Camaro gets knocked off it's throne....

[Firebirdjones]

not really... torque plays a major roll...

Don't need torque to do it,,,,that's what they make more rear gear for

[Firebirdjones]

More specifically, it's an indicator of power/weight ratio. The car with the better ratio is technically the faster car. You take two cars with the same trap speed and run them side by side from a roll to eliminate traction issues, they should be door to door the whole time.

Yep it is also an indicator of power to weight ratio if you are trying to compare one car to another in an apples to apples scenario.

I was trying to explain how mph is related to potential ET. You can take a 4,000 lbs. car running 102 mph or a 3,000 lbs. car running 102 mph.
Both are equally capable of running 12's, but it's obvious the heavier car is making the most power even though they both MPH the same. It has more weight to move.

Weight is such an important factor to take into consideration. So many people try to compare their car to others, and think they should be running the same, not knowing what either car weighs. Doesn't work.

[Mike0202]

The 2011 gt has variable valve timing, it has v-tech yo, as do most performance DOHC engines these days.

thats wut im talkin bout



yo

[Too Fast]

Didn't read this whole thread, only watched the 2 videos at the top. All I can say is finally Ford has a more than worthy contender, after 20+ years. Too bad there is no Pontiac to kill the 'stang.

[Superluminal]

Yep it is also an indicator of power to weight ratio if you are trying to compare one car to another in an apples to apples scenario.

I was trying to explain how mph is related to potential ET. You can take a 4,000 lbs. car running 102 mph or a 3,000 lbs. car running 102 mph.
Both are equally capable of running 12's, but it's obvious the heavier car is making the most power even though they both MPH the same. It has more weight to move.

Weight is such an important factor to take into consideration. So many people try to compare their car to others, and think they should be running the same, not knowing what either car weighs. Doesn't work.

Every 100lbs. is a little over a tenth off your 1/4 mile time. Also, taking off rotational mass such as using a aluminum driveshaft and light weight wheels drastically effects your times.

We did an experiment on my buddies S14, way way back in the day. He was running around a 14.2@98mph with an SR20DET, a couple bolt ons, and a full weight car. The next track event he had converted his chassis into a race car, but had not gotten to the motor yet. We stripped off about 425lbs. of dead weight, and my friend let him borrow some Welds for his wheels. Needless to say, with nothing else done to his engine, he dropped to a 13.5@103mph with a crappier track prep the previous event, and the car having a couple issues.

If you want to get the most out of your car weight is key. Like you said, this is also why there is a wide variance in times between many people with similar setups. Some people like to pig out their cars and carry everything with them and have every option available, while others ride light.

[Z28Thunder]

Every 100lbs. is a little over a tenth off your 1/4 mile time. Also, taking off rotational mass such as using a aluminum driveshaft and light weight wheels drastically effects your times.

We did an experiment on my buddies S14, way way back in the day. He was running around a 14.2@98mph with an SR20DET, a couple bolt ons, and a full weight car. The next track event he had converted his chassis into a race car, but had not gotten to the motor yet. We stripped off about 425lbs. of dead weight, and my friend let him borrow some Welds for his wheels. Needless to say, with nothing else done to his engine, he dropped to a 13.5@103mph with a crappier track prep the previous event, and the car having a couple issues.

If you want to get the most out of your car weight is key. Like you said, this is also why there is a wide variance in times between many people with similar setups. Some people like to pig out their cars and carry everything with them and have every option available, while others ride light.

I want the most out of my car. But I also like my after market stereo. A/C is a must in this state 100 + degrees during summer. And with the ice and snow we get during the winter you need the heaters. I like the fact it is full weight with leather and all the goodies (yes the Sunoco hood dropped some weight). Heck I added weight the stereo and the dynamat. I think it is more of a challenge to get a full weight car to run the same time as cars minus weight. But we are both talking about opinions. Cars with gutted interiors are race cars to me. I enjoy the fact that all I do is switch to skinnies and slicks and crank off 11.5's.

[Superluminal]

I want the most out of my car. But I also like my after market stereo. A/C is a must in this state 100 + degrees during summer. And with the ice and snow we get during the winter you need the heaters. I like the fact it is full weight with leather and all the goodies (yes the Sunoco hood dropped some weight). Heck I added weight the stereo and the dynamat. I think it is more of a challenge to get a full weight car to run the same time as cars minus weight. But we are both talking about opinions. Cars with gutted interiors are race cars to me. I enjoy the fact that all I do is switch to skinnies and slicks and crank off 11.5's.

True, but some of us have purpose built cars. They are not daily drivers (all though they are perfectly capable of being one) and we take them out only when we want to have fun and stomp on the track. I myself drive a Nissan Sentra with all the options for my daily. I also had 2 10s 240SX for fun (one SR powered, one LS1 powered). These were purpose built cars, that I didn't drive everyday. So A/C, heat, stereo, all that nonsense is not required to go fast. They are/were both however, 100% streetable, just no creature comforts. When I'm at the track or on the street with these cars, the only thing that matters is what happens when I put my foot down.

[Mike0202]

Didn't read this whole thread, only watched the 2 videos at the top. All I can say is finally Ford has a more than worthy contender, after 20+ years. Too bad there is no Pontiac to kill the 'stang.

Im glad GM didnt built a heavy, ugly firebird. No way they could beat the looks of the 4th gens.

[bobodog]

Im glad GM didnt built a heavy, ugly firebird. No way they could beat the looks of the 4th gens.

did they have any ideas what the 2003-4 firebirds/camaros were gonna be before they found out they were gonna stop production or did they already know way before hand? im just curious what they would have looked like.

[Superluminal]

did they have any ideas what the 2003-4 firebirds/camaros were gonna be before they found out they were gonna stop production or did they already know way before hand? im just curious what they would have looked like.

[MrMasterCraft]

That's ugly

[9t8z28]

The guy in this vid is an idiot. He bitches about the stupidest things, like the shifter and steering wheel are to big!! WTF? And the windows are small?! I just got a chance to put a ton of miles on a 2010 Camaro SS M6 and it was awesome! I wasn't crazy about the dash at first but it grew on me. Inside looking out, it feels like your driving a car with a chopped roof. It handles and rides great and is very comfortable and with a Pypes cat-back exhaust, it sounds badass!

Oh, and I have driven the S197's and Challengers alot as well. The 05-09 GT's handle like shit and the Challengers are tanks and feel like they'll topple over and are slow.

It seems like the only real good thing about the 2010 GT is the suspension, the 5.0 is not that impressive since it will be an expensive car to modify.

[Z28Thunder]

True, but some of us have purpose built cars. They are not daily drivers (all though they are perfectly capable of being one) and we take them out only when we want to have fun and stomp on the track. I myself drive a Nissan Sentra with all the options for my daily. I also had 2 10s 240SX for fun (one SR powered, one LS1 powered). These were purpose built cars, that I didn't drive everyday. So A/C, heat, stereo, all that nonsense is not required to go fast. They are/were both however, 100% streetable, just no creature comforts. When I'm at the track or on the street with these cars, the only thing that matters is what happens when I put my foot down.

Mine is purpose built. I also do not DD mine. But when driven during the summers here it can get sweltering hot. I am faster than alot but by no means anywhere near the fastest. And yes I run the skinnies and slick on the streets.

[MrMasterCraft]

Mine is purpose built. I also do not DD mine. But when driven during the summers here it can get sweltering hot. I am faster than alot but by no means anywhere near the fastest. And yes I run the skinnies and slick on the streets.

hell yeah

[10spokess]

The guy in this vid is an idiot. He bitches about the stupidest things, like the shifter and steering wheel are to big!! WTF? And the windows are small?! I just got a chance to put a ton of miles on a 2010 Camaro SS M6 and it was awesome! I wasn't crazy about the dash at first but it grew on me. Inside looking out, it feels like your driving a car with a chopped roof. It handles and rides great and is very comfortable and with a Pypes cat-back exhaust, it sounds badass!

Oh, and I have driven the S197's and Challengers alot as well. The 05-09 GT's handle like shit and the Challengers are tanks and feel like they'll topple over and are slow.

It seems like the only real good thing about the 2010 GT is the suspension, the 5.0 is not that impressive since it will be an expensive car to modify.

magazines have always bashed the camaro they are mustang fan boys

[justinmc978]

GOD NO. AAAAAAAAAHHHGGGGG MY EYEESSS FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF-

[justinmc978]

did they have any ideas what the 2003-4 firebirds/camaros were gonna be before they found out they were gonna stop production or did they already know way before hand? im just curious what they would have looked like.

to correctly answer your question.. yes there was a concept built by GMs Performance Division, it is the only 2003 Trans Am, and was suppossed to have minor styling cues for the next generation, if there was one..




edit: there was also a 2003 GMPP Camaro as well, but it was more of a drag car than a show car

[BLKCLOUD]

GM almost killed the F-body in 1998. It received a "stay of execution" till 2002. By that time, the chassis was 10 years old (and not much different from the 1982 underpinnings). There was never a serious effort to build a 2003+ F-body.

Of couse, the Fox chassis that the Mustang was built upon stayed around (abiet in highly modified form) for some 26 years.....

[Mike0202]

GM almost killed the F-body in 1998. It received a "stay of execution" till 2002. By that time, the chassis was 10 years old (and not much different from the 1982 underpinnings). There was never a serious effort to build a 2003+ F-body.

Of couse, the Fox chassis that the Mustang was built upon stayed around (abiet in highly modified form) for some 26 years.....

Some kid with an 86 bird was tryin to tell me it would outhandle my ls1/ws6. Is there any truth to this?

[justinmc978]

Some kid with an 86 bird was tryin to tell me it would outhandle my ls1/ws6. Is there any truth to this?

if he gutted it/did some serious weight reduction. unlikely.