Gasoline

**Goat-E** · 08-05-2009, 02:26 AM

I work in the fuel business and this is my opinion as far as gasoline brands are concerned. This is pure "opinion" based on 2 years in the fuel transportation business. I posted this same info on another forum and thought some might be interested here. I live in South Florida. Some of these brands might not be in your region.
Chevron is real anal about their product. Texaco is also Chevron but depending where you get it, it could be anything in the ground but still has the Techron additive.
Mobil which is also Exxon is good also.
Shell has gotten better recently. It's also the same gas distributed by Circle K stores and is usually cheaper there. It used to leave a yellow film on my fill valves (possibly sulfur?) but not anymore.
Since Amoco became BP they haven't been maintaining their refineries that well and have had some "incidents". I wouldn't trust them IMO.
Sunoco buys their fuel from wherever they can broker it cheapest. It could be anything on any given day. (possibly different in the North East)
Valero=crap
Hess=crap
Marathon=crap
Trans Montaigne=crap
Citgo=crap
Race Track=could be anything=crap. Just like Sunoco
U gas=crap
Coastal=crap (but my IROC Daytona used to love it back in the day)
Presently my car seems to run best on Shell and I can get it cheaper than Mobil or Chevron. I use Mobil second and Chevron third. Not that I have anything against the the quality of Chevron fuel. It's personal, I hate the attitude of their terminal operators. And it takes two to three times as long to load a truck at their terminal due to their set up, procedures, antiquated system ect. Whereby costing me time and money so I figure if I don't buy their product I won't have to load there as often. Plus they killed a lot of people in Ecuador by neglecting the environment. (if you have some sort of political bent against this I suggest "You slow down on your rush to get into HELL"

) Just A-holes all around.
I operate in South Florida and these are the products I deal with. Things may function differently elsewhere but this is the way they are in this area.
How's that for some insider down low? (I'm going to change my picture now for fear of getting my car pelted with rocks

on my way to and from work

)

**SHines-IT** · 08-05-2009, 05:26 AM

Wow, I thought BP with Invirograte (SP) was good shit, also figured Amaco BP was alright... Hmmm, note to self stay far the fuck away... I use to aways only put 93 BP or Mobil in my car, now I know.

**shady milkman** · 08-05-2009, 05:31 AM

i pretty much exclusively use shell

**NoscamaroSS** · 08-05-2009, 08:41 AM

Around here, most fuel (regarless of brand) comes from the same refinery (Valero).

**dpeach** · 08-05-2009, 12:27 PM

My car runs much better and i get better fuel mileage with shell. If there isn't one close then i am just as happy running mobil. Those are the only 2 I will use.

**Z28_Driver** · 08-05-2009, 12:45 PM

My car runs great on Shell gas too!
Circle K works good.
Every time I put BP or Sunoco in a car over the years I have had problems with dirty fuel injectors or on the carb truck a rough idle and hard starting. Even my garden tractor hates BP gas. Maybe it has to do with the extra ethanol they use at BP and Sunoco.

**Goat-E** · 08-05-2009, 01:23 PM

I should add that down here we rum (it's an alcohol joke) E-10 exclusive. U gas has E-85.

**foxman92** · 08-05-2009, 02:23 PM

yea ever since bp bought out or joined with amaco i should say, they dont really wanna keep up on the refinery maintance..

**Goat-E** · 08-05-2009, 03:18 PM

Originally Posted by Z28_Driver

My car runs great on Shell gas too!
Circle K works good.
Every time I put BP or Sunoco in a car over the years I have had problems with dirty fuel injectors or on the carb truck a rough idle and hard starting. Even my garden tractor hates BP gas. Maybe it has to do with the extra ethanol they use at BP and Sunoco.

Down here Circle K is the exact same as Shell. Two years ago Shell was garbage but they have really turned things around. I get the best fuel mileage and "perceived" (because Ronco hasn't invented the pocket Dynoman yet. C'mon Popiel, what's the hold up?) performance with Shell. I get Circle K because it's the same for less. Plus they are REALLY uptight about their tanks. If you detect ANY water in a Circle K tank they will refuse the load to another store and clear their tank. FYI Ethanol is the same as drygas. The alcohol breaks up the water and mixes it with the fuel whereas the water used to sit on the bottom. We test for a tolerable measure of this mixture now. If the tolerances are off we divert the load and pump out the tank. Being a gearhead I do my best to make sure that I adhere to tight quality standards. I can't speak for other drivers . . .

**Z28_Driver** · 08-09-2009, 03:14 PM

We have E-85 available up here at some stations. E-10 is in all the pumps at Sunoco and BP in the Toledo area.
Drygas is a water remover like STP gas treatment?
A bottle of this diluted in a tank of gas is a lot less than 10%. The amount of ethanol in the gasoline is probably more to blame. A small amount removes water, a lot causes a rough running engine.

**Smittro** · 08-09-2009, 03:44 PM

I used Sunoco gas exclusively for years. Last year my wife and I switched to Exxon and within one tank full I noticed a real difference. Smoother power through the revs and less of a bad smell out the pipes too. Now nothing but Exxon goes into my cars. Never tried Shell cause there's only one of them around here and it's just out of the way for us really. Maybe I missed it but have you run Gulf before and if so how was it? We have a gulf staition just up the hill here. You probably remember it. Up on Freeport road in New Ken. Yup it's still there and it's the only one I've seen in years around. Never have I tried it though just wondering if it's any good? The wife filled the Z34 up with that garbage @ sheetz once. Causing me to have to drain a full tank of gas out of it. I mean it was bad, way bad. She drove the Z34 home and told me something was wrong with the Z. I go out and hit the key it would'nt start!! Finally on the 3rd try it fired, and can tell you what bud! It ran so damn bad I thought she had popped my motor.. I pulled the quick disconnect line @ the filter and put a cutoff milk jug under and keyed the ignition. Yellow, Yellow fuel!?! Even smelled bad too. Never again from sheeze ever!

**Goat-E** · 08-10-2009, 01:51 AM

Originally Posted by Smittro

I used Sunoco gas exclusively for years. Last year my wife and I switched to Exxon and within one tank full I noticed a real difference. Smoother power through the revs and less of a bad smell out the pipes too. Now nothing but Exxon goes into my cars. Never tried Shell cause there's only one of them around here and it's just out of the way for us really. Maybe I missed it but have you run Gulf before and if so how was it? We have a gulf staition just up the hill here. You probably remember it. Up on Freeport road in New Ken. Yup it's still there and it's the only one I've seen in years around. Never have I tried it though just wondering if it's any good? The wife filled the Z34 up with that garbage @ sheetz once. Causing me to have to drain a full tank of gas out of it. I mean it was bad, way bad. She drove the Z34 home and told me something was wrong with the Z. I go out and hit the key it would'nt start!! Finally on the 3rd try it fired, and can tell you what bud! It ran so damn bad I thought she had popped my motor.. I pulled the quick disconnect line @ the filter and put a cutoff milk jug under and keyed the ignition. Yellow, Yellow fuel!?! Even smelled bad too. Never again from sheeze ever!

Gulf!? That name makes me want to fire up the 917 flat 12 and roar down the Mulsanne straight at 240mph! Shell took them over way back in the day but according to WIKI that is no longer the case. Stick with the Exxon.
I've never really been in New Ken for any great length of time. Only passed through. Last time I was in the Burgh my Bro lived in Murrysville. I haven't been there in over 6 years. I'm sure I haven't missed much.

**02WS6SSZ71** · 08-10-2009, 10:20 AM

I always use BP gas in my cars and truck because they're the only ones selling 92 octane in Kansas City....evreyone else has 91. I also heard, but have no proof, that BP is the only gas station that doesn't have ethanol in their premium gas around here. Either way, I add some Chevron Techron to my tank every few fill-ups, and my vehichles all seem happy.

**gbahnick** · 08-10-2009, 12:52 PM

I have run BP 93 octane exclusively in my Z28 and the wife's Buick GS for years with no problems. I also use Chevron Techron every few fill ups.

**Firebirdjones** · 08-10-2009, 01:08 PM

When I lived in Ohio,,,for the last 25 years I used nothing but Sunoco fuel. They were the only station that carried 94 octane and my cars loved it. Ran nearly 11:1 compression with a steel head on that stuff,,,with a carefull tune I never got a complaint.

I experimented with BP and Shell but just never had the same results. Unfortunately towards the end of my stay in Ohio most of the Sunoco's were getting rid of their 94 octane and switching to 93. I struggled the last couple of years driving out of my way to get to some of the last 94 octane Sunoco's. I believe the Sunoco gas started to go down hill at this point,,my buddy owned a Sunoco station back in Ohio, when it changed hands they were forced to reopen with 93 only and delete the 94 stuff. They have obviously changed suppliers and/or methods within the last couple of years,,,,but for 20+ years that was the gas for me.

Moved to Arizona a year ago,,,,all they have here is 91 tops. That's it. I had to detune all the cars to make them happy. One is still not very happy on this crap. The only station I even recognize out here is Shell. Everything else is foreign to me like the Circle K's, and Chevron's etc...

So I stick to what I know and mainly fill at the Shell stations, although I have stopped at a Chevron on occasion experimenting. But I can't really find a nitch station that has an advantage, they are all 91 here, and all my cars complained after being tuned on 94.

My humble opinion??? It's all crap,,,some more than others. Pump gas just isn't what it used to be. It's only going to get worse with this tree hugging government we now have.

**00LS12LS6Z28** · 08-10-2009, 01:31 PM

For my car I try to use Mobil and now Exxon. Since all the Mobil stations have turned into Exxon and if their was an Exxon down the street, it was turned into a Sunoco. I thought Sunoco was good and I have used them on occasion as well as shell. I guess I will stay away from Sunoco. I always thought that Texaco, Chevron and BP weren't good. Especially since this one random gas station turned to a Texaco. That guy always has watered down gas. And he doesn't even have a car wash. My parents truck fell victim to that gas station with all the knocking in the gas tanking. I was told not to get gas from a station that also has a car wash, especially in the winter. The water gets into the gas lines.

**Goat-E** · 08-11-2009, 12:19 AM

I am curious as to what you guys consider "watered down gas". Water and gasoline do not mix. Water is heavier than gasoline and falls to the bottom of the tank. Where I live any water detected to be more than an inch and a half and we are to call into dispatch and they will direct us to another station with the fuel. We do NOT drop into tanks with any greater amount. This is a history lesson for now in Florida, all gasoline has a 10% ethanol blend. Ethanol is grain alcohol. It can be made from sugar, corn, switchgrass, wheat ect. When you put "Dry gas" in your tank to make the water mix with gasoline and be carried out of your engine that is Ethanol or some other type of alcohol. We now test with a reformulated paste for an unsafe blend/amount of water in the fuel. If this is detected we immediately call dispatch and are redirected and the tanks are purged. Most stations these days have a computer that gauges the fuel level in the tank and other than deliveries the tanks are never opened. This computer also gauges the water level (if it is separated and on the bottom) as well as temperature. Fuel tanker drivers are about the only people that come in contact with the tanks. Most owners of stations and employees are too lazy to touch them. Believe me it's like pulling teeth to get a manual tank reading from these people. I can get suspended or fired for dropping into contaminated fuel. There are agents that circulate regularly through stations and test the fuel for contamination and proper octane levels for the type of fuel.
Now for the real clincher ethanol is an octane booster. When we load gas it says on the bill of lading 84 octane gasoline then when mixed with ethanol this brings the octane up to 87. There are several things/elements that can raise octane but ethanol is one of the best. Pure ethanol has a RON rating of 116, xylene has a RON of 117, toluene has a RON of 114. Those are your three highest octane values. The things that are going to cause a "bad gas" situation are the lack of anti knock additives with impurities that have not been refined out of the base fuel. Lead used to be added as an anti knock agent but since being outlawed companies have been forced to develop other means. I would love to give a whole dissertation on the history of fuel but they make SCHOOLS for that. FYI the original Model T Ford could be adapted to run on ethanol but thanks to prohibition and John David Rockefeller (owner of Standard oil. His grandson David

owns JP Morgan Chase and Citicorp banks and is quite the political meddler and a globalist. OH how I could go on about this scumbag!) we now run mainly petroleum based fuels.
A word to the wise . . . LEARN SOME HISTORY PEOPLE!!! Anything else? Now tell me about this "Watered down gasoline" it sounds fascinating.

(I wholly admit to being a brainy prick and I'm proud)

**blackSS01** · 08-11-2009, 12:25 AM

Ran BP 93 in my car for years with no issues. Its the only gas I can get around here with NO Ethanol so I'm all aboard on it.

**Goat-E** · 08-11-2009, 12:35 AM

Originally Posted by blackSS01

Ran BP 93 in my car for years with no issues. Its the only gas I can get around here with NO Ethanol so I'm all aboard on it.

The initial difference that you may experience with an E-10 blend is due to your gas tank having some residual water that will blend with the gasoline but is usually gone in 2 or 3 tankfulls. There is also the EFI computer remapping to the difference in power availability. Ethanol has less energy by volume but can be run under higher compression due to it's knock resistance. Ethanol and various derivatives are run exclusively in a multitude of high performance applications. It will get you less mileage per gallon but can be run in a much more radical application.

**blackSS01** · 08-11-2009, 01:22 AM

Originally Posted by Goat-E

The initial difference that you may experience with an E-10 blend is due to your gas tank having some residual water that will blend with the gasoline but is usually gone in 2 or 3 tankfulls. There is also the EFI computer remapping to the difference in power availability. Ethanol has less energy by volume but can be run under higher compression due to it's knock resistance. Ethanol and various derivatives are run exclusively in a multitude of high performance applications. It will get you less mileage per gallon but can be run in a much more radical application.

Hmmm..... Food for thought. I'm not a big gas man but did know about the higher compression. I think, search would be my friend