sorry to break the news
but its too big for any daily driven ls1 and will not be usable even with full bolt ons....
smaller cams dont make numbers but they can and 80% of the time will out run a over sized cam
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sorry to break the news
but its too big for any daily driven ls1 and will not be usable even with full bolt ons....
smaller cams dont make numbers but they can and 80% of the time will out run a over sized cam
i dont get it.........
my friend has an ms4 in his bird, drives fine on the street. i think its all in thetune my friend
my good friend dd's his MS3 no issues at all, im confused with what your saying
I dd my ms3 T/A and no complaints here. Dido on the tune part
I think he hit post thread instead of post reply
no im tired of seeing ppl asking about them with a stocvk car and think its bad ass to have a cam that size
it does not work as well as a smaller cam..
it may make more hp but @ ungodly rpm and most fo the guys asking about them have a hand held tuners and a k&n drop in
.... my point is ppl need to look at smaller cams and they will be happer then they would with BIG UGLY STICK
the cam i have makes 6 more hp then stock
and u picked up over 1/2 sec and 5 mph at the strip i went from 12.9s to 12.3s and from 109 -114
thats my point
Well the ms3 power band is 3 or 4 grand to 7 grand. And if I remember correctly that's where most drag races take place in. Plus mine has pretty good street manors as well so it's not that bad
This makes absolutely zero sense. Are you old enough to drive? :think: :haha:Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbirdbrain89
manors = landed estates; manners = ways of social interaction.Quote:
Originally Posted by FBracing1222
The dictionary is your friend... But I know what you mean :zoom:
I am sry my spelin ain't so great (this I ment to do)
im still lost, people look into bigger cams to make more power. a cam swap that grants 6hp over stock isnt even worth the time to swap IMO.Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbirdbrain89
a cam swap seems like kind of alot of work to go through for only 6HP. why did you decide to go with this perticular cam? (not meaning to be an ass, I'm just curious)Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbirdbrain89
I have a large cam going in my car in the next few weeks. Yes I did look at all of the "smaller" cams. But for the direction I want to take the car the smaller cam in the long run would end up getting pulled quickly for a larger one. For me I don't mind loosing a lot of street-ability. Im perfectly fine with cruising around town and then when I get to the track launching at over 4k IN MY POWER BAND!
So to the original poster the larger cams serve a purpose!
wow... are you ever wrong...Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbirdbrain89
+1.Quote:
Originally Posted by Spaz
Especially with full bolt ons...
just to clear another thing up incase some one reads this thread and believes the OP... larger cams require different ratio rear gears as well as a tune...
Yes you are correct and don't forget the high lift springs and a large stall for us automatic peopleQuote:
Originally Posted by Spaz
:yup:Quote:
Originally Posted by 02Sweet
There's a reason big cams like the TREX and the MS3 are all over LS1Techs top 10 fastest cam only list.
What are you talking about Black Bird Brain? I drove around a MS4 for 6 months with a takeout 2.73 rearend in it. It would pull uphill from 35mph to 45mph with a 3200 stall in it without surging around town. A MS4 camshaft that is tuned correctly has a nice fat wide torque curve. Plenty enough to smoke the tires taking off and plenty enough to move around a heavy car after it locks the convertor at 45mph.Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbirdbrain89
ohhhh blackbirdbrain wont you just answer our questons?!?
i'll trade you my stock LS6 cam for your MS3... :D
iv been busy working on other cars not just srfing the forums sorry.
my car has a nine inch with 3.89 gears.. t56 built, long tubes hot cam, on junk tires and some tune work and runs
12.39 @114.56 with a 2.01 60 ft time
if any one wants to say i dont have a clue what im talking about then o well
but for the books my car is not set up as a drag car its more of a street racing car
and i have raced more then a few big cam cars and walked all over them
ill let u guys with ur big cams see what times i can run when i get a new set of gears to go with my new slicks,
i dont think that anyone is doubting your knowledge or ect, but if you run a big cam and your tune is spot on then the cam should be able to beat a smaller cam.
Ok so your saying that with my "large" cam your 12.39 will be faster than me? I will be going to the track at the end of May if not early June. I will have the following:Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbirdbrain89
LARGE cam
Full exhaust with CHEAPO EBAY HEADERS!
4k stall
used mt et streets
3.42 gears
Just curious? Do you think I will be slower than mid 12s?
......my cam is over 240/240
I just don't understand your argument. I have looked at cams for a long time. I understand that the cam I picked is not a d/d friendly cam. It will be a dog down low, SO WHAT! It will rip down the track when I want it to.
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbirdbrain89
i'm sorry but if the large cam car is setup right you're not going to be walking him...
:wall:Quote:
Originally Posted by Spaz
jeubs... i'm yelling at coworkers and messing up my typing...
LOL Yell spaz Yell!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Spaz
Getting the car inspected on thursday then UPGRADE TIME!!! Woot Woot:woot2:
Quote:
Originally Posted by 02Sweet
at the track ull walk all over me due to the fact that im running a T56...
if u wanna play i have a 700r4 i can toss in my car just for some numbers if u want. hell if im doing that much ill toss my stock 10 bolt back in with a set of 4.11s
that matter at hand is im trying to get the point across that a huge cam is not going to make the most driveable car and some times will get waked by a smaller camed car
and the ms3 is a comp grind the texes speed took and called it there own.
ask rk ws6 he is running on same set up as me but he has 4.11s and tuned by frost
where im tuned by myself and run a hot cam and ive always ran a better time then him on the street and at the track till i just put over sized tires on my car (27.5x11x17s) killed my trap speed
I have to disagree with you. Running a big cam will not make a car sacrifice driveability but if your tune is not spot on then nomatter what cam you run the drive will be terrible. My good friend has an amazing tune on his ms3 and his car runs 100x better than my other friends car with a 228r in it
I think blackbirdbrain89 suffers from "cam-envy" :itsok:
My cam is smaller then the MS3 but bigger then quite a bit of cams and my car hauls ass :dunno:
I understand your point with "smaller" cams walking the larger ones. But you failed to mention in your original post that it matters about setup and tune.Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbirdbrain89
Yes you will be able to walk my car prior to tuning you are correct.
Yes you will be able to walk my car if I left the 2.73 gears in it
Yes you will be able to walk my car if i left the stock stall in it
BUT I AM NOT!
About walking cars on the street I personally don't care if someone is faster on the street than me. I only care about the track or the back of an industrial park. I prefer running my car all out in controlled areas. Im not trying to bash someone who does street racing...just saying that I personally don't like running my car HARD on the street. (PA roads suck never know when a pot hole is in the middle of the road)
The Hotcam don't walk anybody.
I have the ms4 with 4:10s full bolt ons and a great tune. My car is a 6 speed and it drives like stock until I get on it...so what are you talking about?
I agree 100%... Heck I am old school back when I put the cam in my car they did not have a magic stick period. At that time the 231/237 was BIG... :lmao:.... But I have to give the OP this... The thread is titled "ms3 AND STOCK LS1's... If we are talking a stock LS1 nothing else done to it BUT the ms3 he has a point. Now nobody builds an all STOCK cam only (NOTHING BUT THE CAM) car. When I went 231/237 the stall was swaped to 4000 and the stock 2.73's were out for 3.73's..... Heck I was not stock when I put the cam in, 3500 stall and headers.. But the small cam would not have walked it. Then again I was not STOCK.... I would think a 231/237 cam being the only mod to my LS1 would have sucked..Quote:
Originally Posted by Spaz
I'm in the process of adding LS6 P&P heads and an MS3 in my M6. I didn;t know this would make it slower.:cry2: I'm so mad at myself for not doing more than a year of research.
:lmao::bravo::burnout:
lol I was running a fricken ms4 on pretty stock motor and it did fine on the street for me
ms3 works fine for me on the street, BUT i did see him run a 12.39 at the track. i also ran that day an ran a 12.6 @ 115mph, 60ft was 2.312. now i have the stock 10 bolt with 3.42 an bald tires....... take that how u want it but i kinda get what he is trying to say here.... but i love my LOPE!!! :true:
Your sixty foot time sucks.Get some slicks and you would have easily beat his 12.39.Quote:
Originally Posted by 02_slp_ss
Streetable is in the eye's of the beholder.
237/242 at .050 isn't really all that big. It even comes standard with 112 lsa, or that could be spread to 113 or 114.
Looks like a middle of the road cam to me.
Get up into the 260's at .050 on a 106-108 and then we're talkin ;)
Seriously though, how was this even started?? Everyones tollerance level is different.
i need a 12 bolt if i put slicks on lol but yea id like to be in the loe 12s by the end of the summerQuote:
Originally Posted by importhater81
:lol: at this thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by tatertot91
:chuckles: Ya that's what I'm thinking. GM put cams with more duration than that in factory production cars, we drove them everyday back then :shrug:
These damn kids these days. Afraid of vibrating their latte's out of the cup holder with a big cam.:jerkit:Quote:
Originally Posted by Firebirdjones
:lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by MrKid
hey i love my cam haha
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrKid
:thumbup:
:lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by MrKid
yea a bigger cam will always be better power wise, just got to have the right set up rear, converter, tune to get the great times.
dont see y u r l0st ms3 n 4 make great p0wer i g0t a 99 ss m6 full b0lt 0n car with a ms3 i drive it al0t n0 issues at all. tune is key . pe0ple 0n a budget want t0 get the m0st 4 what they pay 4.my car is sick fast 0n the street killed s0me pretty fast cars. u d0nt see a p0int n dd with a ms3 i d0nt see the p0int g0in smallerwhen if ur tune is g00d u make g00d p0wer.and key w0rds run with. n0t beat just hangn 3 cars back l0l.
Jesus Christ! :suicide:Quote:
Originally Posted by 99SNAKESKINNER
i'm with ya there :suicide:Quote:
Originally Posted by INMY01TA
Quote:
Originally Posted by INMY01TA
Make that 3 guys :suicide:Quote:
Originally Posted by tatertot91
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackSS01
+4 for the loss :suicide:
Think i want a bigger cam !!
ban him forever plz ^Quote:
Originally Posted by 99SNAKESKINNER
i will agree that a lot of people over-cam their cars........but a "large" cam (by the way "large" changes it seems like every year.) have their place and when set up properly will run like a rapped ape. and yes sometimes a "smaller" cammed car will take a larger cam car..but most of that depends on gearing and suspension. but the OP seems to be high on meth or something ..just busting in ranting about shit.
blackbird your wrong sorry. i make great power dd with n0 issues . n my tune is 0nly a mail n tune.if any0ne is l00kin at the ms4 0r 3 dont listen t0 the big cam haters the ms3 aint even that big. ask fr0st even he will tell you there 0ne 0f the m0st streetable cams 0ut.
stop!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by 99snakeskinner
:lmao:Quote:
Originally Posted by shady milkman
I was being a smart ass :cheers:Quote:
Originally Posted by MrKid
1 th1nk y0u4 p05t5 ar3 gr3at... but why ju5t u53 0 0n1y??? :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by 99SNAKESKINNER
:slap:Quote:
Originally Posted by Spaz
So was I:shitstorm:Quote:
Originally Posted by blackSS01
0 s0ry..i meen s0 wuz eye
hooked on phonics is your friend...Quote:
Originally Posted by 99SNAKESKINNER
you started this whole thread about big cams vs small cams with a car that runs mid to low 12's? :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbirdbrain89
His MPH tells me a car easily capable of 11's.Quote:
Originally Posted by blwn_00gt
He said he ran on stock rubber. A sub par 60 foot time even in the 1.70's would put the car in the 11.70's easily with 114+ trap speeds.
So I'd say it's a decent running car for what it is.
114 for a cam car sucks, street tires or not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Firebirdjones
Not for the small cam he is running.Quote:
Originally Posted by INMY01TA
You guys think a cam only car is automatically supposed to go 120+ mph in a full weight car????
I got news for ya,,,,,,,,easier said than done. Just about every cam only LS1 I've ever seen at the track will run about 112 to 118 mph depending on the size and too many other variables. Bottom line though, 114 mph is nothing to sneeze at from a little motor only 346, cam only or not.
You guys have been watching too many internet videos.
Internet vids? Ha. I'm at the track every weekend during the season. 114 is great for a bolt on car. Funny you say "Not for the small cam he is running." You're essentially saying you agree a bigger cam would run faster, which is what we've been trying to tell him in this thread.Quote:
Originally Posted by Firebirdjones
99% of the time the bigger cam will run faster in 1/4 etc...i think the op however made a point that some people over cam their cars and end up getting beat by a properly speced camQuote:
Originally Posted by INMY01TA
he did not run that on "street tires" he had slicks
I did 114 bolt on only in my car, so far I gotta agree with you. If I don't run at least 118+ I'm going to be a little ticked :shots:Quote:
Originally Posted by INMY01TA
I'm not agreeing with anyone really. 114 with just a few bolts ons in a full weight 4th gen??? What's your idea of bolt ons??? I think you guys are living in a dream world.Quote:
Originally Posted by INMY01TA
You guys running below sea level?? :chuckles:
A little above sea level with spare tire/jack removed with full bolt ons. Everything in my sig minus cam/heads and supporting mods.Quote:
Originally Posted by Firebirdjones
i went a 11.5x at 117mph with a 224/230 cam and headers in a full weight auto so although his mph might be good for 11's its obvious his driving skills is not...Quote:
Originally Posted by Firebirdjones
:spit: What sig???
Exactly, but you can't judge a car by driving skills. Just look at MPH and it will tell you what the car is capable of.Quote:
Originally Posted by blwn_00gt
"The Terminator"
Black 2001 Camaro SS M6 #1221 LS6 Block:
Performance Mods: Stage 1 LS6 heads, Torquer V2 camshaft and supporting mods, LTs, Lid, Pulleys, FTRA, Amsoil Air filter, Throttle Body Bypass, Ported MAF, Bump Stop Mod, Ported TB, Catch Can, 160 Thermostat, Frost Tune
Suspension Mods: SFC, STB, LCAs, Panhard Bar
On last page about 5 posts up or down :umm:
Read his post #76 a lil above. Your sig only appears on one post per page. :itsok:Quote:
Originally Posted by Firebirdjones
:coffee:
If I had full bolt-ons and a cam and I only ran a 12.39, I'd run my car into a tree.
Waaa??? Like I'm supposed to go looking all over the forum pages for a single post with his mods on it, like I care or something???Quote:
Originally Posted by INMY01TA
You want me to see it, then post it up. Telling me to look at a sig that is listed somewhere else doesn't help.
Guess you aren't seeing the whole picture either.Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed_kills_WS6
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firebirdjones
Actually just 3 posts up from yours give or take. Sigs only show up 1 time per page. Wasn't asking to look at my sig, said what mods were in my sig is what I ran with :dance:
http://www.afunnystuff.com/forumpics...itstop_640.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by Firebirdjones
:lmao: I have never seen that pic before in my life :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by INMY01TA
Don't know about the one time per page stuff. I don't use it.Quote:
Originally Posted by blackSS01
Let me try now,,,,,,Look up at post #91, maybe that will explain it to ya :chuckles:Quote:
Originally Posted by INMY01TA
I understand that he's making power based on his speed. Just saying I wouldn't be satisfied with that.
Ya, it's always nice to go faster, and when is it ever enough??? What I mean is for what little he has, the MPH is decent. Unless some of these guys spend some real time at a track, running in DA numbers of 3,000+ for most of us in 3,600 lbs. cars, they will quickly realize it's not as easy as it sounds.Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed_kills_WS6
But you'll have a few that think their stock LS1 4th gen with a couple of simple bolt on's will go 114 mph,,,,I'm sorry, but they are full of (cough! cough!) :D
I don't believe they are being completely honest with either what they have done, or the conditions they ran in, or the total weight of the car.
And when most of us look at bolt ons, it's generally considered something the backyard mechanic can do in the driveway and it doesn't cost tons of $$$ to do it.
I'd dig my slips out since your calling me a liar but I don't really feel the need to justify anything to anyone on this site. Full bolt on 114mph trapper right as you read this. Now I'll be going much faster with H/C and supporting mods. I told you I was almost sea-level, I believe 100 ft above with Jack and spare gone with me being 145lbs. FULL BOLT ON! Maybe I have a freak, maybe I can drive the shit out of my car, just maybe if you would have asked........only trapped 114mph once with my average being in the 112 mph range. You have no clue, so stop BSing about other people when you have no way of backing it up. That is all for now I believe :true:Quote:
Originally Posted by Firebirdjones
EDIT: My car weighed in at 3505 or some shit like that last time I weighed it, with me in it. Not 3600+ that is for sure.
:lol:
:chuckles: o lordy
This thread has progressively gotten worse since it started.
geez fellas...you guys shouldnt get so worked up! http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u...e/workedup.jpg
Yep, typical internet chit chat.
When you have alot of people that are touchy, add in all the internet racing that goes on and it = :hitfan:
