offduty cop pulls gun on biker - aftermath WTF?!?

**RJWZ28** · 07-23-2010, 04:54 AM

Originally Posted by IH8EVRY1

I concur. I don't like to be photographed/videoed but my reasons are personal and an opinion as I've said before. Someone just hanging out is a risk of their own and ours. We have to watch them and what we were originally doing so that all parties involved stay reasonably safe. I don't like things that divide my attention and decrease safety because of it.

Exactly

**opie** · 07-23-2010, 05:12 AM

I am not sure about the wiretaping charges. I would think most coppers know there are people out there with camera. You can't even get a cell phone without one, can ya? Ever since Rodney King you can beleive that getting taped doing your job is a possiblity, a strong one. Hell the coppers bring their own video and mic to the scene now.

As far as him pulling his weapon and pointing it at the ground. Do not see a problem. The dude on the bike knew he was a copper. Guy on bike being chased by one unmarked and a couple of marked. Yeah I would say he knew. But I supose some less than intelligent citizens could assume he was just another citizen that joined the posse or better yet this is how this robbers MO works. He robs people driving like an idiot while the coppers are after him.

Also the badge thing. See above first, but I supose he could have just yelled toward the biker and said wait a minute sir, I need to put my uniform on and then I will be right with you to rob ya.

I guess the way I look at it the dude on the bike caused this incident. You wanna play, sometmes ya gotta pay. In my youth I had to pay the piper more than once myself.

Just a couple interesting things to think about, or maybe not.

US POLICE FATALITIES INCREASE 43 PERCENT

Calif., Texas, Fla. Show Most Fatalities

Nafeesa Syeed, Associated Press Writer

July 21, 2010

WASHINGTON -- A nonprofit group in Washington says the number of police officers who have died in the line of duty is up 43 percent so far this year. The National Law Enforcement Officers Memorial Fund released preliminary data Wednesday. It shows that 87 officers died in the line of duty between Jan. 1 and June 30. That's compared with 61 officers during the first six months of last year.

The deaths were spread across 36 states and Puerto Rico - with California, Texas and Florida showing the most fatalities. Other states included Virginia and Maryland, where a state trooper was fatally shot June 11. Among the causes of death were traffic accidents and shootings. If the trend continues, 2010 could become one of the deadliest years for U.S. police agencies in two decades

http://blutube.policeone.com/media/4...er-being-shot/

**pecha** · 07-23-2010, 08:45 AM

Originally Posted by RJWZ28

That's a little different. The cop didn't know the law very well as far as reasonable expectation of privacy goes, but the photographer was acting with the intent to cause a situation. Asking him to move along was fine, telling him he can't photograph was not. Asking him for his ID when he refused to move along? Completely legit. If I'm doing my job and somebody who I know nothing about is standing behind me and objecting to my instructions to move, I want to know who I'm dealing with. I probably would have ran his ID too. My reasons for telling him to move along may have been different (I don't care if I'm photographed, I just don't want some random guy hovering over me while I'm conducting a vehicle stop) but the result would have probably been similar:

'Move along, sir.'
"But the sidewalk is open, I don't have to"
'For your safety and mine, please move along'
"But I have a right to stand here, the sidewalk is open"
'ID please. Sit down. Thank you.'

Originally Posted by IH8EVRY1

I concur. I don't like to be photographed/videoed but my reasons are personal and an opinion as I've said before. Someone just hanging out is a risk of their own and ours. We have to watch them and what we were originally doing so that all parties involved stay reasonably safe. I don't like things that divide my attention and decrease safety because of it.

all understandable but LEOs are expected to know the law, not to call people "fruit cakes", not to be using swear words towards citizens, correct?
I gave this video as an example how some LEOs are unprofessional and short tempered.
IMO the original video with the biker and offduty cop is a prime example of that

***SMWS6TA*** · 07-23-2010, 09:04 AM

Originally Posted by IH8EVRY1

If you are interfering with the officers job they can ask you to leave. If your presence and actions are drawing attention that is getting dangerous or causing the victim's or suspects to not be able to communicate, it's interfering with what's going on. At that point the police officer can ask you to leave or actually tell you to leave. If you don't, they are justifiable to arrest you.

^^THIS^^

They were in the process of conducting a traffic stop. Camera man was a distraction in that it was forcing the officer to focus on him instead of the person in the car. Person in the car could have be America's most wanted, armed to the teeth and this douche bag looking for 2 seconds of fame for harassing a cop by being in close proximity put everyone at risk. I'm not saying the camera guy can't film it, I'm just saying he was way to close and should have move further away like he was asked/told so as not to put the officer at risk while conducting his duties. In the end even the cop showed the high road by telling him to fix his tickets or else he could have gotten arrested on the spot. Many may feel that if that had happen it would have been petty, but the DB interjected himself into the situation and would have lost in court pleading false arrest.

Bottom line is this - Interfering with a LEO while he/she is conducting their duties is still a crime and is punishable by jail, fine or both.

***SMWS6TA*** · 07-23-2010, 09:11 AM

Originally Posted by pecha

all understandable but LEOs are expected to know the law, not to call people "fruit cakes", not to be using swear words towards citizens, correct?
I gave this video as an example how some LEOs are unprofessional and short tempered.
IMO the original video with the biker and offduty cop is a prime example of that

Unprofessional - Yes in this instance only, bad day

In the right as far as performing his duties - totally legit

We are all human and sometimes a stupid DB will get under your skin, yeah the cop should not have taken the bait, but if he didn't what would happen next time?

Also I totally disagree with Maryland totally blocking all video taping of police stops. Seems to me they are trying to make a point here.

***SMWS6TA*** · 07-23-2010, 09:18 AM

Originally Posted by EnjoiJoe

hopefully this cop gets shot in the head while making a stop

Where the hell does that come from?

**EnjoiJoe** · 07-23-2010, 09:19 AM

Originally Posted by SMWS6TA

Where the hell does that come from?

sorry wasnt me it was my dumbass friend sayin shit trying to get me banned

***SMWS6TA*** · 07-23-2010, 09:21 AM

Tell your douche bag "friend" not cool, just shows his level of immaturity.

Post like that will send you on permanent vacation

**98Hardtop** · 07-23-2010, 03:00 PM

Welcome to March of 2010. This is old news. Guys was jailed for 26 hours and then the judge who released him wondered why he was charged being he did not violate the law.

**IH8EVRY1** · 07-23-2010, 05:48 PM

Originally Posted by 98Hardtop

Welcome to March of 2010. This is old news. Guys was jailed for 26 hours and then the judge who released him wondered why he was charged being he did not violate the law.

It's the judges job to interpret the law, but if an officer wrote a good report to include details and reasoning(probably cause) he should be able to win that case.

"I was here, doing this and the charged offender approached. While trying to maintain the situation I was in, I became aware of his presence and actions. I asked him to leave because he was diverting my attention thus decreasing my ability to safely handle the original situation and my ability to mitigate the risk he was adding to himself by being that close. Again, I asked him to leave for his safety, my safety and all others involved safety as well. He refused to leave, which then began to hinder my ability to continue the case I was originally involved with by me having to look out for his well being and further reducing my ability to pay 100% attention to that original case. So...for his safety and mine, I detained him and charged him with misdemeanor obstruction of a peace officer."

Again, its the judge's job to interpret law, but if the officer knows law speaks/writes the report to include all of the key points in the verbiage of the law, it should be pretty simple. But then again, I've done that exact thing and had judges throw charges out because they thought I was stacking charges.

**RJWZ28** · 07-24-2010, 04:42 AM

Originally Posted by opie

As far as him pulling his weapon and pointing it at the ground. Do not see a problem. The dude on the bike knew he was a copper. Guy on bike being chased by one unmarked and a couple of marked. Yeah I would say he knew. But I supose some less than intelligent citizens could assume he was just another citizen that joined the posse or better yet this is how this robbers MO works. He robs people driving like an idiot while the coppers are after him.

Also the badge thing. See above first, but I supose he could have just yelled toward the biker and said wait a minute sir, I need to put my uniform on and then I will be right with you to rob ya.

My point was that it may have been more intelligent to annouce "state police" prior to or while drawing his gun, as opposed to his adding it as an afterthought while walking around the guy on the bike. Nothing illegal about it, I've just always been trained to announce myself first if possible to prevent misunderstandings.

**The Project** · 07-24-2010, 05:10 AM

Originally Posted by IH8EVRY1

It's the judges job to interpret the law, but if an officer wrote a good report to include details and reasoning(probably cause) he should be able to win that case.

"I was here, doing this and the charged offender approached. While trying to maintain the situation I was in, I became aware of his presence and actions. I asked him to leave because he was diverting my attention thus decreasing my ability to safely handle the original situation and my ability to mitigate the risk he was adding to himself by being that close. Again, I asked him to leave for his safety, my safety and all others involved safety as well. He refused to leave, which then began to hinder my ability to continue the case I was originally involved with by me having to look out for his well being and further reducing my ability to pay 100% attention to that original case. So...for his safety and mine, I detained him and charged him with misdemeanor obstruction of a peace officer."

Again, its the judge's job to interpret law, but if the officer knows law speaks/writes the report to include all of the key points in the verbiage of the law, it should be pretty simple. But then again, I've done that exact thing and had judges throw charges out because they thought I was stacking charges.

You WERE stacking charges....

**IH8EVRY1** · 07-24-2010, 05:31 AM

Originally Posted by The Project

You WERE stacking charges....

Not on the obstruction charges that I've charged people with in situations like this. The time I was accused of stacking was in a burglary that me and my partner caught them in the middle of it. One guy ran the other didn't. The one that didn't run got charged with burglary. The one that did wanted to fight when we caught up to him. By fight I don't mean, struggling to keep us from cuffing him. I mean, I caught him and he realized he wasn't going to out run me so he abruptly turned to fight. As in: Stopped running, turned towards me and lunged to attack me. We wrapped up MMA style for a minute before my partner could catch up. I can hold my own with most folks but this dude was sweaty and hard to hold on to and strung out with crazy strength. Off the drugs I'm probably 5 times stronger than this dude but on it and scared he was a hand full. Anyway, we got him under control and detained. I charged him with burglary (obvious) and misdemeanor obstruction for running when we identified ourselves and told them to get on the ground. The felony obstruction for fighting with a peace officer. When I searched him he had a baggie of weed and a crack pipe. So I charged him with possession of marijuana less than an ounce and possession of drug paraphernalia. All of which were separate actions. I didn't stack anything, I just applied what fit. It just so happened that there were several things that fit. The judge threw out all but burglary and felony obstruction.

I consider stacking charges to be when you pull someone over and they act like a jerk. So instead of just the speeding or failure to obey a traffic signal or whatever, you start looking for cracks in tail lights and tag lights out and how much tread is on their tires. That's stacking because someone had a bad attitude.

If I had been stacking on that dude I also would have charged him for not having an ID.

**98Hardtop** · 07-24-2010, 06:06 AM

The problem I have is that after he paid his speeding ticket fine and that was that. Fast forward to the following month, they came back after the fact and searched his house at 6:45 in the morning for 90 minutes and wouldn't let his mother go to work, nor the younger sister go to school just to get 4 computers because they found his video on youtube. They let him turn himself in later being he just had gall bladder surgery and was bandaged up. he turned himself in and spent 26 hours in jail. On top of that his bond was set 5 grand higher than what the maximum fine would have been for relating to the charge.

The Judge stated that for that State, the Police had no expectation of privacy in public and that is why he threw it out. The Police were being fucking pricks.

All this for a man who had a TS gov't clearance and was also in the military. I am sorry, but I am all for law enforcement and have walked their shoes, but this is some straight chickenshit. That man's career is ruined because some trooper overreacted to the situation and they knew he did and were afraid of the video bringing about some unwanted public scrutiny.

**IH8EVRY1** · 07-24-2010, 06:35 AM

Originally Posted by 98Hardtop

The problem I have is that after he paid his speeding ticket fine and that was that. Fast forward to the following month, they came back after the fact and searched his house at 6:45 in the morning for 90 minutes and wouldn't let his mother go to work, nor the younger sister go to school just to get 4 computers because they found his video on youtube. They let him turn himself in later being he just had gall bladder surgery and was bandaged up. he turned himself in and spent 26 hours in jail. On top of that his bond was set 5 grand higher than what the maximum fine would have been for relating to the charge.

The Judge stated that for that State, the Police had no expectation of privacy in public and that is why he threw it out. The Police were being fucking pricks.

All this for a man who had a TS gov't clearance and was also in the military. I am sorry, but I am all for law enforcement and have walked their shoes, but this is some straight chickenshit. That man's career is ruined because some trooper overreacted to the situation and they knew he did and were afraid of the video bringing about some unwanted public scrutiny.

Sorry, I thought we were still talking about the camera man that walked up and didn't leave when asked to. I agree with you that the officers in this case may have gone too far with the wiretapping. Obviously the judge did too. I still don't want my video taken, but that's a matter of my own opinion as I've said before.

My next question. How did this ruin his career? I'm in the military too and know a little about security clearances. I'm sure that it's a blemish for an security clearance investigation but it's an explainable blemish that the charge was dropped.

**Nhra Firebird** · 07-24-2010, 06:36 AM

The cop kinda looks like Cam02ss.

**98Hardtop** · 07-24-2010, 10:24 AM

Yep. You have one judge authorizing the search and another judge saying he did not violate anything

Originally Posted by IH8EVRY1

My next question. How did this ruin his career? I'm in the military too and know a little about security clearances. I'm sure that it's a blemish for an security clearance investigation but it's an explainable blemish that the charge was dropped.

He is a government contractor and in the National Guard. Anytime you have a TS clearance and you get arrested and a charge, that will significantly decrease his chances for another job offer in his field for a difference agency and it could affect his chances in currently holding the clearance. Some places may have a zero tolerance policy.

I am sure things are much different now than when I held my TS in the Marine Corps in the 90's and this would have definitely slowed the process down in getting the clearance if he was applying for the clearance.

**astyles** · 07-24-2010, 01:37 PM

if i werethe guy on the bike i would not have stopped .........fuck that asshole with the gun he could be joe anyone.....i'd have looked for a cop then seen what was going on

**SeVeReDiStOrTiOn** · 07-24-2010, 01:54 PM

Originally Posted by RJWZ28

My point was that it may have been more intelligent to annouce "state police" prior to or while drawing his gun, as opposed to his adding it as an afterthought while walking around the guy on the bike. Nothing illegal about it, I've just always been trained to announce myself first if possible to prevent misunderstandings.

Totally....the trooper was lucky the guy on the bike wasn't carrying. That situation could've gone really bad for everyone involved. From the bikers point of view he would've just been defending his life from some guy jumping out of a car drawing a pistol. Hopefully they both learned something.

**02blkws6** · 07-24-2010, 10:58 PM

The only thing I saw wrong in the op video was that the officer didn't identify himself. I'll admit to being stupid on a bike (130 in a 55). I didn't know I was being chased. The officer was a decent distance behind me and didn't catch up until I was slowing down to enter town. I didn't take exception to having a gun drawn on me, told to get on the ground, cuffed and put in the back of the squad car. I was cooperative, polite, and agreed that my actions were dumb. I caught a break from the LEO and was written a ticket for 94 in a 55. In IL more than 39 over gets a free ride to jail.

I always pay a lawyer to take care of my tickets to keep a clean driving record.