 4sure.. Gotta get jr. started early..

**matthewaqui** · 02-07-2008, 07:30 AM

I had to look up what a Chevelle looks like...... 600 something horses is a pretty defined vehicle.

When I think of Arizona, I think of undeveloped and dry. Prescott Valley seems like a good place for you without the smog tests hhahahahaha.... but it seems like that County is of the unsettled territories........ I just have chills thinking of Utah, Arizona, Texas, New Mexico..... all I think of is SAND. Valleys typically have very humid and warm temps.

One day I will drive through the Eastern States to check them out.

90 seems pretty hot.....80 is tops for me. For certain you won't have any vehicle driving barriers there. You can then meet up with 67CamaroRSSS.

Funny as it is right now to think of..... for many a vehicle is not a big thing, as long as they have one. For us it's a big attraction. Why couldn't our lives be simplistic based on happiness of owning any vehicle that's driveable?

mattttttttttttttt

**Firebirdjones** · 02-07-2008, 11:16 AM

Originally Posted by matthewaqui

I had to look up what a Chevelle looks like...... 600 something horses is a pretty defined vehicle.

When I think of Arizona, I think of undeveloped and dry. Prescott Valley seems like a good place for you without the smog tests hhahahahaha.... but it seems like that County is of the unsettled territories........ I just have chills thinking of Utah, Arizona, Texas, New Mexico..... all I think of is SAND. Valleys typically have very humid and warm temps.

One day I will drive through the Eastern States to check them out.

90 seems pretty hot.....80 is tops for me. For certain you won't have any vehicle driving barriers there. You can then meet up with 67CamaroRSSS.

Funny as it is right now to think of..... for many a vehicle is not a big thing, as long as they have one. For us it's a big attraction. Why couldn't our lives be simplistic based on happiness of owning any vehicle that's driveable?

mattttttttttttttt

Ford has been hit hard out here as well. One of their big transmission manufacturing plants about 10 miles from my house (in ohio) is shutting down. Thousands of workers have either taken early retirement, getting layed off,,,,or transferred to the other Ford transmission plant about 50 miles away. It's sad for sure. Alot of this has to do with people buying the foreign junk,,,jobs are disappearing, sales are down,,,the big 3 are struggling for sure.

Prescott is actually grown leaps and bounds over the last say,,,,5-6 years??? It's a big town with anything you could want. Housing has gone up everywhere,,,prices are through the roof. They had a huge growth period as I mentioned,,,which consisted of mainly Californians moving in,,,some went to Prescott, some went further south to Phoenix. Alot of retired folk settle here as well. Sedona is beatuifull, known to many as the most beautiful place in the world, Lake Havasu is another popular destination with beautifull sights, and much more to see,,,,it's not all dry plain desert.

Here in Ohio we have 90's during the summer, with 100% humidity and 90* dew points,,,,it's nasty. 90's in Prescott with 20% humidity and 10* dew points feels like someone turned on the A/C compared to Ohio.
Although they do have a humid period during what they call Monsoon season,,,,it's still nothing compared to Ohio.
Their idea of Monsoon season is 4 inches of rain over a 3 month period,,,,,

Hell we get 4 inches of rain here in Ohio in 2 hours when a thunderstorm rolls through

I agree on the simplistic comment. I tell my wife all the time society always makes things more complicated than it has to be. Not to mention technology peaked for me around 1975

**JoshieDoom** · 02-07-2008, 11:30 AM

Its wierd that a lot of foreign junk is more domestic than foreign.. Take toyota for example... and where I work about 95 percent of the parts go into "imports"

**Firebirdjones** · 02-07-2008, 11:33 AM

Originally Posted by JoshieDoom

Its wierd that a lot of foreign junk is more domestic than foreign.. Take toyota for example... and where I work about 95 percent of the parts go into "imports"

Well they do have some plants over here now,,,but where do you think most of that money goes????? They put a sugar coating on it when they tell you it's creating jobs for the American people, when in reality,,,,most of the product sales still go over seas. It's kinda like damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Of course then we move plants to other countries for cheaper labor,,,there goes some more jobs,,,,it's just killing the economy as a whole.

**matthewaqui** · 02-07-2008, 11:35 AM

Jones,

Thanks for the climate comparison........ East coast wise, I have felt that Humidity in the past...... 90 Degrees at night is nothing to write home about. From you description, Prescott weather is quite pleasant..... people from California escaping to Arizona I have heard of too often.

Though I have been through the states, maybe I'm still somewhat shelter from not having ventured towards the South Eastern states.

SUVs have been a hit for the past 10 years, though with the current price of gas and the state of the economy, the big US vehicle manufactures are getting creamed right now. With the way everything is of current, their survival is gloomy. If they go back to building small sedans, they will once again have to hurdle with that the imports. I doubt they want to do that. They would be way off of their game, though going with the public interest is a necessity for survival. If you look at it, imports only begun to produced the SUVs / minivans as of recent compared to Ford and Chevys. However you want to see it, they have a large hurdle to jump to make sales.

1975? hahahahhahahha It can peak until we go completely powered Oxygen or Electrical Recharge. I'm apt to say vehicle powered by pure air alone. Take the H20 from the air and combust it without any necessary mixture of the sort. Now that is a leap for mankind! Speak about space Travel and that of regeneration as a propulsion. Probably won't happen in our life time. I would freakin work on it now if I had the knowledge and expertise.

When are you moving?
Matttttttttttttttttt

**Firebirdjones** · 02-07-2008, 11:49 AM

Originally Posted by matthewaqui

Jones,

Thanks for the climate comparison........ East coast wise, I have felt that Humidity in the past...... 90 Degrees at night is nothing to write home about. From you description, Prescott weather is quite pleasant..... people from California escaping to Arizona I have heard of too often.

Though I have been through the states, maybe I'm still somewhat shelter from not having ventured towards the South Eastern states.

SUVs have been a hit for the past 10 years, though with the current price of gas and the state of the economy, the big US vehicle manufactures are getting creamed right now. With the way everything is of current, their survival is gloomy. If they go back to building small sedans, they will once again have to hurdle with that the imports. I doubt they want to do that. They would be way off of their game, though going with the public interest is a necessity for survival. If you look at it, imports only begun to produced the SUVs / minivans as of recent compared to Ford and Chevys. However you want to see it, they have a large hurdle to jump to make sales.

1975? hahahahhahahha It can peak until we go completely powered Oxygen or Electrical Recharge. I'm apt to say vehicle powered by pure air alone. Take the H20 from the air and combust it without any necessary mixture of the sort. Now that is a leap for mankind! Speak about space Travel and that of regeneration as a propulsion. Probably won't happen in our life time. I would freakin work on it now if I had the knowledge and expertise.

When are you moving?
Matttttttttttttttttt

I hope I'm dead before all that happens,,,it's just too much for me to comprehend,,,lol.

I think we will move sometime mid summer this year. No hurry really. Jobs are the main concern, and nothing is really jumping out in the Prescott area. Regardless though,,,my wife doesn't want to spend another winter here,,,,lol. Within the next 3-4 months it will probably happen.

**bluefields88** · 02-07-2008, 12:10 PM

might sound crazy, but maybe they'll switch over to turbo diesels?

**t-rock** · 02-07-2008, 04:01 PM

Originally Posted by Firebirdjones

Exactly. Hang on to what you have. With the restoration business in full swing,,plus the garage full of spare parts I have. I can keep the old stuff running for many years to come, well beyond my years anyway. I'll be 70 years old and still tooling around in my 60's and 70's cars, suits me just fine. Been that way for the last 30 years, sounds like nothing will change for me.

As a matter of fact,,,this sounds just like my father

still driving the GTO he bought new 39 years ago,,,lol. Like father like son I guess.

im right there with ya. im going for a late 70's early 80's ta for daily driver some day.

**redhcnc** · 02-07-2008, 07:50 PM

true true.. lol

**00Z28DC** · 02-08-2008, 05:33 AM

i hate freakin tree huggers and the retarded CAFE law, i mean i'll pay 44k if i have to, to get the new camaro if it's a very high end v8, but not if i have to pay a retarded tax on it. the government shouldn't have a say on our previous generation cars, they shouldn't be able to mandate anything on them, i mean they were bought before any law was in effect so we shouldn't be taxed for having our v8's in the future. I was ready to put in a deposit on the new camaro at a local dealership, but now i'm thinkin i'll try to find a low mileage f-body, and work on/save that one and then just continue using my current Z as a daily driver, but you won't catch me dead in the driver seat of a fwd car, i'll rwd till the day i die.

**slims00ls1z28** · 02-08-2008, 07:42 AM

That article was BS. Fbodfather said it himself. They are doing things in GM to deal with it, but others don't know jack. Sure this CAFE bill is some garbage but it will not affect the Camaro to the point where it drives the price up to the moon. Even if the article did say "high end" not base or v6 they still have nothing more than a hodge podge of quotes to make a story. The CAFE does not affect anything really until 2011 and the full effect by 2020. I am by no means a backer of this BS bill but given the facts of the bill and what it did and will do has no direct impact not will it kill the Camaro. The biggest thing right now it did was make trucks that were not classed into the CAFE now classed into it and that was mandated by the (9th circut court of appeals not congress). There are many steps GM is takinig to drastically increase the average in the trucks which is the immediate future's problem. Other than that the average has to be 35 mpg by 2020. Given the LS engines current ratings and new technology such as Direct injection and hybrids getting a Camaro to that level would not be hard getting a 2.5 ton SUV there is the trick.

Reguardless this was not the act of Bush. It was your democratically elected congress that made this bill and forced it through. I was threatened to be Veto'd and had many hours of negotiating and in the end all parties envolved had to sign off on something, Bush would have vetoed and congress would have overturned the Veto. The last time CAFE had any big change was 30 years ago last I checked the elder Bush was not in office then either. You want to play politics blame the tree huggers.

**matthewaqui** · 02-08-2008, 08:34 AM

I was super disappointed in hearing of all this, but it's reality and GM has bitten the bullet in their future lines already. I like to believe that the article is a bunch of bull, but GM action and intention has spoken already and shit walks. The Camaro is not in production yet, thus, who is to say that GM may not backout?

I'm sure by 2010, the big boys will have developed hybrid efficient vehicles.

Of course a Veto on this would boost the economy, passing it would likey hurt.... but nevertheless, the plant is in Canada and not the US when it comes to the power V8 Rear wheel drive.

Man I was placing all my chips on the future production of the Camaro..... my plans have been dented from the unforseen future. All I'm bringing up from this thread entail the limited or the scrap manufacturing of the Camaro where MSRP will be driven due to limited/year production. You have to remember that limitation drives price. Funny thing is our appeal to the vehicle has to do with the casing on not the engine, for we can get the same motor in a different type of vehicle.

Future Camaro enthusiast like us don't want to admit the inevitable, but why would you want to set yourself up for a let down? Besides us, countless others are holding out to make the purchase or saving up for it.

A good thing for GM to do is come clean... it's been 2 years. Let us know their production intent and their pricing for the models. All in all, they would be unintelligent to do so for they don't want a commitment to their patrons.

How unfair GM can be when so many future buyers are already committed and some have placed deposits already without even knowing the price and the future.

In my opinion, this is not the best GM marketing tactic for one of their upcoming future line. It's the enthusiast who will be the first to pick up the vehicle when it hits the streets. It is they who will bring in potential buyers as they cruised down the street in the gleaming Camaros. The V6s will not walk themselves off the lot.

I saw that damn Knight Rider commercial last night with Kitt talking... the end of the commercial verbally states that it's "Powered By Ford!" How do you like that for a marketing ploy? If the series run well into the new Design years, that show will more than likely work the new Mustang Model in and sales will increase. Hands down, business comes from how well you market.

**slims00ls1z28** · 02-08-2008, 08:58 AM

The Camaro is a go nothing has changed. Even this fake article states that. What it claims is that the price will be Vette territory for the high end V8's etc.

The Oshwa plant is under way as we speak and it is a flex plant set to produce the Camaro, G8, G8 ute and possibly a 4 door GMC ute spin off plus a myriad of others. Even if it makes a one year run only (not likely but just saying) it is almost here and will be made. Cafe will not stop that. The only lines that got the axe was the RWD Impala, and GTO which were in the plans untill the CAFE implementation.

Other vehicles like the Volt, turbo diesels, hybrid and flex fuel vehicles helps to bring the average up while leaving room to play with a few models such as the Vette and Camaro. With trucks currently hitting the mid 20's and mroe fuel saving tech on the way for them there is not much needed to meet the current levels especially with several vehicles in the lineup already rated at 30 mpg and above.