I have to state this (Not bullshit)

[NICKLE57]

I'll say it again. Buy american, buy Toyota.

[Max Power]

The cars may be made in the US, but most of the money goes overseas back to the headquarters of Toyota and all that other bullshit. I agree food is a big trading item, but oil is just as big. I do like this discussion, without people acting like idiots, lets keep it going.

Go look at TM on Yahoo Finance.

The largest institutional and individual investors in Toyota are... American.

[bmyers]

I'll say it again. Buy american, buy Toyota.

I will not ever consider a toyota american. i do not care that it is built on our soil. GM and Ford cars and trucks are stitched into the history of our country.

GM converts 100% of its production to the war effort. During World War II, GM delivers more than $12,300,000,000 worth of war material to lead the Allied war effort, including airplane engines, airplanes and parts, trucks, tanks, marine diesels, guns, shells and miscellaneous products.

Would toyota do that?? Being built on our soil does not make something "American". It means they have a defense when someone calls it an import, nothing more.

http://www.gm.com/company/corp_info/...gmhis1940.html

[my5thNewUsernameHere]

i have always liked the gm interiors, but that is a matter of opinion. I will stick with the General

Generally, one must admit that they have much less overall quality when compared to imports. However, if you work on cars a lot that's a plus because they are easier to dismantle and reassemble for custom work.

I've always driven GM, but my wife drives a Toyota and it's worlds ahead of any GM car I've ever driven as far as quality and refinement.

FWIW, my Grandfather swears that he'll never drive a Japanese car noting that he spent years fighting with them during WWII.

Just keep in mind that we are more than ever embracing a global economy. This is in part due to the technologies produced in the last 100 or so years. The most basic economics classes explain the concepts of absolute and comparative advantages.

I'd prefer to always buy goods produced 100% in the USA, but it's not practical or realistic in modern times.

[shadegray]

I will not ever consider a toyota american. i do not care that it is built on our soil. GM and Ford cars and trucks are stitched into the history of our country.

GM converts 100% of its production to the war effort. During World War II, GM delivers more than $12,300,000,000 worth of war material to lead the Allied war effort, including airplane engines, airplanes and parts, trucks, tanks, marine diesels, guns, shells and miscellaneous products.

Would toyota do that?? Being built on our soil does not make something "American". It means they have a defense when someone calls it an import, nothing more.

http://www.gm.com/company/corp_info/...gmhis1940.html

That was a long time ago. The people who did that are long dead and through trading and turns of ownership it's a new company now. And they all own stock in each other. GM and Ford build cars in foreign countries. Foreign makers build cars in the U.S. and have huge corporate headquarters in the U.S. GM is a partial owner of Suzuki. Ford owns Jaguar and Volvo. It's not as simple as it used to be. So what makes it American? It's just a name now.

You can try to cling onto the 1940s, but it' 2007. Politics change real quick. People who were enemies before are now some of our strongest allies. The japs are very likely to side with us in the event of another war. The Germans aren't nazis anymore. The russians were our allies during the 40's, then became our most feared enemies right afterwards.

[bmyers]

That was a long time ago. The people who did that are long dead and through trading and turns of ownership it's a new company now. And they all own stock in each other. GM and Ford build cars in foreign countries. Foreign makers build cars in the U.S. They have huge corporate headquarters in the U.S. GM is a partial owner of Suzuki. Ford owns Jaguar and Volvo. It's not as simple as it used to be. So what makes it American? It's just a name.

You can try to cling onto the 1940s, but it' 2007 now. Politics change real quick. People who were enemies before are now some of our strongest allies. The japs are very likely to side with us in the event of another war. The Germans aren't nazis anymore.

it was an example i used to show the history of one of the two companies i mentioned, not the reason alone i buy gm vehicles

[shadegray]

I know man, but what are you calling American? GM and Ford outsource their jobs to foreigners. Japs are sourcing jobs here. Manufacturers with american names own manufacturers with jap names and german names and british names and manufacturers with german names and jap names own each other and back and forth and vice versa. That GM and Ford whose history you're talking about doesn't exist anymore. Chopped into pieces in the stock market and trading and owning parts of itself with parts of other auto manufacturers with foreign sounding names, building cars in foreign countries which they import into here. They ain't run by good ol' boys in the USA taking care of other americans, but just a floating mess of parts on the world's stock market. They even change their names to make things more confusing. Is Lexus american? If not because they're owned by Toyota, then does that mean you think Jaguar and Volvo are American because they're owned by Ford?

[bmyers]

my problem with japanese cars is that the japanese do not buy are cars. capatilsm is a wonderful thing but it is not fair to the american companies that a foreign competitor of theirs is not playing by the same rules. I have no problem with mercedes because we sell cars in europe.

this is a previous post of mine in this topic there is alot leading up to this but was curious your argument to this

[shadegray]

this is a previous post of mine in this topic there is alot leading up to this but was curious your argument to this

How are they "our" cars? They're not built here. The companies that you're calling "ours" also own and trade and are traded by other companies that have foreign names. And there's no rules. Capitalism is lassiz faire, free market. If you want to make rules saying I bought from you so you have to buy from me, that's communism or socialism, not capitalism. How'd you like it if someone bought your z28 and then said you had to buy his house now to be fair?

[bmyers]

How are they "our" cars? They're not built here. The companies that you're calling "ours" also own and are traded by companies that you would think are foreign. And there's no rules. Capitalism is lassiz faire, free market. If you want to make rules saying I bought from you so you have to buy from me, that's communism or socialism, not capitalism. How'd you like it if someone bought your ls1 and then said you had to buy his house now to be fair?

import to export ratio. you are taking it out of context

[bmyers]

i notice you own a bike in your sig. i personally would buy a buell, for the same reasons stated above.

[shadegray]

import to export ratio. you are taking it out of context

The stuff you're saying is ours is also imported and the stuff you're saying is theirs are not. The only difference is the names sound different but pretty much all the major auto manufacturers exist in huge global market buying and selling each other. So is Lexus american? Is Volvo and Jaguar?


And a buell? Are you fucking kidding me? I wouldn't ride a buell! America doesn't make any sportbikes, or bikes at all that can compete with the rest of the world, but don't even get me started on that subject. It's like me telling you to buy a Kia!

[bmyers]

The stuff you're saying is ours is also imported and the stuff you're saying is theirs are not. The only difference is the names sound different but pretty much all the major auto manufacturers exist in huge global market buying and selling each other. So is Lexus american? Is Volvo and Jaguar?


And a buell? Are you fucking kidding me? I wouldn't ride a buell! America doesn't make any sportbikes, or bikes at all that can compete with the rest of the world, but don't even get me started on that subject. It's like me telling you to buy a Kia!

http://www.wcit.org/resources/public..._picture97.htm
1997 is the most current one i could find. and read my post clearly i said I would buy a buell for the reasons I have already posted. I have not said YOU should buy a buell.
as far as a huge global market goes we are doing all of the importing and none of the exporting.

[shadegray]

http://www.wcit.org/resources/public..._picture97.htm
1997 is the most current one i could find. and read my post clearly i said I would buy a buell for the reasons I have already posted. I have not said YOU should buy a buell.
as far as a huge global market goes we are doing all of the importing and none of the exporting.

What about it? You still didn't answer my question. Is Lexus american? How about Jaguar and Volvo? It doesn't matter whether we import or export more cars. How many of those imports are imported by GM and Ford under their name? You're not supporting americans by buying from them or taking jobs from americans by buying toyotas.


If you bought a buell you'd be a joke. It's like bringing a kia sorento to a corvette meet. And it's still assembled from foreign parts. But let's not talk about that. Just leave it be that the jap sport bikes are on average 3 to 5 times more powerful than the american bikes, and usually cost less and handle better.

[NdrSiege]

In case you haven't seen the video. Toyota engineering:

The Hilux: Part 1 Part 2

[XtinKt]

I get far better service on my new New Nissan Armada than my mom does on her Brand New Corvette.

The Nissan dealership here is awsome. GM sucks at service.

and that is why i will buy a Titan.

[gwballin]

Business is business.

If someone feels that they receive some intangible utility from buying what they consider to be an "american" car more power to them.

I have never owned a "foreign" car (depending on where you fall in the debate about the GTO) but not because I receive the utility I mentioned before.

I have only ever bought the car that best fits my wants at the price I could afford, they just all happen to be "american" cars.

[djvaly]

Business is business.

If someone feels that they receive some intangible utility from buying what they consider to be an "american" car more power to them.

I have never owned a "foreign" car (depending on where you fall in the debate about the GTO) but not because I receive the utility I mentioned before.

I have only ever bought the car that best fits my wants at the price I could afford, they just all happen to be "american" cars.

I agree, buy what you want and afford. American cars are cheaper on average but that's not everything. service, car life span/reliability, luxury etc etc are also factors...everybody has different taste and $ to spend.

[bmyers]

What about it? You still didn't answer my question. Is Lexus american? How about Jaguar and Volvo? It doesn't matter whether we import or export more cars. How many of those imports are imported by GM and Ford under their name? You're not supporting americans by buying from them or taking jobs from americans by buying toyotas.


If you bought a buell you'd be a joke. It's like bringing a kia sorento to a corvette meet. And it's still assembled from foreign parts. But let's not talk about that. Just leave it be that the jap sport bikes are on average 3 to 5 times more powerful than the american bikes, and usually cost less and handle better.

enlighten me

[shadegray]

enlighten me

They build cars in other countries and bring them here.