'03 Celica is calling me out...

**Turbohatch** · 02-13-2010, 12:35 PM

Originally Posted by Wesman

You've raced many Trans Ams (its two words) and Camaros in your Civic and CRX and never had any of them give you the slightest problem??

Were these third generation cars equipped with the Iron Duke 2.5 perhaps??

You act as if there are no 10 or 11 second F-bodys running around. There are tons of guys on this site and others that would destroy both of your cars, I don't know why import kids always think they are invincible. There are cars here that are running 11's with just bolt ons and a converter. Please.

Oh where to begin? im far from a "import kid", i probably have children your age. as for destroying both of my cars I never claimed that i was the fastest guy on earth, your making assumptions that have no merit. the OP clearly stated his cars level of performance and he also clearly stated he had no idea what was done to the celica thus my statement that looks can be deceiving and thus my story relating to some races i have had with cars just like his. please dont make the mistake of assuming me a fool you will be greatly out witted and to make sure your clear i no longer own the crx or civic i currently only have a datsun and the wifes mini van and most anything can beat her van in a heads up but if you ever want to bracket race dont count the mini van out

also you would be a fool to blanket all imports and import owners in the same category. my civic wasnt very good from a dig but from a roll it could walk 9 second rwd cars with ease and allot of bikes. judging from the fact you have 2 infractions and from reading previous post of yours i can assume that most of this will be lost with you so rather then embarrass you any further i will now await your response with baited breath.

**MrMasterCraft** · 02-13-2010, 01:31 PM

Turbohatch - It's better just to not even respond to words like those. I know that I don't need to tell you anything but close-minded people will never change, no matter the number of detailed facts you bring to the table. I personally have little interest in imports, but they're vehicles that go down the road, so I definately follow up with them, and keep an open mind when one is brought into conversation. The mods will eventually close this thread...

**1986camarojoe** · 02-13-2010, 04:42 PM

Im not close minded I simply said this thread has nothing to do with hondas.. Yes there are fast imports but I would think theyd act more like "turbohatch" most people with fast cars respect other peoples taste in vehicles whether they like it or not. If this kid had a 10 second celica I highly doubt he'd be this big of an idiot. The fact is a celica is slow as shit we can all agree and if we assume its stock the LS1 does destroy it and if he backs out of his own bet it probably is stock... and if he was playing dumb trying to hustle the OP to win $500 he would probably get his ass kicked. I agree with wesman for every 1 import thats fast theres 1000 dumbass kids with 16 second pieces of shit with fart pipes.

**Turbohatch** · 02-13-2010, 04:49 PM

Originally Posted by 1986camarojoe

Im not close minded I simply said this thread has nothing to do with hondas.. Yes there are fast imports but I would think theyd act more like "turbohatch" most people with fast cars respect other peoples taste in vehicles whether they like it or not. If this kid had a 10 second celica I highly doubt he'd be this big of an idiot. The fact is a celica is slow as shit we can all agree and if we assume its stock the LS1 does destroy it and if he backs out of his own bet it probably is stock... and if he was playing dumb trying to hustle the OP to win $500 he would probably get his ass kicked. I agree with wesman for every 1 import thats fast theres 1000 dumbass kids with 16 second pieces of shit with fart pipes.

i agree the odds are its slow, but you must also agree nothing sucks more then being sure of a race only to get whooped hard, so its wise to not base any possible race on odds alone. and your right this thread shouldnt be about anything but the cars in question however when the subject shifted from celica to imports as a blanket statement the window was left open for some non celica comments. again the OP would be better off doing research, asking questions even gathering data on a covert nature rather then coming to a forum where non of us know either car personally and asking us who will win. bottom line is stock for stock its not even a race the ls1 has all the advantages if the celica is a sleeper then there is no way to tell with out racing, but the fact he backed out and seems like a kid who talks allot the betting mans bet is its not a fast celica.

**MrMasterCraft** · 02-13-2010, 05:31 PM

I was referring to Wesman

**Wesman** · 02-13-2010, 06:18 PM

Originally Posted by Turbohatch

Oh where to begin? im far from a "import kid", i probably have children your age. as for destroying both of my cars I never claimed that i was the fastest guy on earth, your making assumptions that have no merit. the OP clearly stated his cars level of performance and he also clearly stated he had no idea what was done to the celica thus my statement that looks can be deceiving and thus my story relating to some races i have had with cars just like his. please dont make the mistake of assuming me a fool you will be greatly out witted and to make sure your clear i no longer own the crx or civic i currently only have a datsun and the wifes mini van and most anything can beat her van in a heads up but if you ever want to bracket race dont count the mini van out

also you would be a fool to blanket all imports and import owners in the same category. my civic wasnt very good from a dig but from a roll it could walk 9 second rwd cars with ease and allot of bikes. judging from the fact you have 2 infractions and from reading previous post of yours i can assume that most of this will be lost with you so rather then embarrass you any further i will now await your response with baited breath.

What do you want me to say?? You are on here trying to stick up for Hondas. All I said was you sound very cocky making statements about beating Camaros and T/A's like they are no competition.

Its pretty obvious that you are quite biased towards imports. And saying your high 10 second Honda could "walk" 9 second RWD cars "with ease" from a roll means nothing. Between the crappy powerband and crappy gear ratios, I can't see your Civic beating up on any 9 second RWD cars, period. Hell, a bone stock ZR1 is a low 11 second car, and it would absolutely destroy either of your Hondas on the highway.

**Superluminal** · 02-13-2010, 06:32 PM

Originally Posted by Wesman

What do you want me to say?? You are on here trying to stick up for Hondas. All I said was you sound very cocky making statements about beating Camaros and T/A's like they are no competition.

Its pretty obvious that you are quite biased towards imports. And saying your high 10 second Honda could "walk" 9 second RWD cars "with ease" from a roll means nothing. Between the crappy powerband and crappy gear ratios, I can't see your Civic beating up on any 9 second RWD cars, period. Hell, a bone stock ZR1 is a low 11 second car, and it would absolutely destroy either of your Hondas on the highway.

Yeah, but you have to lay out $100+k to get that amazing piece of machinery. You can easily go faster in imports and other domestics for much much less.

**Wesman** · 02-13-2010, 06:51 PM

Originally Posted by Superluminal

Yeah, but you have to lay out $100+k to get that amazing piece of machinery. You can easily go faster in imports and other domestics for much much less.

I know. He just made a reference to "walking 9 second RWD cars with ease". It was simply an example, because talk like that is nonsense.

**wooddaniel** · 02-13-2010, 10:18 PM

I dont know what I would do if I couldnt go to LS1.com and read awesomeness like this thread... I would lose my will to live probably.

**Turbohatch** · 02-14-2010, 08:31 AM

Originally Posted by Wesman

I know. He just made a reference to "walking 9 second RWD cars with ease". It was simply an example, because talk like that is nonsense.

ok how many MPH does it take to walk some one? 3 or 4 mph is a nice steady walk in any race i have ever been in heck at 2 mph your pullling away , if your doing 55 and im doing 59 i am walking away from you with ease. ok now whats the typical MPH of a street legal camaro or trans am that can dip in the high 9s? go on do the research i will wait..... ok got that number? ok good so now you know that a good decent range is 128-133 on average (some a little lower some a little higher) . ok my civic trapped a best of 138 on pump gas and 143 on 110

so as you see from a roll where traction is not a issue i was indeed able to walk away from 9 second cars with ease and little effort even though from a dig my car was only able to muster a best of 10.7 granted my local track is not the best for prep but thats a different story for another time. i am not biased toward any one sort of car as i clearly stated, what i am biased toward is honest and accurate data not personal interest as most seem to be, most guys will claim that a certain brand is best only due to thats what they own or what they was told by some one they respected. I have no such blindfold on and it allows me to see that there are many many cars with great potential regardless of make and model. if you continue to claim that my data is "nonsense" or flawed i must forewarn you yet again you will only end up looking the fool.

**MrMasterCraft** · 02-14-2010, 08:49 AM

Originally Posted by Turbohatch

ok how many MPH does it take to walk some one? 3 or 4 mph is a nice steady walk in any race i have ever been in heck at 2 mph your pullling away , if your doing 55 and im doing 59 i am walking away from you with ease. ok now whats the typical MPH of a street legal camaro or trans am that can dip in the high 9s? go on do the research i will wait..... ok got that number? ok good so now you know that a good decent range is 128-133 on average (some a little lower some a little higher) . ok my civic trapped 138 on pump gas and 143 on 110

so as you see from a roll where traction is not a issue i was indeed able to walk away from 9 second cars with ease and little effort. i am not biased toward any one sort of car as i clearly stated, what i am biased toward is honest and accurate data not personal interest as most seem to be, most guys will claim that a certain brand is best only due to thats what they own or what they was told by some one they respected. I have no such blindfold on and it allows me to see that there are many many cars with great potential regardless of make and model. if you continue to claim that my data is "nonsense" or flawed i must forewarn you yet again you will only end up looking the fool.

Man, this guys good

**MrMasterCraft** · 02-14-2010, 08:59 AM

Turbohatch - So I've got a couple questions... hopefully we can shed some light on this topic and keep members from bashing on here. What do you prefer more when it comes to each respective drivetrain setup? I, myself, do like the sound and seemingly "non-stop" pull that a turbo provides, and it's known that it takes less money and time to do it in a honda (generally speaking). I respect that, and in riding with my buddies I must say, I've had some good times and even better stories

But I will say, that I do prefer a near stock LS1 with I/E/Stall/Gear/Tire and giving it hell off the line. IMHO, it's the most fun you can with your clothes on (out of the water). Again, this is my own personal preference.

We all know how to do the math when it comes to MPH and ETs. No need to elaborate on this one. I will just say that I haven't known many honda guys that have been able to dead-hook (or close to it for that matter), which presents a disguise in itself, even IF the opposing racer knows the setup. So long as nobody knows the ET or MPH, it's pretty much a guessing game. (And I do like that

). So you're building a Datsun with an LS1 setup eh? Why the change up? Since the mods haven't closed this, what do you like most about each powertrain setup? Just trying to make a little conversation

**Wesman** · 02-14-2010, 10:11 AM

Originally Posted by Turbohatch

ok how many MPH does it take to walk some one? 3 or 4 mph is a nice steady walk in any race i have ever been in heck at 2 mph your pullling away , if your doing 55 and im doing 59 i am walking away from you with ease. ok now whats the typical MPH of a street legal camaro or trans am that can dip in the high 9s? go on do the research i will wait..... ok got that number? ok good so now you know that a good decent range is 128-133 on average (some a little lower some a little higher) . ok my civic trapped a best of 138 on pump gas and 143 on 110

so as you see from a roll where traction is not a issue i was indeed able to walk away from 9 second cars with ease and little effort even though from a dig my car was only able to muster a best of 10.7 granted my local track is not the best for prep but thats a different story for another time. i am not biased toward any one sort of car as i clearly stated, what i am biased toward is honest and accurate data not personal interest as most seem to be, most guys will claim that a certain brand is best only due to thats what they own or what they was told by some one they respected. I have no such blindfold on and it allows me to see that there are many many cars with great potential regardless of make and model. if you continue to claim that my data is "nonsense" or flawed i must forewarn you yet again you will only end up looking the fool.

Calm down. You aren't making anyone look like a fool talking about your Honda Civic. Please.

What was the top speed of your car?? With the extremely short gearing in Honda transmissions and the tiny tires you were running, I can imagine you were probably topped out in 5th at those kinds of speeds.

**Superluminal** · 02-14-2010, 10:33 AM

Originally Posted by Wesman

Calm down. You aren't making anyone look like a fool talking about your Honda Civic. Please.

What was the top speed of your car?? With the extremely short gearing in Honda transmissions and the tiny tires you were running, I can imagine you were probably topped out in 5th at those kinds of speeds.

You know, you can put in a different final drive. Granted it's easier to do in a RWD car, but they do make custom final drives and gearing for FWD cars as well, and there are some factory selections to choose from. Hell, on my import I could choose anywhere from 4.40s down to 3.30s and everywhere in between. I've seen several Honda guys running the 5 speed RSX transmission with a tall final drive. They were going through the traps in 3rd gear at about 100mph. It's not impossible.

**Speed_kills_WS6** · 02-14-2010, 02:27 PM

Id love to see someone in a Honda walk my GSXR1000 down the interstate. Not gonna happen...

**01ws6er** · 02-14-2010, 02:54 PM

Originally Posted by Speed_kills_WS6

Id love to see someone in a Honda walk my GSXR1000 down the interstate. Not gonna happen...

this i would love to see as well

**MrMasterCraft** · 02-14-2010, 04:30 PM

**Turbohatch** · 02-14-2010, 07:11 PM

Originally Posted by Wesman

Calm down. You aren't making anyone look like a fool talking about your Honda Civic. Please.

What was the top speed of your car?? With the extremely short gearing in Honda transmissions and the tiny tires you were running, I can imagine you were probably topped out in 5th at those kinds of speeds.

the shift light for 5th would come on just at the traps, final drive was stock GSR 4.40 and tire size was a 24.5 i never ran 5th up to red line so top speed is hard to judge i am always nervous about pushing my luck even on empty long stretches of road, 20 years ago i would have probably pushed it but i am not as ballsy any more. as for the gear ratio to mph with 24.5s it was close to as follows. this was with a 9000 rpm shift point, however my revlimiter was set at 9500 so i could have wound out more but it wasnt really pulling much after 9k.

1. 46
2. 78
3. 109
4. 144
5. 189

**Turbohatch** · 02-14-2010, 07:26 PM

Originally Posted by Speed_kills_WS6

Id love to see someone in a Honda walk my GSXR1000 down the interstate. Not gonna happen...

it could happen in many cars not just a honda my friend. but yes it can happen. ever see a volvo wagon walk a 04 yamaha R1 from about 150 mph up? I have

here is how you can easily figure out what can potentially walk you from a high MPH roll, look at your trap speed and compare it to the car your going to race, dont pay attention to ET just MPH and if your MPH is higher you would more then likely win, if not then yes you could get walked away from. there are many cars , hondas, camaros, buicks, the list goes on of cars that can trap higher then a stock or even bolt on 1000 cc GSXR most of the decent GSXRs i have seen run can trap between 140 and 150 as a good average, again some higher some lower, lets say yours is on the higher end due to mods and your a awesome rider, there are still street legal hondas that are trapping over 150

and other cars as well including camaros and corvettes. are there as many hondas on the highway that can trap that high as there are GSXR's? nope not even close so the odds are slim so dont say "it aint going to happen" instead be truthful and say the chances are slim that it will happen. since this thread is about a celica thats made by toyota I must share a video of Ryans street legal daily driven supra, Ryan is pretty well known for his skill with these supras. any way we have gotton this debate pretty far off course but i am really enjoying providing you guys with data to shed some light on topics you seem to need educated on a little better, so why dont we start a thread dedicated to just this debate and get this guys back on course, any way with out further ado here is a very quick toyota .[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cUsAQSGnelk[/ame]

**98Z28CamaroJG** · 02-15-2010, 10:07 AM

Turbohatch...Thank God and Welcome to this forum. It is very refreshing having someone with such experience and hard facts put input into threads. Enough of the petty "I HATE IMPORTS" "I HATE MUSCLE" hopefully you're presence will dispell the bias and widen our horizons. Can't wait to read more posts from you