Some insight into the 3.4L OHV Motor...

[ROSCOE48]

We Just Purchased A 2007 Pontiac Torrent--with A 3.4l Sfi V6-i Realized The Engine Was Made In China-do You Know How They Are Holding Up- Reliable- Any Problems- I Did Not Realize Gm Products Had Chinese Motors

[Black34v6]

i have no idea bout the chinese thing -- cant really comment on that.

as for the 3500 plenum fitting - no way. unless you wanna lower the motor. i barely got the 3400 intake to fit and i had to remove the "3400 sfi" off the top (read: grind away).

the 3500 intake is taller than the 3400 and you cant shave off any material.

[B34M3R]

Now, when you say lower the motor, do you mean modify the mounts? Because thats what I inferred from your post...

Looking at the pics from your car, there still looks like theres some clearance... but not enough to install from the top of the car... is that what you meant by dropping the motor?

[koolchriscamaro]

i have no idea bout the chinese thing -- cant really comment on that.

as for the 3500 plenum fitting - no way. unless you wanna lower the motor. i barely got the 3400 intake to fit and i had to remove the "3400 sfi" off the top (read: grind away).

the 3500 intake is taller than the 3400 and you cant shave off any material.

hey black34....if its not too much to ask....plz listen to what i gotta say......alright, i just bought the intake manifolds off a '99 grand am gt and they are in great shape.....im fixin to recieve a set of 3100 heads in the mail(the guy said that they would work on the 3.4 engine, plus they were a bargain)....now, i have found a mechanic that is willing to do the work, but he wants me to ask you a few questions....first off, did you take the engine out when you did these top end swaps......did you have any trouble with the electrical wiring, how much did you grind off on the 3400 intake.....and lastly, did you use the lifters and pushrods that were on the camaro engine with these new heads...............the mechanic says it would be alot easier if the engine came out since there isnt much clearance and he quoted me $1,000,but if it can be done without the engine coming out.....than i think $1,000 is kind of overpriced (he is also goind to put my headers on).....plz help me out because it is needed badly and i am determined to do this......

[B34M3R]

Honestly, thats a relatively fair price, IMO.

He is doing the equivilent of changing 2 head gaskets, intake mani gaskets, and of course there is the whole factor that its not a stock job... complications might occur. And yes, it would be MUCH easier to drop the motor...

Also, I'm willing to bet the 3100 heads will have a significantly smaller combustion chamber, there-by raising your compression ratio... possible to a dangerous ratio... Get good, thick, copper head gaskets if you are going to use the 3100 heads, at the very least. I don't know that for sure... but its a safe bet.

[koolchriscamaro]

Honestly, thats a relatively fair price, IMO.

He is doing the equivilent of changing 2 head gaskets, intake mani gaskets, and of course there is the whole factor that its not a stock job... complications might occur. And yes, it would be MUCH easier to drop the motor...

Also, I'm willing to bet the 3100 heads will have a significantly smaller combustion chamber, there-by raising your compression ratio... possible to a dangerous ratio... Get good, thick, copper head gaskets if you are going to use the 3100 heads, at the very least. I don't know that for sure... but its a safe bet.

from what i researched.....the only difference in the 3100 and 3400 heads is that the valves and rocker arms are bigger on the 3400......plus, like mr. black 34 mentioned......the same top end was used on the 2.8, 3.1, and 3.4 engines.......so your engine and my engine both have basically a 2.8 top end.....so i believe that the 3100 heads would have a bigger combustion chamber..............by the way, i bought one of those Chilton's book for my camaro, but since i am going to put a grand am top end, wouldn't i need another Chilton's book so i would know what to torque the head and manifold bolts on the grand am parts.............i sure hope that mr. black 34 gives us some more info because its needed

[Man from Mars]

We Just Purchased A 2007 Pontiac Torrent--with A 3.4l Sfi V6-i Realized The Engine Was Made In China-do You Know How They Are Holding Up- Reliable- Any Problems- I Did Not Realize Gm Products Had Chinese Motors

I just purchased one over the weekend. It averaged 24 MPG in mostly highway driving @ 75 to 80 MPH, so at least it is fuel efficient. Not bad for a vehicle that weighs 5000 lb. If it is of poor quality then GM is going to go broke fixing cars with a 5yr, 100K Powertrain Warranty. I think it is a little lacking in power for it's size (185 hp), but my estranged wife, is happy with it, and will be driving it. Maybe she will like shuttling her guy friends around in it. I wonder if the engine parts are also made in China, or just the assembly work?

LOL to both of us!

[koolchriscamaro]

I cant believe how much ive learned about my camaro 3.4 in the past couple of months or so..........i gotta say though, this black34v6 guy isn't much help........well, just to let everyone know, i am an 18 year old makin minimum wage and ive about had enough saved up to do this top end swap..........so far i got the intake manifolds off a '99 grand am gt..........now im fixin to get some reconditioned heads for about $200 a piece........im also looking for used fuel rail, new injectors come later, and used headers...........wanting some used parts just to save money because $5.85 and hour just takes too long to buy new parts..........now despite what i just said, there is one question that needs answered because its botherin the he** outta me.....................................do i use grand am pushrods or the camaro pushrods, i just recently found out that the grand am pushrods are shorter than the camaro......grand am intake pushrod=5.746, grand am exhaust pushrod=6.074...........camaro intake and exhaust pushrods=6.163........................I know that if i put the wrong pushrods in my engine than it will screw everything up so advice would be appreciated....................................als o i am going to put a comp 260 cam, replace the lifters with either brand new stock ones or some competition ones(dont know yet depending on the price difference, plus i dont race my car....just want a lot more pep is all), and i might as well replace the timing chain, flywheel, and the idler pulley while im at it just to be safe(only $30).
Now with all that said, is there anything else that i should replace. I forgot to mention that i have a '95 camaro with only 59,000 miles.
ADVICE OVER WHAT I HAVE MENTIONED AND ASKED WILL BE APPRECIATED AND IS NEED......THANKS

[Forced_Firebird]

I cant believe how much ive learned about my camaro 3.4 in the past couple of months or so..........i gotta say though, this black34v6 guy isn't much help........well, just to let everyone know, i am an 18 year old makin minimum wage and ive about had enough saved up to do this top end swap..........so far i got the intake manifolds off a '99 grand am gt..........now im fixin to get some reconditioned heads for about $200 a piece........im also looking for used fuel rail, new injectors come later, and used headers...........wanting some used parts just to save money because $5.85 and hour just takes too long to buy new parts..........now despite what i just said, there is one question that needs answered because its botherin the he** outta me.....................................do i use grand am pushrods or the camaro pushrods, i just recently found out that the grand am pushrods are shorter than the camaro......grand am intake pushrod=5.746, grand am exhaust pushrod=6.074...........camaro intake and exhaust pushrods=6.163........................I know that if i put the wrong pushrods in my engine than it will screw everything up so advice would be appreciated....................................als o i am going to put a comp 260 cam, replace the lifters with either brand new stock ones or some competition ones(dont know yet depending on the price difference, plus i dont race my car....just want a lot more pep is all), and i might as well replace the timing chain, flywheel, and the idler pulley while im at it just to be safe(only $30).
Now with all that said, is there anything else that i should replace. I forgot to mention that i have a '95 camaro with only 59,000 miles.
ADVICE OVER WHAT I HAVE MENTIONED AND ASKED WILL BE APPRECIATED AND IS NEED......THANKS

First, don't rag on people that can give you info. Russel (black34v6) is one of the hybrid origionators. You can learn a lot from him.

Next, have your car ready to be down for a few weeks if it is your daily driver.

I believe I'm the first to build a 3.4/3500 hybrid, definately the only one boosted, especially to put one in a 3rd gen f-body.

You should be grateful that anybody wants to share info with you, but since the deck height to cam distance hasn't changed since the 2.8, the pushrods that came in the motor from in which your heads are from, are the ones you need to use.

I'm using 2004 3500 heads, 1995 3100 pushrods and guides modified to fit, 2004 LS6 GTO valve spring with different locks, retainers, keepers, 3400 pistons (for boost and 3.4 pistons for N/A testing), 1.7 ratio roller rockers from a Ford small block. The entire top end is getting a mirror-polish port jo abd gasket matching with a set of custom headers built by me. My redline will be near 7500rpm, and looking to get over 250hp before re-applying boost.

[koolchriscamaro]

First, don't rag on people that can give you info. Russel (black34v6) is one of the hybrid origionators. You can learn a lot from him.

Next, have your car ready to be down for a few weeks if it is your daily driver.

I believe I'm the first to build a 3.4/3500 hybrid, definately the only one boosted, especially to put one in a 3rd gen f-body.

You should be grateful that anybody wants to share info with you, but since the deck height to cam distance hasn't changed since the 2.8, the pushrods that came in the motor from in which your heads are from, are the ones you need to use.

I'm using 2004 3500 heads, 1995 3100 pushrods and guides modified to fit, 2004 LS6 GTO valve spring with different locks, retainers, keepers, 3400 pistons (for boost and 3.4 pistons for N/A testing), 1.7 ratio roller rockers from a Ford small block. The entire top end is getting a mirror-polish port jo abd gasket matching with a set of custom headers built by me. My redline will be near 7500rpm, and looking to get over 250hp before re-applying boost.

hey im sorry.....just got a little impatient.......ya, i am very grateful because i thought it was impossible for my car to perform......

[koolchriscamaro]

please help guys.....since im doing this top end swap on my camaro, do i need to get some spark plugs for the camaro or the grand am, they both have the same engine block but different top ends.....so does that make a big difference on the spark plugs, im keeping the stock camaro pistons by the way......i did some research on the specs on the spark plugs that i want(NGK Iridium)....and the only difference in the camaro and grand am spark plugs is that camaro plug reach is .460 inches and the grand am plug reach is .708 inches....also did russel get camaro headers or grand am headers with those grand am heads.......and if anyone can help, where can i get all my intake manifold bolts and head bolts....do you think a dealership could order them.......thanks for any advice

[Forced_Firebird]

Use the Grand Am plugs, Camaro pistons will only work with the 3500 heads, and the 3500 UIM won't fit under a 4th gen cowl without modification, 3.4 headers will work if you enlongate the bolt holes a little, pushrods must be from a 3x00, fuel rail from 3100/3400 3500 is returnless, TB pulls from a different direction need longer cable 3500 TB can't be used it's drive-by-wire. Bolts available from GM or GM parts direct, no aftermarket 3500 gaskets are available yet.

[koolchriscamaro]

well, i guess i'll have to change out the pistons after all.....i was hoping i wouldn't, but i dont wont extremely high compression.........do you know what the difference is between the '99 grand am and '00 grand am(3.4 of course)......i got the manifolds(upper and lower) from a '99 on ebay and i was wondering what the difference in the manifolds is between the '99 and '00....the reason i want to know is because i just recently bought a set of heads for a '99 grand am, but i wish that i bought the heads for a '00 because the parts are so much easier to find for the '00 and up grand ams and i also just bidded on some fuel rail and injectors off a gm '99 3400 minivan......now, will the fuel rail and injectors off the '99 minivan fit on the parts i have just bought....if they do then i will stick with the parts that i have.........but if they dont, then i will return the heads back to the company and replace it with '00 heads(only if the manifolds are the same with '99 and '00)......only thing that sucks is that i will have to pay a restocking fee, but its better than having to buy expensive completly new fuel rails which would run me at least $130 not counting fuel injectors...doesn't the heads on the '00 grand ams and up have larger valves than the '99? .........bunch of questions, i know, but im learning something new every time someone replies to my questions.........by the way, im having all this work done this winter, so i am in somewhat of a hurry..........thankx for any info

[Forced_Firebird]

PM sent

[koolchriscamaro]

alright, im bak again and i've got good news.......i just found a mechanic that has a 3400 engine laying around that came out of a '99 grand am.......the engine had a rod knocking and he is going to sell it to me for just $100......kinda pisses me off a little cuz i wasted a $110 dollars on manifolds, fuel rail, and injectors when i could've just bought all that with the whole engine. but i dont regret buying the reconditioned heads, cuz aluminum is soft metal so id rather spend the money on good heads........well, im gonna pick up the engine sometime next week, so ill use the heads to take care of the core charge that i got for my reconditioned heads, ill keep the used rocker arms since my reconditioned heads didn't come with them....and ill just use the engine for necessary parts needed to do the swap(such as bolts)....ill make sure i get new head bolts though......now, would it be wise to use these pistons since the engine had a rod knocking, i dont think so but i would like someones opinion......ill probably go ahead and get some new 3400 FWD pistons just to be safe but i need to know if these will work with my camaro rods and what exactly is the difference in the camaro and grand am pistons(3.4).....also...im fixing to go to a machine shop to have my heads pressure tested to make sure they are in good shape......should i have my manifolds resurfaced......or would that ruin the alignment that they make....the manifolds.....also, im going to put a cam in my car and i cant decide if id rather have a comp cam or a crane cam.....a mechanic told me the other day that a cam will cause the car to run like crap if the computer isn't tuned, if youll dont mind, take a look at http://engine.firebirdv6.com/cam.html and tell me if i should go with the crane cam or comp cam....ill probably make more power with the comp cam, but may have more computer problems and idling problems than if i went with the crane cam which is a bit smaller....the website also shows the stock 3.4 cam so it can be compared....also, would a jet performance chip(stage 2) not help out as far as the computer problems with the bigger cam.......advice is needed........

[Forced_Firebird]

Don't waste your money one of those cams. Call Delta Camshafts (google them). I got a 262 cam from them for $100 with lifters. You can buy a 262 cam from GM for $125 with lifters. 262 will run with a stock tune, 272 won't. You still should look into something for tuning, but with a OBD1.5 you don't have many options.

You should be more worried about LIM bolts than head bolts. Iron block and aluminum heads in combination with the head design can lead to a LIM failure. Spend the extra dough and get severe duty gaskets to remedy this. 3500 top ends have a re-designed gasket, but don't work with 3400 parts, with the exception of the UIM gasket. The metal 3500 UIM gasket is what everyone ports to (including myself).

[koolchriscamaro]

okay, i will take your advice and buy a cam 262......as for the manifolds, i have that taken care of because i bought the new designed 3400 gaskets which has a metal LIM gasket, unlike the plastic gaskets that the grand ams come from the factory with......im not sure about the UIM gaskets, though.....should i get metal if they arent........anyway, the kit also came with the manifold bolts along with some thread locker already applied ......, so i should be alright with the manifolds.....but my biggest concern is will the grand am pistons fit on my rods and do i use camaro lifters or grand am lifters(these may be stupid questions, but it doesn't hurt to ask).....i gotta say, i am very grateful that i am recieving all these answers because it helps a hell of a lot and helps put me in the right direction.....thankx

[koolchriscamaro]

i discussed some of this to my old man(dad) and he mentioned that pistons and the cylinder walls are constantly wearing in a running engine and he thinks i should bore the cylinder walls and get oversized pistons for additional power.......so, if i go up one notch from the factory pistons, which i think is .50 MM, will that be safe......he also said that the more you bore out the cylinders....the weaker that they get........i plan on keeping this car till the day that i die if i dont ever wreck it......so would you advise that i bore out the cylinder walls or leave them alone and get factory GA pistons.....i want my engine block to last as long as the car

[Forced_Firebird]

When you open the engine and you still see cross hatches, I would just use a hand hone. If there are vertical scores/scratches, then over bore would be a good idea. I'll have to double check, but I'm almost positive the rods and pistons didn't change until 2002. Here's some more info for you...

http://wiki.60degreev6.com/index.php...V6_Family_Tree

[koolchriscamaro]

well...in the other websites that i've looked at.....they only mention swapping out the pistons and the top end.......so i guess i keep my rods.....but now i've come across another problem.....russel mentioned that he used his stock 3.4 RWD wiring harness for the fuel injectors, so im guessing that he also used camaro injectors(along with the grand am fuel rail of course) but since the grand am injectors were 19's........does that mean that i need to get 19 # camaro injectors or does it even matter........what would u suggest 19 0r 21.........