Bad night for an SRT owner

[LS1Jason]

Duece, you keep claiming these high 12's for the SRT8's in STOCK form. I'll never believe it, because I've never seen it. Just like I'll always find it hard to believe anyone ever went 12.80's in a bone stock LS1.

I've watched dozen's of STOCK srt8's run at the track. the absolute lowest I have seen one was 13.30.

then, I've seen them go 12.90's with just a programmer. This was actually an honest guy that admitted he had the programmer on it. Certain things can't be seen, therefor ppl still bullshit and claim there stock.

When i see one thats actually bone stock drop into the 12's, I'll gladly eat my words. Until that, most of us are tired of hearing about it and seeing you post mag articles.

[Lethal Z]

Did you miss the part about a tune? And quite a few stock SRT-8s have run 12s anyway.

Really where? Because they sure as hell ain't been over here at the track. And don't go quoting some magazine either. The fastest SRT-8 I ever saw ran a 13.6, did he have a tune? Maybe, I don't know but I have seen lots of these cars run, some had exhaust mods so I would hope at least a couple of them had some sort of tune. The whole idea of having to go get a tune despite spending $40K just proves my point even more. Sure you can go get a tune, you can tune an LS1 too so what. Pay attention, the discussion is what do you get for the money bone stock, because you can mod anything. The SRT-8 brings a 6.1 liter Hemi to the table vs a 5.7 liter LS1. Now lets assume we knew nothing about either car, a smart guy would give the edge to the Hemi just out of sheer displacement. Never mind the fact that it has a 100hp advantage over the chevy. Explain to me again why this Hemi now needs to go get a tune to win. And if you really want to be fair this should be a comparison between an SRT8 vs a stock 02 camaro SS. I mean why not you already have an engine advantage, Why not compare the very best charger against the very best camaro stock for stock. I'm sure I don't have to explain too you what would happen in that race do I? Tune or not that outcome ain't gonna be good.

Some people have a requirement for 4 doors. Think about it. Long and hard. Should we only spend $30k and run 14s? Is that the rule?

Well I guess we won't bring up the 5.7 litre RT will we? I have no problem with a 4 dr car thats fast I just don't think your getting your moneys worth for that car. I think like someone else said, give me the caddy if its gotta be a 4dr.

Go add a couple of doors and see what you get - a G8. I guess we're not allowed to have performance with four doors? Did you think this through?

Overweight? Compare curb weight to any other car with a 120" wheelbase
Overpriced? Excellent performance for the dollar in a new car purchase. Until the GXP and SS Camaro, nothing under $40k could touch it after the '06 GTO.
Underpowered enough to beat a stock LS1 on any day.

You can have whatever you wanna spend your money on, I just ain't buyin it. For one when I think of a muscle car I think of a 2dr, its fast, its loud and it looks good. Im not looking for all the goofy electronic gadgets, if its a family car thats one thing but a performance car, keep all that other crap off of it.

"Exellent performance for the dollar in a new car purchase."

We'll have this conversation again in a couple of years after Kelley blue book get a hold of you. Let me let you in on a little secret that everyone else already knows. You take it in the shorts whenever you but a brand new car. I quit doing that a long time ago. Let someone else take the hit. Most people who are real gear heads and are into real performance don't go buy performace cars new anyway,they build them. In comes the LS1, spend around 10k or so for a well maintained one and put about $3-$5K into it. And it is going to eat your $40K dollar yacht for breakfast. Untouchable? tell that to the guy I ate last night.

[Deuuuce]

^^^^ stop trying to say srt8's are 12 second cars. they're just not. MAYBE a select few have in perfect conditions (which you still haven't proven with facts). they are low 13 sec cars. there have been bone stock f-body run 12's around 109, and it's been documented too. but we're not saying that they're 12 second cars. it's just not nearly common enough.

Not common at all. The recipe: cool down, 1.9x 60ft, negative DA, 2-3 start-up shift avoided. Here are some examples that I have found:

http://www.dragtimes.com/Chrysler-30...lip-16755.html close. Notice the 60ft but the K&N drop in.

http://www.dragtimes.com/Dodge-Charg...lip-15582.html which may be CharlieS: http://www.challengertalk.com/forums...690/#post97339

Stevesrt8 did: http://www.300cforums.com/forums/members/stevesrt8.html

H82bslo: http://www.digitalcorvettes.com/foru...1&postcount=11

close with 03cobra1979: http://www.svtperformance.com/forums...ml#post7604249

This LS2 GTO owner lost to one: http://www.ls1gto.com/forums/showpos...&postcount=137

SRT8tech: http://www.chargerforums.com/forums/...7&postcount=66

Slideway in a Magnum 13.05: http://www.lxforums.com/board/showthread.php?t=84931

There MIGHT be some here: http://lxforums.com/board/timeslips.php

1.9 60fts in negative DA is a challenge unless the track is prepped well anyway. Can't idle in the staging lanes, you have to drive up, over 20mph, get to the lights and start the countdown. Otherwise heat soaked you're 13.0 or slower at 106-108mph in cool weather.

"Ujokin2" James-426 stroker
"gilgamesh" Dave- SC stroker 426
"StingYA" David -SC/NOS stroker 396

all have had trans probs.

my 96 Camaro was an electrical nightmare... window motors, blinkers, etc...

Good info, thanks. Is it safe to say when over 600 Whp, 4200lbs running on DRs and slicks is the "level" where problems start? Its the AMG tranny after all. I would venture one of the most stout stock autos in production.

Duece, you keep claiming these high 12's for the SRT8's in STOCK form. I'll never believe it, because I've never seen it. Just like I'll always find it hard to believe anyone ever went 12.80's in a bone stock LS1.

I've watched dozen's of STOCK srt8's run at the track. the absolute lowest I have seen one was 13.30.

then, I've seen them go 12.90's with just a programmer. This was actually an honest guy that admitted he had the programmer on it. Certain things can't be seen, therefor ppl still bullshit and claim there stock.

When i see one thats actually bone stock drop into the 12's, I'll gladly eat my words. Until that, most of us are tired of hearing about it and seeing you post mag articles.

How do you know the moon isn't made of green cheese? Have you been there?

13.3s is basically guaranteed with a 2.0 60ft under average conditions, if not worse-than-average conditions. As for the rest, see above.

[Kaotic_ws6]

Not common at all. The recipe: cool down, 1.9x 60ft, negative DA, 2-3 start-up shift avoided. Here are some examples that I have found:

http://www.dragtimes.com/Chrysler-30...lip-16755.html close. Notice the 60ft but the K&N drop in.

http://www.dragtimes.com/Dodge-Charg...lip-15582.html which may be CharlieS: http://www.challengertalk.com/forums...690/#post97339

Stevesrt8 did: http://www.300cforums.com/forums/members/stevesrt8.html

H82bslo: http://www.digitalcorvettes.com/foru...1&postcount=11

close with 03cobra1979: http://www.svtperformance.com/forums...ml#post7604249

This LS2 GTO owner lost to one: http://www.ls1gto.com/forums/showpos...&postcount=137

SRT8tech: http://www.chargerforums.com/forums/...7&postcount=66

Slideway in a Magnum 13.05: http://www.lxforums.com/board/showthread.php?t=84931

There MIGHT be some here: http://lxforums.com/board/timeslips.php

1.9 60fts in negative DA is a challenge unless the track is prepped well anyway. Can't idle in the staging lanes, you have to drive up, over 20mph, get to the lights and start the countdown. Otherwise heat soaked you're 13.0 or slower at 106-108mph in cool weather.




Good info, thanks. Is it safe to say when over 600 Whp, 4200lbs running on DRs and slicks is the "level" where problems start? Its the AMG tranny after all. I would venture one of the most stout stock autos in production.



How do you know the moon isn't made of green cheese? Have you been there?

13.3s is basically guaranteed with a 2.0 60ft under average conditions, if not worse-than-average conditions. As for the rest, see above.

look. who gives a crap about what other people ran with there cars, you drive an srt-8 dont you? take it to the track and bring us a 12 sec timeslip if yours is still stock, then we will beleive it. there no reason at all to have all these damn arguments.

[Deuuuce]

The fastest SRT-8 I ever saw ran a 13.6, did he have a tune?

See above. If you think that is the norm you're delusional. And not familiar with drag racing at all.

Now lets assume we knew nothing about either car, a smart guy would give the edge to the Hemi just out of sheer displacement. Never mind the fact that it has a 100hp advantage over the chevy. Explain to me again why this Hemi now needs to go get a tune to win. And if you really want to be fair this should be a comparison between an SRT8 vs a stock 02 camaro SS. I mean why not you already have an engine advantage, Why not compare the very best charger against the very best camaro stock for stock. I'm sure I don't have to explain too you what would happen in that race do I? Tune or not that outcome ain't gonna be good.

Equal drivers the Charger will win. Sorry. The '02s are the fastest...?

I think like someone else said, give me the caddy if its gotta be a 4dr.

Different price range, otherwise we'd all have one too.

You can have whatever you wanna spend your money on, I just ain't buyin it. For one when I think of a muscle car I think of a 2dr, its fast its loud and it looks good. Im not looking for all the goofy electronic gadgets, if its a family car thats one thing but a performance car, keep all that other crap off of it.

Sorry, some of us have 4 door requirements and like having our cake and eating it too.

"Exellent performance for the dollar in a new car purchase." Well have this conversation again in a couple of years after Kelley blue book get a hold of you. Let me tell you something you should already know, you take it in the shorts whenever you but a brand new car. I quit doing that a long time ago. Let someone else take the hit and come back and buy last years model. Most people who are real gear heads and are into real performance don't go buy performace cars new. They build them. In comes the LS1. Spend around 10k or so for a well maintained one and put about 5 grand into it. And it is going to eat your $40K dollar yacht for breakfast.

Hey guess what? If you need a 4 door, I know of some really good prices out there a LOT cheaper than the new 'V'.....

Trunk space, 5 passenger capability, 8 way power heated seats, nav, bluetooth, roof, solid structure, no rattles, dual zone climate control, Brembos, excellent suspension. Makes a great daily driver, runs low 13s all day.

[LS1Jason]

See above. If you think that is the norm you're delusional. And not familiar with drag racing at all.


Equal drivers the Charger will win. Sorry. The '02s are the fastest...?



Different price range, otherwise we'd all have one too.



Sorry, some of us have 4 door requirements and like having our cake and eating it too.



Hey guess what? If you need a 4 door, I know of some really good prices out there a LOT cheaper than the new 'V'.....

Trunk space, 5 passenger capability, 8 way power heated seats, nav, bluetooth, roof, solid structure, no rattles, dual zone climate control, Brembos, excellent suspension. Makes a great daily driver, runs low 13s all day.

hate to bust that bubble, but that IS the norm. otherwise, I suppose we all need to go to where ever the hell your racing at. then stock LS1's should drop 12.50's to 12.60's

must be why that SRT8 challenger was running 13.50's last week on 1.90 60' times.

[fergyflyer]

I guess if the conditions are perfect and the SRT8 driver keeps his speed above 20 and doesn't heat soak and the stars align and the cool ocean breeze hits the car just right it runs into the 12's.

Sorry but in the real world we are talking higher than a 13.5 for an SRT8 car and it's getting it's lunch eaten by my 13.0 real world lid, catback and tune car. Throw the same mods on an SRT8 and I'm still not leaving any crumbs for the Mopar guy.

Guess I'll be happy driving my mop eater in the real world Deuuuce, you keep reading your magazines.

Hey any luck finding someone in the Orlando area to run my car. Again, it should be an equally modded car. That means a tune, preferably a programmer tune and not a dyno tune, an intake and a catback. The SRT8's I've run like that have all been lousy drivers according to you. They run mid 13's and you keep telling me it's the driver. So since I can't find a better driver at the track, I thought you might find a better driver somewhere.

Again Deuuuce, my car has run a 12.7 at Orlando Speedworld. Typically it runs 13.0-13.1. In the real world it's a 13 second car. You can't ice the intake, set your electronics up right and keep the spped above 20 mph to the traffic light. I can do exactly what I did to run a 13.0 on the street and do it repeatedly. SRT8 are great cars. Just back off a bit from what you're saying and come back to earth. It's better to tell someone you have a 13.4 second car and do it repeatedly while every once in a while hitting a 13.0 than to tell people you have a 13.0 car and hit 13.4 most of the time because the conditions aren't perfect.

Hey lets look at this Deuuuce, I get 21-23 mpg running back and forth to work. It's about half city and half highway. Out on the highway with the cruise set at 75 I can get 27 consistantly and sometimes as high as 29. What's an SRT8 get???? A true performance car provides all around performance. That's why a C6 gets 30-32 highway and 24 in the mix I just described.

[big hammer]

Not common at all. The recipe: cool down, 1.9x 60ft, negative DA, 2-3 start-up shift avoided. Here are some examples that I have found:

http://www.dragtimes.com/Chrysler-30...lip-16755.html close. Notice the 60ft but the K&N drop in.

http://www.dragtimes.com/Dodge-Charg...lip-15582.html which may be CharlieS: http://www.challengertalk.com/forums...690/#post97339

Stevesrt8 did: http://www.300cforums.com/forums/members/stevesrt8.html

H82bslo: http://www.digitalcorvettes.com/foru...1&postcount=11

close with 03cobra1979: http://www.svtperformance.com/forums...ml#post7604249

This LS2 GTO owner lost to one: http://www.ls1gto.com/forums/showpos...&postcount=137

SRT8tech: http://www.chargerforums.com/forums/...7&postcount=66

Slideway in a Magnum 13.05: http://www.lxforums.com/board/showthread.php?t=84931

There MIGHT be some here: http://lxforums.com/board/timeslips.php

1.9 60fts in negative DA is a challenge unless the track is prepped well anyway. Can't idle in the staging lanes, you have to drive up, over 20mph, get to the lights and start the countdown. Otherwise heat soaked you're 13.0 or slower at 106-108mph in cool weather.




Good info, thanks. Is it safe to say when over 600 Whp, 4200lbs running on DRs and slicks is the "level" where problems start? Its the AMG tranny after all. I would venture one of the most stout stock autos in production.



How do you know the moon isn't made of green cheese? Have you been there?

13.3s is basically guaranteed with a 2.0 60ft under average conditions, if not worse-than-average conditions. As for the rest, see above.

so in all that is there any legitamate 12 pass bone stock documented true srt8's? i totally lost interest when i seen you posted some dragtimes and dodge forum links. i could post that my t\a ran 12.5 bone stock with a random slip and it could be just as true.


so in all this we figure out that srt8's are 13 second cars. who knew!

[Lethal Z]

See above. If you think that is the norm you're delusional. And not familiar with drag racing at all.

Actually the SRT8 drivers are the ones who are delusional. All you hear these clowns talk about is how much HP they have. Then they line up and get there asses handed to them. Then all you hear are the excuses. 12 second LS1 cars at the track are a dime a dozen, throw a rock in any direction and your bound to hit one. And its common knowledge because unlike your charger you see them run it all the time. Now I have seen an few SRT4's hit 12's maybe your a little confused.

The '02s are the fastest...?

Absolutely not my 98 had no problem putting six cars on him.

Different price range, otherwise we'd all have one too.

Well your talking a "V" Im talking a regular CTS. And for $40K I would much rather have the CTS over a Dodge Charger. The Caddy is gonna hold its value MUCH better, plus it will blow the charger away when it comes to creature comforts and ride. Having your cake and eating it too you say? If you want a luxury car, buy that. If you want a muscle car, buy that. Buying a car that trys to capture both often ends up falling short of both unless you fork out some real serious cash.

[cant.b.caught.z28]

hmmm cts-v holds value more than an srt-8. I went ahead and figured this out for you... I did an 06 charger srt8 with 50,000 miles = 24,390 in excellent cond.
whereas your cadillac cts-v with 50,000 miles = 24,000.
now, 390 certainly isn't a whole lot, but you should stop pulling shit out of your ass.. especially when you have no idea what your talking about.

and explain to me how the caddy has better 'creature comforts' and a better ride? say, i'm a potential customer, try to sell me this car...

Anyone who has driven an srt8 will tell you that it is way better of a drive than a camaro, it has the torque, it has the space inside, and when you put the throttle down you dont risk the chance of breaking your glass transmission, or rear end. You can go on all day long about what you saw at the track, but go ahead and go drive one and honestly tell me that you think its a pile of shit, and that your camaro was built better..

[Deuuuce]

hate to bust that bubble, but that IS the norm. otherwise, I suppose we all need to go to where ever the hell your racing at. then stock LS1's should drop 12.50's to 12.60's

must be why that SRT8 challenger was running 13.50's last week on 1.90 60' times.

Can't speak for your track. Was the Challenger a 6spd? If it was an auto running 13.5s, stock LS1s were doing the same if not worse.

I guess if the conditions are perfect and the SRT8 driver keeps his speed above 20 and doesn't heat soak and the stars align and the cool ocean breeze hits the car just right it runs into the 12's.

Sorry but in the real world we are talking higher than a 13.5 for an SRT8 car and it's getting it's lunch eaten by my 13.0 real world lid, catback and tune car. Throw the same mods on an SRT8 and I'm still not leaving any crumbs for the Mopar guy.

Funny, anyone cutting 2.0 60fts into the headwind at Sears Point runs 13.3s minimum. And that is with a positive DA barely cooled down if at all. I've done it and seen others do it too. Bone stock.

Hey any luck finding someone in the Orlando area to run my car. Again, it should be an equally modded car. That means a tune, preferably a programmer tune and not a dyno tune, an intake and a catback. The SRT8's I've run like that have all been lousy drivers according to you. They run mid 13's and you keep telling me it's the driver. So since I can't find a better driver at the track, I thought you might find a better driver somewhere.

No luck and being a broker for a race 3000 miles away is a tall order.

Again Deuuuce, my car has run a 12.7 at Orlando Speedworld. Typically it runs 13.0-13.1. In the real world it's a 13 second car. You can't ice the intake, set your electronics up right and keep the spped above 20 mph to the traffic light. I can do exactly what I did to run a 13.0 on the street and do it repeatedly. SRT8 are great cars. Just back off a bit from what you're saying and come back to earth. It's better to tell someone you have a 13.4 second car and do it repeatedly while every once in a while hitting a 13.0 than to tell people you have a 13.0 car and hit 13.4 most of the time because the conditions aren't perfect.

You mean any given car doesn't vary .4 if not MORE depending upon conditions? Who needs to come back to earth? No heatsoak at a light unless stop and go. Tranny issue resolved too.

Hey lets look at this Deuuuce, I get 21-23 mpg running back and forth to work. It's about half city and half highway. Out on the highway with the cruise set at 75 I can get 27 consistantly and sometimes as high as 29. What's an SRT8 get???? A true performance car provides all around performance. That's why a C6 gets 30-32 highway and 24 in the mix I just described.

Tell you what, add 2 doors and stretch the wheelbase to 120" and then we'll actually have a valid comparison. It seems to me you're sore a stock SRT-8 is every bit a match for a stock LS1. Sorry, that's life.

How come you guys don't bitch about the GXP? Not enough losses?

Absolutely not my 98 had no problem putting six cars on him.

I don't know what you're referring to. 6 cars and you're stock vs. an '02 SS?

Well your talking a "V" Im talking a regular CTS. And for $40K I would much rather have the CTS over a Dodge Charger. The Caddy is gonna hold its value MUCH better, plus it will blow the charger away when it comes to creature comforts and ride. Having your cake and eating it too you say? If you want a luxury car, buy that. If you want a muscle car, buy that. Buying a car that trys to capture both often ends up falling short of both unless you fork out some real serious cash.

Sorry, if I spend $40k on a 4door, as thousands and thousands already have, I want to run low 13s, not mid 14s. You want a cushy ride? Great, Cadillac is a good choice. Resale value? I doubt it. And if somehow both end up on a road circuit, the Cadillac will lose, badly.

Take the same equipment level of the Charger and spend well under $40k for an '09 R/T and it's still quicker than the standard CTS.

There is an ass for every seat. Nice, boring choice.

[Deuuuce]

fergyflyer, pm me your contact information. I posted the challenge. What about all the other losses on the "other" LS1 forum. Those don't count?

[clg82]

fergyflyer, pm me your contact information. I posted the challenge. What about all the other losses on the "other" LS1 forum. Those don't count?

When did this turn into a "Dodge Forum" if you don't like the fact that he smoked that charger then move on to a different forum. There is a good lesson to be learned here, more then 3/4 of the people on this forum could smoke your arse end of story.......move on before i take a "Deuuuce" on your hood, and then beat you by four cars...........

[1 RedHot TransAm]

lol^^^

[Lethal Z]

hmmm cts-v holds value more than an srt-8. I went ahead and figured this out for you... I did an 06 charger srt8 with 50,000 miles = 24,390 in excellent cond.
whereas your cadillac cts-v with 50,000 miles = 24,000.
now, 390 certainly isn't a whole lot, but you should stop pulling shit out of your ass.. especially when you have no idea what your talking about.

I've looked at both, and if I was going after a 4dr luxury car I'd choose the cadillac hands down. If I was after a muscle car I wouldn't pick either, I don't like 4 doors on a muscle car plus the srt is a pig. And based on what I have seen on the lots around here I still feel as though the cadillac is gonna hold its value better. By the way take that with you when you leave.

and explain to me how the caddy has better 'creature comforts' and a better ride? say, i'm a potential customer, try to sell me this car...

For what? You're obviously sold on this pig of a car why would I try to sell you on a caddy. Thats like you trying to sell me on an srt-8, not going to happen. Listen carefully "I would rather have the caddy". I could give a rats ass what you like.

Anyone who has driven an srt8 will tell you that it is way better of a drive than a camaro,

Thats your opinion.

it has the torque, it has the space inside, and when you put the throttle down you dont risk the chance of breaking your glass transmission, or rear end.

I havent broken my rear end or tranny yet. "It has torque and space inside?" Are you serious? You know neither of these two things helped that charger the other night. He had all that space and torque and still ended up in my rear view mirror.

You can go on all day long about what you saw at the track, but go ahead and go drive one and honestly tell me that you think its a pile of shit, and that your camaro was built better..

Never said once it was a pile of shit, I said for $40k it falls short of the mark with regards to performance. And she's built well enough to eat any charger she's come across.

[fergyflyer]

Around here the Charger SRT8 holds it's value better than a base CTS using the 2006 model year.

Take a look at the 2008 model year and things change drastically. Using the base CTS with an auto, versus a base SRT8 they both hold an identical percentage of their value.

What we are seeing with model year 2006 is a design change hurting the value of the CTS.

I'd take the SRT8 over the CTS.

Deuuuce and Willys you guys think I hate the SRT8 cars. I don't. They are great cars and will go down as one of the better designs of the era. I really like the E series platform they are built on. Mercedes did a great job with these cars. The DNA definately shows through.

My only beef is, and Deuuuce you've known me long enough and from other forums to say that I'm consistant, the SRT8 cars are never as fast at the track that I go to as is claimed in magazines and forums. That's my opinion and perception from 100 plus trips to the drag strip over the last 3 or so years. I'm impressed by the quality and fit and finish of the LH. They are in a different league than the F-bodies in that respect, anybody claiming different needs to spend a week in a base Charger rental and you'll see the difference.

My challenge is simple. Show me a stock SRT8 that runs better than 13.5 in person at Orlando Speedworld. Show me a SRT8 that runs better than a 13.0 with just a tune, CAI and a catback. DR's are acceptable on the stock car and expected on the modded car.

My car with lid, FRAM, Magnaflow catback, Diablosport Predator tune and DR's has run a high 12.7 on a favorable day. It typically runs 13.0xx and will repeat that consistantly. My rear end will last and my transmission will last because I maintain my equipment based on the conditions that they get used in. Rear gear lube gets changed every 10,000 miles. Tranny fluid the same. I've got over 50 and probably over 100 passes on this car. I had an 02 Z28 that went over 1000 passes with similar mods and times to this car and it never broke.

Deuuce, I think guys go after you because you come onto our forum and talk about your car as if it's superior. I'd probably get treated the same on a SRT8 forum if I went there and made the comments you've made here and on their forums.

It's good to be proud of your car, but when you are a guest in another Marque's forum you need to be more humble.

[cant.b.caught.z28]

Never said once it was a pile of shit, I said for $40k it falls short of the mark with regards to performance. And she's built well enough to eat any charger she's come across.[/QUOTE]

bring your badass camaro down here then and we'll see how it runs against the srt charger and srt challenger.

[Lethal Z]

bring your badass camaro down here then and we'll see how it runs against the srt charger and srt challenger.

Go back to page one and start reading from the top. There ain't no need to come down there. Plenty of SRT owners to embarrass around here.

[LS1Jason]

Around here the Charger SRT8 holds it's value better than a base CTS using the 2006 model year.

Take a look at the 2008 model year and things change drastically. Using the base CTS with an auto, versus a base SRT8 they both hold an identical percentage of their value.

What we are seeing with model year 2006 is a design change hurting the value of the CTS.

I'd take the SRT8 over the CTS.

Deuuuce and Willys you guys think I hate the SRT8 cars. I don't. They are great cars and will go down as one of the better designs of the era. I really like the E series platform they are built on. Mercedes did a great job with these cars. The DNA definately shows through.

My only beef is, and Deuuuce you've known me long enough and from other forums to say that I'm consistant, the SRT8 cars are never as fast at the track that I go to as is claimed in magazines and forums. That's my opinion and perception from 100 plus trips to the drag strip over the last 3 or so years. I'm impressed by the quality and fit and finish of the LH. They are in a different league than the F-bodies in that respect, anybody claiming different needs to spend a week in a base Charger rental and you'll see the difference.

My challenge is simple. Show me a stock SRT8 that runs better than 13.5 in person at Orlando Speedworld. Show me a SRT8 that runs better than a 13.0 with just a tune, CAI and a catback. DR's are acceptable on the stock car and expected on the modded car.

My car with lid, FRAM, Magnaflow catback, Diablosport Predator tune and DR's has run a high 12.7 on a favorable day. It typically runs 13.0xx and will repeat that consistantly. My rear end will last and my transmission will last because I maintain my equipment based on the conditions that they get used in. Rear gear lube gets changed every 10,000 miles. Tranny fluid the same. I've got over 50 and probably over 100 passes on this car. I had an 02 Z28 that went over 1000 passes with similar mods and times to this car and it never broke.

Deuuce, I think guys go after you because you come onto our forum and talk about your car as if it's superior. I'd probably get treated the same on a SRT8 forum if I went there and made the comments you've made here and on their forums.

It's good to be proud of your car, but when you are a guest in another Marque's forum you need to be more humble.

very well said.

And, I'll even go as far to say it again, I have witnessed ONE go 12.9xx on a canned tune. UNO. Just not in complete stock form.

As for the 'comfort', I've ridden in the chargers. There extremely nice and no doubt, IMO, nicer and more comfortable than a camaro. BUT, what was dodge putting out 7 years ago that had close to the same performance as the LS1, along with a nicer interior?

My point on that is, ALL vehicles have come along way in the past 7-8 years as far as interiors and comfort.

[willys srt8]

how did i get brought into this one? i'm just tired of all the BS.

i just drove over an hour to get to the track to put this all to a test. we got there and it was closed. despite calling, checking the radar...... tremendous waste of time.

facts are still facts. both have hit 12s stock but definately not the norm. majority will run mid/low 13s. therefore............two mid/low 13 sec cars (stock)=drivers race. both cars are evenly enough matched that it will ultimately come down to the driver. either one could win on any given day. he who has the deepest pockets will eventually have the most mods.