Trick Flow head and cam combo

**9t8z28** · 12-23-2007, 05:07 PM

Originally Posted by 01 T/A

Let me know what they say. I was going to call but the tec line is closed.... Is that beter? hahaha

Now it's better!

**Firebirdjones** · 12-23-2007, 06:19 PM

Just to add, if anyone is wondering about trickflow quality,,,their heads are used exclusively by a local engine builder here. Mike Saddler swears by them,,,and does most all of our machine work. He runs a shop with a DTS dyno,,,and he placed 4th in the most recent Engine Masters Challenge seen on ESPN,,,,,against all of the top engine builders in the country.

He uses trickflow on almost everything he builds. We just recently built an old school 406 (gen 1 to you guys) that originally are equipped with 24 degree heads,,,,we went with 18 degree Trickflows, single carb on gas and made over 600 hp on a conservative DTS dyno without trying too hard.
It's good stuff.

As well as they work on old school small blocks I can only assume they should make awsome power on an LS series engine as well,,,,since they are 13 degree heads, they should be killer.

**9t8z28** · 12-23-2007, 06:22 PM

Originally Posted by Firebirdjones

Just to add, if anyone is wondering about trickflow quality,,,their heads are used exclusively by a local engine builder here. Mike Saddler swears by them,,,and does most all of our machine work. He runs a shop with a DTS dyno,,,and he placed 4th in the most recent Engine Masters Challenge seen on ESPN,,,,,against all of the top engine builders in the country.

He uses trickflow on almost everything he builds. We just recently built an old school 406 (gen 1 to you guys) that originally are equipped with 24 degree heads,,,,we went with 18 degree Trickflows, single carb on gas and made over 600 hp on a conservative DTS dyno without trying too hard.
It's good stuff.

As well as they work on old school small blocks I can only assume they should make awsome power on an LS series engine as well,,,,since they are 13 degree heads, they should be killer.

Cool! Good Info! I am beginning to think the heads are worth the Coin! Have you used a set of Trick Flow heads on anything yet?

**Firebirdjones** · 12-23-2007, 06:52 PM

Originally Posted by 9t8z28

Cool! Good Info! I am beginning to think the heads are worth the Coin! Have you used a set of Trick Flow heads on anything yet?

Yes,,,,that was my 406 we built,,,but we are talking a gen 1 engine here,,,that would have had 24 degree heads. We used Trickflow 18 degree heads and thats as far as they go on a gen 1 I believe,,,,,,and they made great power. They also make a killer 24 degree head for the gen 1 for those that don't want to get into valvetrain issues. When using stock valve angles then AFR is hard to beat. I use smallish (305cc) AFR heads on my 454 (.030 over) and I believe even these heads have the valve angles rolled over a couple of degrees too,,,,but this is a single carb on pump gas motor with a hydraulic roller and made 638 hp,,,,these heads are also hard to beat.

In any event,,,,since an LS1, LS2, LS6, etc....all came with 15 degree heads to start with,,,,,(which is why they make power so easily) then the 13 degree heads should make power even easier, since it already has a clear advantage on paper,,,I would assume. Looking at what GM did with the LS7 and it's 12 degree heads only solidifies this reasoning.

I have seen a few LS engines here locally running these heads, I am unsure of power numbers and Mike doesn't build many LS engines to test these heads so I can't honestly say. But I like what I have seen from them so far on old school stuff.

**blackls1ta** · 12-24-2007, 04:51 AM

i talked to summit and they said they will still have the kit with rockers and pushrods after january but the price might be a little more,not much,so i think ill go with that kit in spring also.http://store.summitracing.com/partde...0&autoview=sku

**blackls1ta** · 12-24-2007, 04:53 AM

read at bottom where it says easy upgrades for ls1 includes everything

1969mach1 · 12-24-2007, 05:32 AM

Hey, i just read through the list in the summit catalog. It states "The horsepower experts at Trick Flow Specialties know a thing or two about combining the right components for maximum results. That's why these LS1 Top-End Engine Kits are the perfect way to get the power you whant. Each Dyno-tested kit features a pair of Tirck Flow CNC-ported LS1 cylinder heads (TFS-3060T001-C01), Trick Flow heat-treated chromemoly pushrods, and a matched Trick Flow camshaft, plus Harland Sharp roller rocker arms and GM Perfomance Parts gaskets and bolts. Each kit has a 460 ft.-lb. torque rating."

I think I'll send back the rockers I bought and move forward with this kit.

1969mach1 · 12-24-2007, 11:16 AM

what do yall think of these RHS heads?
http://www.racingheadservice.com/Inf...54210-05IS.pdf

**D_blaze** · 12-24-2007, 03:53 PM

Yeah hook me up with a link!

**JimmyGTO** · 12-26-2007, 07:48 AM

the hp rating for the trickflo heads, are they crank hp or rwhp?

**Firebirdjones** · 12-26-2007, 09:09 AM

Originally Posted by 1969mach1

Hey, i just read through the list in the summit catalog. It states "The horsepower experts at Trick Flow Specialties know a thing or two about combining the right components for maximum results. That's why these LS1 Top-End Engine Kits are the perfect way to get the power you whant. Each Dyno-tested kit features a pair of Tirck Flow CNC-ported LS1 cylinder heads (TFS-3060T001-C01), Trick Flow heat-treated chromemoly pushrods, and a matched Trick Flow camshaft, plus Harland Sharp roller rocker arms and GM Perfomance Parts gaskets and bolts. Each kit has a 460 ft.-lb. torque rating."

I think I'll send back the rockers I bought and move forward with this kit.

I agree with the matching camshaft statement,,,,once you start getting into changing valve angles and other variables,,,,off the shelf camshafts won't get the job done,,,,and custom grinds are the way to go,,,especially from the people that designed the heads,,,or a competant machine shop that has ran countless dyno sessions with various cam grinds,,,,or talking with a camshaft manufacture.

I have always went with custom ground camshafts, I very rarely ever grab something off the shelf anymore.

**rc74racer** · 12-26-2007, 09:43 AM

This kit seems kind of pricey to me. I'm not going to bash trick flow as I have never used their products and everything I've heard and read about them is extremely positive. Based on what I've heard I wouldn't hesitate to use their stuff if the price was right.

I also question what supporting mods they used to produce those numbers and I am assuming this is crank HP and not RWHP. I see in the add they recommend at least and Ls6 intake or fast 90. So did they use and ls6 or fast 90/90 set up to produce those numbers? If they went the fast route then the kit now becomes a 4200 kit in order to duplicate the numbers. I've seen people putting down numbers very close to those with cheaper kits. I'd love to see some real world results here so if any of you buy this kit please post dyno numbers after your tune.

**blackls1ta** · 12-27-2007, 01:48 AM

Originally Posted by JimmyGTO

the hp rating for the trickflo heads, are they crank hp or rwhp?

im guessing its crank hp but still good if you already have full exhaust and bolt ons.

1969mach1 · 12-28-2007, 05:53 AM

i would safly assume its crank hp. there are too many heads on the market to say "these are the best". MTI here in Houston has a 475hp combo that is $7500. and includes LT, lid, computer, custom grid cam, and re working the factory heads... seem like a lot of cash to me, but the do all the work and dyno tune it.
http://www.motorsporttech.com/fbody_engine01.asp

**SOMbitch** · 12-29-2007, 11:06 PM

I have been researching heads for the past couple months and am still on the fence whether to go budget (ported GM castings) or a proprietary casting like Trickflow, AFR or even Dart (little lower #'s but less $$ than TFS or AFR). I just can't decide whether it is worth the extra coin. I can tell you this: at low lift the TFS/AFR's flow much better and should provide signifigantly better low and midrange torque. Since I DD my car this is a big consideration with me. But on the other hand you can make a lot of this up with the proper stall. If coin was not a consideration I would have already made up my mind by now (and put the extra $$ into ARH headers). Damnit!!

**Firebirdjones** · 12-30-2007, 05:33 AM

Originally Posted by SOMbitch

I have been researching heads for the past couple months and am still on the fence whether to go budget (ported GM castings) or a proprietary casting like Trickflow, AFR or even Dart (little lower #'s but less $$ than TFS or AFR). I just can't decide whether it is worth the extra coin. I can tell you this: at low lift the TFS/AFR's flow much better and should provide signifigantly better low and midrange torque. Since I DD my car this is a big consideration with me. But on the other hand you can make a lot of this up with the proper stall. If coin was not a consideration I would have already made up my mind by now (and put the extra $$ into ARH headers). Damnit!!

Go with the best heads you can afford, you won't regret it in the end. Heads are the key to the engine making power,,,with the right camshaft you can have a killer engine. I went with AFR on one of my cars and couldn't be happier,,,,they had the best mid lift flow numbers,,,and also the most flow for the intake runner size they advertised compared to other heads with same intake runner. This is very important,,,it's best to have the most flow with the smallest intake runner possible,,,this promotes velocity,,,and very efficient head that will produce good throttle response and great power.

When comparing heads,,,,make sure they are of the same intake runner size,,,,this will tell you whether or not you are getting a good head. For example,,,a 200 CC intake runner that can flow 300 cfm at .600 lift is better than a head with a 225 CC intake runner that flows the same CFM at same lift. In this case the 200 CC head would be a no brainer. And AFR is one of the best at extracting the most from cylinder heads without going too big on the intake runner size. This of course given the fact that heads also have the same valve angles,,,,TFS has an advantage here,,,with 13 degree heads verses AFR 15 degree heads,,,,so TFS should also have a killer package.
There are alot of other ported heads on the market that can also flow 300 CFM or more,,,but the intake runner size is so big the engine would be a pig unless you have rather large cubic inches to take advantage of it.
Don't skimp on the heads.

1969mach1 · 12-30-2007, 06:15 AM

all my SBF motors i have ever built were with AFR 185 heads. in the SBF market they are the best, hands-down. Though a buddie was a hard core TrickFlow motor builder. Now with the LS1's you have valve angle, RHS has the best in valve angle, so i've seen so far.
Heads are the key! I think I'll stick with AFR...