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First Ever: 100% stock LS1 Dyno (hahah!)

This is a discussion on First Ever: 100% stock LS1 Dyno (hahah!) within the Dyno Information forums, part of the Racing Forums category; I am actually kidding but still kinda wondering if I have one of the few dyno graphs for a truly ...

  1. #1
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    First Ever: 100% stock LS1 Dyno (hahah!)

    I am actually kidding but still kinda wondering if I have one of the few dyno graphs for a truly stock LS1 ever as of this morning

    The 2001 SS still has a paper air cleaner element even, totally, totally stock car.

    I wanted a baseline then in goes PCMFORLESS tuning with a 160 thermostat (mostly just to eliminate skip-shift cleanly), an SLP "lid" (low restriction air cleaner box with a K&N element in it) and a catch can to trap those pesky notorious ping-causing LS1 oil vapors.



    I was frankly, surprised.

    Even at 305RWHP, with a manual tranny, that should be 358HP at the engine. That is up almost 25HP over the rating of 335HP (315 for 2001 LS1 with LS6 intake, add SLP cold-air and center mount exhaust worth 10 each).

    Heat really affected the car's repeatability (the runs were consecutive).

    The 3rd pull shows some evidence of timing retard, I think. Heat and oil vapors would aggravate that for sure if that is what I'm seeing... anybody on here with a lot of dyno experience have thoughts on it?

    -T

  2. #2
    Exalted Cyclops 67CamaroRSSS's Avatar
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    2002 Z28 A4 NBM
    Sadly now demodded :(

    To preface: I want to state that I'm not saying anything against you as I find your dyno results to be exactly what they should be. Instead this is aimed at folks that think the drivetrain in an SS is any better than that in a Z28.

    This dyno chart is why I wish folks would stop saying "It's an SS so it has to be better/faster/quicker (you pick)". I have a Z28. The 1st time I dynoed it as a stocker it put down 306rwhp/323rwt. The car has an A4 tranny. This was back in April 05 and the car had 29,xxx on it. I don't have the graph as it was lost when my old computer crashed in 07.

    While the suspensions (wheels/tires and shocks) are different and the SS has the fresh air hood, the drivetrains are identical. SLP, OTOH, offered some items that afforded a performance gain (lid + headers are indeed better than stock and cast iron exhaust manifold).

    I hope you have as much fun modding your car as I've had modding mine. And take it to the track to see what it'll really do. After all, you can't race on a dyno....

  3. #3
    wow 316 is great. thats 370ish motor. 01's were rated at 325, but probably should have been more like 350.

  4. #4
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    The dyno was exactly where it should have been which is what I was pleased with.

    You are 100% right about Z28 vs SS... the ONLY option the SS has that would make ANY gains on the dyno (with the hood open and the car sittings still) is the SLP Center Mount Exhaust (10HP).

    Take stock 305RWHP for Z28 model with stock exhaust... add 10 for CME... and voila!... 315 (which is just about what my car did).


    The SS is a nice looking car, has "collectibility" (?) going for it but not much... they built way too many of them.
    (my '93 Cobra Mustang in the garage is a rare car... it is a garage queen for that reason and I am driving the SS daily)


    Things I'd do to a Z28 would be a bit louder exhaust and cold air kit (lid).

    The SS already has the "functional" scoop which may help a bit for cold air, but just looks nice.

    The only real leg-up for the SS vs a Z28 is just as you say the suspension... the Bilstein is pretty neat.

    I gotta say though had I found a better deal (good car at good price) on a Z28 I would have foregone the extra cost of the SS.
    But I couldn't find anything but modded out, used up junk in the area.

    The SS was worth the extra trouble to me.

    I will say the SS hooks a lot harder than my '93 Z28 though... 1inch wider tires and the Auburn differential help with that... the large but factory drivable clutch helps too (can do "street tire launches" again which I could not with the Spec Stage III in the '93 model I had).

    All said, I am very happy with the SS.

    But if just going fast in a straight line is the ONLY thing on your mind, a Z28 is virtually identical in most regards, or with the cost delta in mods... is totally equal.

    I just figured if I take a Z and upgrade it the same as the SS, it is a modded Z28 for the same money as buying the SS already "modded" and without the stygma of worrying if the mods were half-donkeyed or done "right".

    BTW, I drove my '93 Z28 (preblower) with FIPK, cat-back and blaster coil (110k miles) to a 13.14@104.41 at Beach Bend (Bowling Green, KY) Nov 10, 2001 and have the video of it.
    That run was stock clutch and Eagls GS-Cs.
    It was a college day reunion for some of us and though I lost to a modded '98 Cobra on drag radials by .04s... I cleaned house vs 5 other competitors for reaction time average and best of day

    I probably won't be tracking the new SS for a while.

    I just got it and want to just enjoy it for a while.

    But if I do get a chance, I might push it down the 1/4 just to shake the dust of middle age outta my hair a bit

    I'll report back if I do with the times.

    -T
    Last edited by Teeeman; 08-16-2009 at 06:38 PM.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike0202 View Post
    wow 316 is great. thats 370ish motor. 01's were rated at 325, but probably should have been more like 350.

    Stuff I've read ... I thought the '01/'02 Z28s were 315HP (with the LS6 intake and think they all got 11.75" clutches for manual cars).

    The SLP add-ons for the SS were 10 for CME and 10 for cold-air hood.

    So the car should be "rated" 335, but SLP told me 345... which matches your number... so I'm still confused a bit (laughing!).

    Are you 100% sure that the '01/'02 cars were rated 325? IF that is the case then I finally understand SLP quoting 345HP for the SS.

    I do have a lid on order and a tune. Should be worth 10-15 HP once installed (160 thermostat).

    Also have a catch can in the mail... the cooler t-stat and tune and catch-can might help the car be less subject to losses for consecutive "pulls" or consecutive runs.


    -Terry

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Teeeman View Post
    Stuff I've read ... I thought the '01/'02 Z28s were 315HP (with the LS6 intake and think they all got 11.75" clutches for manual cars).

    The SLP add-ons for the SS were 10 for CME and 10 for cold-air hood.

    So the car should be "rated" 335, but SLP told me 345... which matches your number... so I'm still confused a bit (laughing!).

    Are you 100% sure that the '01/'02 cars were rated 325? IF that is the case then I finally understand SLP quoting 345HP for the SS.

    I do have a lid on order and a tune. Should be worth 10-15 HP once installed (160 thermostat).

    Also have a catch can in the mail... the cooler t-stat and tune and catch-can might help the car be less subject to losses for consecutive "pulls" or consecutive runs.


    -Terry
    Yes 98-00 ws6/ss cars were rated at 320, and 01-02 at 325. All the ratings were just for marketing. An ls1, is an ls1.

  7. #7
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    "an LS1 is an LS1"


    Yes!


    That is my conclusion too at this point



    -T

  8. #8
    King 0f n00bz shady milkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike0202 View Post
    Yes 98-00 ws6/ss cars were rated at 320, and 01-02 at 325. All the ratings were just for marketing. An ls1, is an ls1.
    while close...not quite ...the ls6 intake manifold, a better all around cam and higher flow manifolds ..the 01-02s were better..and with all things being equal faster...but due to building tolerances those power differences could be negated

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by shady milkman View Post
    while close...not quite ...the ls6 intake manifold, a better all around cam and higher flow manifolds ..the 01-02s were better..and with all things being equal faster...but due to building tolerances those power differences could be negated
    The 98-00 actually had a slightly bigger cam than the 01-02 cars. I believe the exhaust manifolds were the same, where did you read that? In the end all A4 ls1 cars will dyno 280-300 hp, and all m6 cars will usually read right around 300-320. ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1 ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1 ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1 ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1 ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1 ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1

    hehe

  10. #10
    King 0f n00bz shady milkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike0202 View Post
    The 98-00 actually had a slightly bigger cam than the 01-02 cars. I believe the exhaust manifolds were the same, where did you read that? In the end all A4 ls1 cars will dyno 280-300 hp, and all m6 cars will usually read right around 300-320. ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1 ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1 ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1 ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1 ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1 ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1ls1 is an ls1 is an ls1

    hehe

    bigger is not always better... especially with restrictive exhaust manifolds. however..i am sure that the cam change was for several reasons..1 emissions..then 2 the standard bumpstick was changed out due to GM policies regarding universality of parts
    1998 - 2000 Fbody
    202/210 int/exh @ 0.05" duration
    0.496" / 0.496" int/exh lift
    116 LSA

    2001 - 2002 Fbody
    197/207 int/exh @ 0.05" duration
    0.467" / 0.479" int/exh lift
    116 LSA

    in 2000 they redesigned the manifolds for new emission standards
    here
    here

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by shady milkman View Post
    bigger is not always better... especially with restrictive exhaust manifolds. however..i am sure that the cam change was for several reasons..1 emissions..then 2 the standard bumpstick was changed out due to GM policies regarding universality of parts
    1998 - 2000 Fbody
    202/210 int/exh @ 0.05" duration
    0.496" / 0.496" int/exh lift
    116 LSA

    2001 - 2002 Fbody
    197/207 int/exh @ 0.05" duration
    0.467" / 0.479" int/exh lift
    116 LSA

    in 2000 they redesigned the manifolds for new emission standards
    here
    here
    Interesting facts. Funny thing is the most powerful f body I ever saw was a 99 z28 rated at 305. It dynoed 327 bone stock. Ive also seen 01-02's dyno very low 300's. Thats why I think it really doesnt matter.

  12. #12
    King 0f n00bz shady milkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike0202 View Post
    Interesting facts. Funny thing is the most powerful f body I ever saw was a 99 z28 rated at 305. It dynoed 327 bone stock. Ive also seen 01-02's dyno very low 300's. Thats why I think it really doesnt matter.
    that is due to manufacturing tolerances as i stated before..loose tolerences can offset any gain had in the 01-02 design

  13. #13
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    Great info, thanks for providing!

    -Terry

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by shady milkman View Post
    that is due to manufacturing tolerances as i stated before..loose tolerences can offset any gain had in the 01-02 design
    So pretty much they SHOULD be faster, but they are not?

  15. #15
    King 0f n00bz shady milkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike0202 View Post
    So pretty much they SHOULD be faster, but they are not?
    yea..really i am just nit picking ..with all things being the same...the 01-02+ ls1s should and usually do dyno higher and are faster.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by shady milkman View Post
    yea..really i am just nit picking ..with all things being the same...the 01-02+ ls1s should and usually do dyno higher and are faster.
    Hahaha. Who has a "stock" ls1 neways

  17. #17
    King 0f n00bz shady milkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike0202 View Post
    Hahaha. Who has a "stock" ls1 neways
    maybe a car museum

  18. #18
    Senior Member BLKCLOUD's Avatar
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    I would suggest the differences in dyno numbers is due, by far, to differences in the dyno itself, correction factor, calibration of weather instruments, and running condition of the car (including how warm/cold the engine & intake are) rather than in "factory freaks" or slopply factory tolerances. In fact, I'd be willing to wager that all LS1s of a like year (ie....98-00 and 01/02) that have the same intake and exhaust would dyno within 3% of each other if all the above conditions were equal.

    In short - I don't believe in "factory freaks".

  19. #19
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    BLACK
    2002, CAMARO Z28

    Mine 100% stock was 310 and 329. Slightly above average but not a freak.

  20. #20
    Member knightryda01's Avatar
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    Mine is completely stock as of now. Anyone wanna shoot some performace parts at me I won't complain... lol
    smslyguy likes this.

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