How to tune?

**0rion** · 02-17-2009, 06:03 PM

Originally Posted by mark21742

open the tuners scan program and this window....bouce back and forth....i just walked you thruogh everything as i did it so it is truly step by step.

once you open them up it will go quick and easy

then you get to learn about offsets

**Firebirdjones** · 02-17-2009, 06:10 PM

Originally Posted by 0rion

then you get to learn about offsets

ARG! I don't even know what that means and I'm already confused

**Hi-Po** · 02-19-2009, 04:18 PM

How many people think a laptop is absolutely necessary? I really dont want to buy one, I wish I already had a laptop. HP tuners would be in the mail right now.

**Firebirdjones** · 02-19-2009, 04:26 PM

Originally Posted by Hi-Po

How many people think a laptop is absolutely necessary? I really dont want to buy one, I wish I already had a laptop. HP tuners would be in the mail right now.

If you want to use HPtuner you will need the laptop. No way around it that I know of.

**0rion** · 02-19-2009, 04:29 PM

Originally Posted by Hi-Po

How many people think a laptop is absolutely necessary? I really dont want to buy one, I wish I already had a laptop. HP tuners would be in the mail right now.

if you want to tune it would be pretty crappy without one. You can do it with the pro because you can black box log and go back and forth but you'd still have to have the desktop close enough to the car to flash. check out this site....I've bought 2 refurbished laptops from them and both have worked out excellent.
http://www.intechraoutlet.com/home/
Their inventory is constantly changing so check it everyday and eventually you'll stumble onto a good deal. The have 1.7ghz 40gb laptops there now for $251.

**Hi-Po** · 02-19-2009, 04:38 PM

Thats what I just got talking about with my brother. The Rock Financial Showplace has a electronics showcase this weekend. I might go there. I just gotta see if I can spend roughly ANOTHER 1000 bucks on my car. I already have figured in at least 500$ to get the car tuned... one time. Im still weary at how quickly I can get the car tuned and get it driving. Stricly because I have never seen the software.

I screw with Caterpillar Electronics Technician software almost daily. Its baically HPtuners for Cat ECM's. I have flashed multiple ECM on Cat's equipment, so Im hoping this will be slightly the same. Cat ET still deals with Histograms and a data logging feature. So some it might carry over? I was ready to click "order" on HPtuner.com tonight. If I already had a laptop... it would be in the mail tomorrow.

**Firebirdjones** · 02-19-2009, 04:59 PM

Originally Posted by 0rion

if you want to tune it would be pretty crappy without one. You can do it with the pro because you can black box log and go back and forth but you'd still have to have the desktop close enough to the car to flash. check out this site....I've bought 2 refurbished laptops from them and both have worked out excellent.
http://www.intechraoutlet.com/home/
Their inventory is constantly changing so check it everyday and eventually you'll stumble onto a good deal. The have 1.7ghz 40gb laptops there now for $251.

Wow I wasn't aware of that,,,,of course I don't know what black box logging is but the part of having the desktop close enough to the car to flash cracks me up.
Guess I could back the car around the house and run some cords out the window

**0rion** · 02-19-2009, 05:01 PM

Originally Posted by Firebirdjones

Wow I wasn't aware of that,,,,of course I don't know what black box logging is but the part of having the desktop close enough to the car to flash cracks me up.
Guess I could back the car around the house and run some cords out the window

back in the ls1edit days when I first started I had a desktop in the garage and would use it to flash because I was using a borrowed laptop and it only had usb and I didn't trust the usb converted to serial to flash. In those days with edit if you lost communitcations during a flash your pcm was done. I had an extra desktop so I put it in the garage and bought a 6' db9 cable and used that set up. Pain in the butt for sure but it worked.

**Firebirdjones** · 02-19-2009, 05:10 PM

Originally Posted by 0rion

back in the ls1edit days when I first started I had a desktop in the garage and would use it to flash because I was using a borrowed laptop and it only had usb and I didn't trust the usb converted to serial to flash. In those days with edit if you lost communitcations during a flash your pcm was done. I had an extra desktop so I put it in the garage and bought a 6' db9 cable and used that set up. Pain in the butt for sure but it worked.

Now that's engenuity right there. If there is a way I know Orion will figure it out.

**Hi-Po** · 02-19-2009, 05:39 PM

Originally Posted by 0rion

back in the ls1edit days when I first started I had a desktop in the garage and would use it to flash because I was using a borrowed laptop and it only had usb and I didn't trust the usb converted to serial to flash. In those days with edit if you lost communitcations during a flash your pcm was done. I had an extra desktop so I put it in the garage and bought a 6' db9 cable and used that set up. Pain in the butt for sure but it worked.

In CAT ECM's... that is the same. BUT, they have recently started where right after you start the flash... before it gets PAST 1% finished, you cancel it and it clears the ECM of everything. Everything. The only way to start over. But it works. I really want this software. It sounds fun,interesting and challenging.

**Dr.Crash** · 02-19-2009, 08:18 PM

Originally Posted by Hi-Po

In CAT ECM's... that is the same. BUT, they have recently started where right after you start the flash... before it gets PAST 1% finished, you cancel it and it clears the ECM of everything. Everything. The only way to start over. But it works. I really want this software. It sounds fun,interesting and challenging.

ya and check with KYspeed, i know that they sell these for the same price. and you can help out our sponsors!

**0rion** · 02-19-2009, 09:15 PM

Originally Posted by Hi-Po

In CAT ECM's... that is the same. BUT, they have recently started where right after you start the flash... before it gets PAST 1% finished, you cancel it and it clears the ECM of everything. Everything. The only way to start over. But it works. I really want this software. It sounds fun,interesting and challenging.

hptuners and efilive both have a recovery feature now and it was one of the biggest improvements over edit IMO. They do it by only writing the calibration instead of everything ( you still have the option to write entire) and that pretty much removes the chances of a dead pcm.

**Hi-Po** · 02-20-2009, 12:32 PM

alright, So right now I am looking at HPtuners pro (from KY speed) for 650$. Then I need the LC1 correct? What else should I need to complete this? I think im gonna make another plunge into my car. Thank god I havent been fired from my job, yet.

**0rion** · 02-20-2009, 01:03 PM

that should get you going pretty good.....a laptop would be real nice to have. You'll have to refresh my memory...are you cammed yet?

**Dr.Crash** · 02-20-2009, 01:18 PM

didnt you just get it in the mail??? is it installed yet

**Dr.Crash** · 02-20-2009, 01:19 PM

Originally Posted by Hi-Po

alright, So right now I am looking at HPtuners pro (from KY speed) for 650$. Then I need the LC1 correct? What else should I need to complete this? I think im gonna make another plunge into my car. Thank god I havent been fired from my job, yet.

Ky speed is also having a GP on LC-1. I think they were $220 shipped

**Hi-Po** · 02-20-2009, 01:31 PM

Originally Posted by 0rion

that should get you going pretty good.....a laptop would be real nice to have. You'll have to refresh my memory...are you cammed yet?

230/236 114 is sitting next to me. With some other stuff.

I will be buying a cheap laptop and hope it works for me.

Damn, at 220$ I dont see me getting out of this under 1000$.

**Dr.Crash** · 02-20-2009, 01:35 PM

Originally Posted by Hi-Po

230/236 114 is sitting next to me. With some other stuff.

I will be buying a cheap laptop and hope it works for me.

Damn, at 220$ I dont see me getting out of this under 1000$.

But after that, no more money goes to tuning. worth it to me....

nice cam! your gunna love it.

**mark21742** · 02-21-2009, 03:31 AM

Originally Posted by Hi-Po

230/236 114 is sitting next to me. With some other stuff.

I will be buying a cheap laptop and hope it works for me.

Damn, at 220$ I dont see me getting out of this under 1000$.

what is the RPM range of that cam?

also why is it that three cams that are the same size have such different operating ranges= 224/224, ive seen 1,800-6,300, up to 2,800-7000.....i just dont understand the difference

**Firebirdjones** · 02-21-2009, 12:10 PM

Originally Posted by mark21742

what is the RPM range of that cam?

also why is it that three cams that are the same size have such different operating ranges= 224/224, ive seen 1,800-6,300, up to 2,800-7000.....i just dont understand the difference

It depends on how the intake center line is ground in relation to the lobe seperation,,,,and how far out the lobe seperation is spread in the first place.

You can have a lobe seperation of say for example 110,,,,and an intake centerline of 106. Which is 4 degrees of advance ground into the camshaft. Now you can install that cam at the 106 intake centerline position or you can move that around with adjustable timing chain or offset bushings, moving the camshaft up to 110 intake centerline would be "straight up" with no advance,,,going even further to say 112 would retard the camshaft 2 degrees.

You can even start with a camshaft that is ground with 114 degrees of lobe seperation and have a 110 intake center line,,,then move it around from there depending on what you are trying to accomplish.

All of this affects the rpm range the camshaft will operate and where it makes it's peak power.

If thats not enough you can get into how the lobes are ground with faster ramps, slow closing rates that are easier on the valvetrain etc. etc....