2000 Grand Prix 3800 Part Throttle SURGE trans???

**rschap1** · 11-03-2011, 10:46 AM

Well, back to AZ...

Got a refund from Ebay for the cheap MAF sensor.

The last couple of days things have gotten a little worse.

The SES light has been intermitten. On for a day and a half, off for the next day or 2.

Yesterday and this morning the surge hit a little bit again.

AND for the first time since new sensor, I had the car idling for about 10 minutes while chit chatting with a neighbor. Car got warm and then idle speed increased.

It idled 500-600 rpms more than usual and when I went to pump the accelerator it stayed high and took 15-20 seconds to slow to normal. Kinda scary. It reved more than it should have, like a sticky gas pedal. Thinking that may have been 1st period of extended idle with new sensor it things went wacky.

Plan is to hit AZ again tonight, get scanned if light is still on, if same error P0171, I am going to take my refund and put it towards one of their refurbished Cardone models and try that. AGAIN fingers crossed! I will ask and price what they sell for scan tools too.

**rschap1** · 11-04-2011, 01:57 AM

Same code was shown, picked up their refurbished MAF sensor and saw all Actron scanners at Autozone.
There were 5 or 6 models from $59 to 299.
Didn't look to closely at the features tried to hurry through there.
$139 for the sensor and a $87 core charge...makes me wonder what they do to refurbish these...?
We'll see how it works when I install this evening. Guessing it would be best to unhook the battery cable, cross them, and then install the new sensor rather than just unplug the old and plug in the new like I did before. Start at the baseling...right?

**Cutlass** · 11-04-2011, 02:59 AM

You'd probably benefit most from the cheapest one which just reads and clears trouble codes.
Clearing the computer isn't a bad idea. I'm not positive disconnecting the battery will do it but it could/should.

**rschap1** · 11-04-2011, 03:08 AM

Thanks !

**Smittro** · 11-04-2011, 09:18 AM

Originally Posted by Cutlass

You'd probably benefit most from the cheapest one which just reads and clears trouble codes.
Clearing the computer isn't a bad idea. I'm not positive disconnecting the battery will do it but it could/should.

Nope, iirc once a code is logged, it will return untill corrected then cleared or a few driving cycles after the repair..

**rschap1** · 11-04-2011, 09:21 AM

I will keep that in mind and give it some time if need be.
Thanks for that too ! ! !

**Cutlass** · 11-04-2011, 04:21 PM

Originally Posted by Smittro

Nope, iirc once a code is logged, it will return untill corrected then cleared or a few driving cycles after the repair..

Yeah, I always use a scan tool to clear codes and reset fuel trims, so I'm not sure if disconnecting the battery resets either of those things anymore. Some DIY'ers swear by it, but I'm not sure how well it works.

**Smittro** · 11-05-2011, 06:11 AM

Originally Posted by Cutlass

Yeah, I always use a scan tool to clear codes and reset fuel trims, so I'm not sure if disconnecting the battery resets either of those things anymore. Some DIY'ers swear by it, but I'm not sure how well it works.

Yeah I've also heard about touching battery terminals together to clear codes before but never had the guts to try it..lol

I guess if it does work you could do an idle relearn..

I would be worried about shorting the PCM, for fear of electronic componets that could be holding a residual charge..

A couple winters ago when I had my 3800-II top end apart I had the PCM disconnected for a whole week and the misfire code was still there..

I had to force (flogged the throttle) it to throw a code in the first place for a SES light because under normal driving I had no light..

But as soon as I went back to normal driving the SES light would go out.

This lead me to think I had a bad head gasket starting or an intake gasket leak.. Turned into a real head scratcher..

After ~$1000 in new heads and a top end gasket set, and replacing a coil pack (which ended up being all that was wrong with it

).

It still showed an intermittent misfire code had been logged, even though the SES light had gone out..

Found this out after I got everthing back togther and running great again..

I ran it down to have it scanned one more time for peace of mind and like I was saying the code was logged..

So I had it cleared @ advance auto..

**Smittro** · 11-05-2011, 06:20 AM

I should add that the SES light for the intermittent misfire was blinking and not steady on..

Prior to that when my cat died, I had a steady SES light..

After replacing the cat, and a few driving cycles it went out and the code cleared showing no logging of the issue..

Sorry forgot to mention that..

**rschap1** · 11-07-2011, 02:08 AM

The way the thing runs after pulling the battery cables and crossing them it seems like it must adjust or remove the trims, or so I guess. It sure runs good right afterwards. Maybe the codes stay shown but the trims get removed...?? I am a couple days into my Autozone Cardone sensor. Runs good again and seems OK. Time will tell. I did remove and cross the battery cables. No SES light, no surge, and running good. Some kinda noise the wife noticed the other day, sounded like something rubbing on the tire when turning hard right...think I may have misplaced a plastic splash shield or something I dropped a little 5/16" socket when replacing the battery cables and had to feel around under the crank pulleys. Hoping that is something simple like that anyways. Fingers crossed again ! ! !

**rschap1** · 08-09-2012, 02:07 AM

Well...

MAF sensor held up since my last post there...
Now surge is back.
I pulled the sensor yesterday to give it a shot of MAF sensor cleaner and it looks like the filler/sealer for the solid state circuitry was melted and oozing out of the sensor.
Like the rest of the US, we had a month of record high temps. A week ago I was caught in a traffic jam and the car got as hot as it had seen in years. Gage just read around 205 so it didn't over heat, but I am thinking it cooked the sensors insides right out of it...

Anyways, I have a new one on it's way being shipped.
Seeing the aluminum backside of the sensor and the machined surface it mounts to makes me wonder if there is supposed to any "grease" for heat transfer there???
My old Ford 5.0's ignition modules used to need some kinda heat transfer die-electric grease between their back sides and the distributor body they mounted to.
Should the MAF sensor have anything like this smeared on it before installed???

THANKS ! ! !

**Smittro** · 08-09-2012, 07:12 AM

Could'nt hurt.. Just don't go nuts with it,, a little is okay.

This "cleaner" you spoke of using,, what is it,, is/was it CRC, or is it some other type of cleaner?

On the heating up part, coolant could need topped off, may need a thermostat, and/or coolant system flush,
worst case water pump is showing wear.

Did you go with and OEM MAF or after market?

**rschap1** · 08-09-2012, 07:18 AM

Yep. It was the CRC brand cleaner.
Tried this before I replaced the sensor a little less than a year ago.
Still had the rest of the can in the garage.
ph_26650.jpg

I was a little low on coolant, you are correct. Actually had the light come on yesterday morning for the first time ever. It is also time for a flush and refil again too. Plan is to do it this fall.
I went with an aftermarket MAF sensor due to cost. Planing on selling the car within a couple months, so trying to save the $$.

THANKS !!!