Buying a truck, opinions wanted.

So I am buying a truck since I need something that will tow my TA in an enclosed trailer. The truck needs to be awd or 4wd and I have it narrowed down to two different trucks. One is a 2007 Sierra Denali with tons of options but only a 8500# towing capacity and the other is a 2012 Silverado with a few less options but with a max towing capacity of 10500# and a 5.3. The Denali has 26000 miles and the Silverado has 46000 miles. The truck will be a daily driver and I may off road occasionally but probably nothing too crazy. I wouldn't be towing on a regular basis either, probably just a few times a year. What would you guys go with between these two choices? Here are the trucks:

http://i737.photobucket.com/albums/x...psddbf5328.jpg
http://i737.photobucket.com/albums/x...ps60dab80a.png

Whichever is cheaper. 8500 is enough towing capacity unless you want to start pickups and suburbans

The 2012 is cheaper but I just keep wondering if I'll miss or want the power the Denali has over the 5.3 down the road. It is also only $2000 cheaper.

Less miles and the 6.2 and a nicer interior... I'll take the Denali. And the douchebag that leveled that Silverado put the front end up too high, looks retarded. Not to mention when you were towing the truck would be waaay down in back, which is shit for towing for several reasons..


And I wouldn't do any real "offroading" in either of those trucks.

I was expecting the Denali to be less. Hell I'd pay the 2K for the Denali over the 12 then

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Originally Posted by 5.0THIS

Less miles and the 6.2 and a nicer interior... I'll take the Denali. And the douchebag that leveled that Silverado put the front end up too high, looks retarded. Not to mention when you were towing the truck would be waaay down in back, which is shit for towing for several reasons..


And I wouldn't do any real "offroading" in either of those trucks.

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I am pretty sure that is factory height. My work truck is a 12 2500 HD and it sits the same. One thing I would suggest no matter which truck you get, look at the tires closely. I change the work truck tires as soon as I can when I get a new one. I put Yokohoma Geolanders on them. Great tire, tons of plies. Remember, tires and brakes are your only defense on the road.

Well I looked at the 2012 and it sucked compared to the Denali. The 2012 is a LTZ with the max towing package but it felt like a brick lol compared to the Denali. The Denali felt much more nimble kind of like a sports car without feeling the road as much, that is the best I can describe it anyway. As for the "off roading" it won't be what most would consider true off roading, more of gravel trails with some bumpy trails with steep declines and indents in the road due to some of my outdoor activities I participate in. Thanks for the opinions guys, I am going to hopefully get the Denali tomorrow morning.

Just walk in and offer them the same price as that or even less. If its been on the lot for awhile they'll probably take it

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Originally Posted by GTP231

Just walk in and offer them the same price as that or even less. If its been on the lot for awhile they'll probably take it

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The Denali is at carmax and I don't think they haggle but I could still attempt it.

I'd go with a 6.2 over a 5.3 personally. I almost bought one a few years ago and my mom's escalade had the same motor and it was a beast for how heavy it was. Great motor imo.

Isn't the Denali full time AWD? If so that means no locking diffs which does suck in certain places. Not many people go to these places though. But even downhill on a trail won't be as easy. That is also why the tow rating is 2klbs lower than a truck with a 5.3 liter. The 6.2 is a badass engine but it only takes premium. The 5.3 can run any grade and e85.

Personally though if I were buying a truck to tow a enclose trailer/car/tools etc I would be looking for a HD. Both these trucks can tow what you want them too but there will be a lot of kick downing in gears and you could be getting close to their limits. Depending on trailer size it can be anywhere from 2500-4klbs with a 3500lbs car in it and tools.... you are getting close ot that 8500lbs mark.

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

Isn't the Denali full time AWD? If so that means no locking diffs which does suck in certain places. Not many people go to these places though. But even downhill on a trail won't be as easy. That is also why the tow rating is 2klbs lower than a truck with a 5.3 liter. The 6.2 is a badass engine but it only takes premium. The 5.3 can run any grade and e85.

Personally though if I were buying a truck to tow a enclose trailer/car/tools etc I would be looking for a HD. Both these trucks can tow what you want them too but there will be a lot of kick downing in gears and you could be getting close to their limits. Depending on trailer size it can be anywhere from 2500-4klbs with a 3500lbs car in it and tools.... you are getting close ot that 8500lbs mark.

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Yes it is awd it can tow less because it is an 07 and the 5.3 is a 2012 with the max towing package, the Denali's towing rating was increased in 2009. I have also found a 6.2 Silverado I may look at which has the max towing package as well but is 4wd. I will only tow probably a few times a year and the trails I will go on likely will be fine as I see people and have been with people with awd or even fwd go down them with no issues. The trails really are only considered off road because they are physically off the road but other than that they are really not true off roading.

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

Yes it is awd it can tow less because it is an 07 and the 5.3 is a 2012 with the max towing package, the Denali's towing rating was increased in 2009. I have also found a 6.2 Silverado I may look at which has the max towing package as well but is 4wd. I will only tow probably a few times a year and the trails I will go on likely will be fine as I see people and have been with people with awd or even fwd go down them with no issues. The trails really are only considered off road because they are physically off the road but other than that they are really not true off roading.

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I dont know about everybody else, but I still prefer a Sierra over a Silverado...I like the way they look over a silverado. Plus, the denali is practically an escalade that was shoved into a Sierra's body so the luxury factor is pretty high with one of those.

I do agree with Zinergy tho...if you are doing a fully enclosed trailer with a car and a tool box inside you really might want to consider a 2500 and up. Braking will play a big factor as well...with the 2500's you are also going to usually have a control box for your trailer brakes from the factory as well.

With that said, you can find 1500 HD's floating around...all the 2500 drive train stuff but has the 6.2 instead of a diesel.

HDs are not really around in my area I was actually originally looking for one but I have yet to find one. I too prefer the Sierra to the Silverado. The trailers I have been looking at are a max of 7000 fully loaded with my car and everything in it. Others are around 6500 fully loaded. 2500s aren't in the budget and keep in mind guys this will be something I drive every day and I do not want to get a diesel as I feel like it would be a waste when I am not using it to it's potential since I would rarely tow. Now if I towed on a regular basis I surely would get a 2500. I wonder if you could upgrade a 1500 to the HD status as well lol?

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

Yes it is awd it can tow less because it is an 07 and the 5.3 is a 2012 with the max towing package, the Denali's towing rating was increased in 2009. I have also found a 6.2 Silverado I may look at which has the max towing package as well but is 4wd. I will only tow probably a few times a year and the trails I will go on likely will be fine as I see people and have been with people with awd or even fwd go down them with no issues. The trails really are only considered off road because they are physically off the road but other than that they are really not true off roading.

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The AWD models always have a lower tow rating because the AWD is always in place. My 2002 silverado 1500 is rated to tow 8800lbs with the 5.3 6.5ft bed, 3.73s and tow package. With the 4.10 gear package in 2002 the rating was like 9200 or 9400 can't remember. The Denali got a towing bump to 9200lbs in 09 as you stated. But that is still 1300lbs under the same size 4WD truck with the little 5.3 in it.

Between those two choices, I'd take the 2012 over that 2007 every time, 6.2 vs. 5.3 or not.

It's five years newer, it will hold it's value longer, and has a better towing rating, even if it's only used for towing a few times per year.

What are the prices of both? You said there's a $2,000 dollar difference, but didn't say the actual price. If they want anywhere near $30K, I'd spend a few extra bucks and buy a new one.

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

HDs are not really around in my area I was actually originally looking for one but I have yet to find one. I too prefer the Sierra to the Silverado. The trailers I have been looking at are a max of 7000 fully loaded with my car and everything in it. Others are around 6500 fully loaded. 2500s aren't in the budget and keep in mind guys this will be something I drive every day and I do not want to get a diesel as I feel like it would be a waste when I am not using it to it's potential since I would rarely tow. Now if I towed on a regular basis I surely would get a 2500. I wonder if you could upgrade a 1500 to the HD status as well lol?

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So the trailer max gross weight is 7k? So that means trailer weight+vehicle weight+ anything else cannot exceed 7k? I hope these are light trailers.

I am pretty sure the 1500 is a different frame than the 2500 depending on the year. But you can upgrade the rear diff, axles to 8 or 10 lugs, bigger brakes etc.

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

I wonder if you could upgrade a 1500 to the HD status as well lol?

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Yes, you can get a HD in a 1500.

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Originally Posted by FasstChevys

Between those two choices, I'd take the 2012 over that 2007 every time, 6.2 vs. 5.3 or not.

It's five years newer, it will hold it's value longer, and has a better towing rating, even if it's only used for towing a few times per year.

What are the prices of both? You said there's a $2,000 dollar difference, but didn't say the actual price. If they want anywhere near $30K, I'd spend a few extra bucks and buy a new one.

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The Denali is $34000 and the 2012 is $31000 the level of trim for these for a new one would be around $45000 to 50000 lol at least in my area.

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Originally Posted by FasstChevys

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

I wonder if you could upgrade a 1500 to the HD status as well lol?

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Yes, you can get a HD in a 1500.

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I know you can get a HD in a 1500 I just wasn't sure if what makes a 1500 HD could be swapped over to a standard 1500.

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

HDs are not really around in my area I was actually originally looking for one but I have yet to find one. I too prefer the Sierra to the Silverado. The trailers I have been looking at are a max of 7000 fully loaded with my car and everything in it. Others are around 6500 fully loaded. 2500s aren't in the budget and keep in mind guys this will be something I drive every day and I do not want to get a diesel as I feel like it would be a waste when I am not using it to it's potential since I would rarely tow. Now if I towed on a regular basis I surely would get a 2500. I wonder if you could upgrade a 1500 to the HD status as well lol?

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So the trailer max gross weight is 7k? So that means trailer weight+vehicle weight+ anything else cannot exceed 7k? I hope these are light trailers.

I am pretty sure the 1500 is a different frame than the 2500 depending on the year. But you can upgrade the rear diff, axles to 8 or 10 lugs, bigger brakes etc.

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I'll have to look at the gross vehicle weight ratio but what I was saying that the most weight I would have including the trailer and everything in it would be 7000 but probably closer to 6500 as the trailers I have been looking at are around 2500 to 3000 pounds. I am new to this trailering stuff so please inform me of all of the considerations that need to be taken into account if I am glazing over something.

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

I'll have to look at the gross vehicle weight ratio but what I was saying that the most weight I would have including the trailer and everything in it would be 7000 but probably closer to 6500 as the trailers I have been looking at are around 2500 to 3000 pounds. I am new to this trailering stuff so please inform me of all of the considerations that need to be taken into account if I am glazing over something.

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If the trailer is 3k and your vehicle is 3500 that is 6500 right there. Without any tools, tires, compressors etc. So I guess it depends on how much stuff you want to load into the trailer.

The tow rating on these trucls might only be 8500-10500 but they can tow a lot more. It just depends on how comfortable you want to be while towing. I tow a 6k camper(when loaded). And when it is windy, or a semi flys by, over decent bumps, or I am going up hill I can definately tell it is back there. I mean my truck tows it fine but not as nice a my buddies 2500HD did when I used it once. It wasn't the power my truck was missing, it was the weight and suspension.

I have a friend who tows a huge enclosed trailer with a stock car and a neon race car. Tires, parts, tools. Thing has to weigh 10-12k. He tows it with his 1999 ford e150. The movement and push and pull just doesn't bother some people as much as others.

Talk about a kite going down the road



**** NWS ****
This should settle your decision
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UfHtcUZXljw

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

The Denali is $34000 and the 2012 is $31000 the level of trim for these for a new one would be around $45000 to 50000 lol at least in my area.


I know you can get a HD in a 1500 I just wasn't sure if what makes a 1500 HD could be swapped over to a standard 1500.

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My best friend just bought a 2014 1500 LTZ for $34,000. True story. The sticker was $42,700, and with the rebates, etc, etc, he bought it for that price. You could buy a pickup out here, have it shipped out to you for $1,500 bucks and be WAY ahead.

To me, $34K for that truck is a joke, and a rip off - especially for being a 2007.

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Originally Posted by FasstChevys

My best friend just bought a 2014 1500 LTZ for $34,000. True story. The sticker was $42,700, and with the rebates, etc, etc, he bought it for that price. You could buy a pickup out here, have it shipped out to you for $1,500 bucks and be WAY ahead.

To me, $34K for that truck is a joke, and a rip off - especially for being a 2007.

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Yep because of DENALI. Those are as he said 50k+ trucks. All the way up to 70k for a diesel with the entertainment package etc.

I do agree though if you can get a brand new 1500 for 34k out the door that is a better deal than a 2012 for 31k or a 2007 for 32k. And you will probably get a better rate as it is brand new.

I seriously want to know where you are finding them for that. The cheapest I have found is 39k with just the base ltz with no additional options. I would love one of the brand new ones but I currently can't get more than a certain amount of a loan. With the rebates are those applied to the price before the loan?

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Originally Posted by FasstChevys

My best friend just bought a 2014 1500 LTZ for $34,000. True story. The sticker was $42,700, and with the rebates, etc, etc, he bought it for that price. You could buy a pickup out here, have it shipped out to you for $1,500 bucks and be WAY ahead.

To me, $34K for that truck is a joke, and a rip off - especially for being a 2007.

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get the f*ck out of here!!! damn thats a good deal...

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

I seriously want to know where you are finding them for that. The cheapest I have found is 39k with just the base ltz with no additional options. I would love one of the brand new ones but I currently can't get more than a certain amount of a loan. With the rebates are those applied to the price before the loan?

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If you can wait, wait for truck month sales or fathers day sales or presidents day sales. This is when I see 8k in rebates on new trucks.

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

If you can wait, wait for truck month sales or fathers day sales or presidents day sales. This is when I see 8k in rebates on new trucks.

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I usually buy at the end of the year. They are willing to do some crazy stuff at year end...plus you can usually get last years model "with no miles" REALLY cheap vs the current model even though the body styles are usually the same.

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Originally Posted by theorangeguy

get the f*ck out of here!!! damn thats a good deal...

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:yup:

In my eyes, this is the 'end of the year'........just like Zin said.......the 8K rebates are going on right now since the '15's will be out in ~September.

This past presidents day I almost pulled the trigger on a 2013 Ram express. Quad cab, 4WD, 5.7 liter, 6.5ft bed, tow package. Not too many options past that but with the 8500 off in rebates I could have had a brand new truck for 28k. Too bad it is a dodge and I don't like my vehicles rusting out in 5 years and I hate replacing balljoints. The engine is nice though, 390hp. GM needs a 6.2 liter to make more power than that.

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

This past presidents day I almost pulled the trigger on a 2013 Ram express. Quad cab, 4WD, 5.7 liter, 6.5ft bed, tow package. Not too many options past that but with the 8500 off in rebates I could have had a brand new truck for 28k. Too bad it is a dodge and I don't like my vehicles rusting out in 5 years and I hate replacing balljoints. The engine is nice though, 390hp. GM needs a 6.2 liter to make more power than that.

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I love my rams...i've owned a few of them. I dont live up north so I cant speak to how they react in the salt winters tho...

this is usually where GTP comes in and blasts the hemi :rotfl:

Right after I posted this I found this article...seems like Ford and Dodge are doing better in salt than GM.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/101816931

Not the beds that is for sure. My 2002 silverado is rust free on the body. The frame has some slight surface rust here and there but for the most part is clean.

As for the Hemi, I like the power and the people I know who have them have never had an issue. Some with more than 150k on them. The funny part is they aren't really hemis but god does dodge love to badge them that way. But the 5.3 liter GM uses is really reliable as well.

I am pricing out a new truck and as a USAA member I get 5k+ discounts it seems I wonder if those stack with any rebates as well. Also all the options confuse me, too many options and too many numbers lol.

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

I am pricing out a new truck and as a USAA member I get 5k+ discounts it seems I wonder if those stack with any rebates as well. Also all the options confuse me, too many options and too many numbers lol.

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Options lists just keep getting bigger. Personally though I don't really like trucks optioned out. I want it to last a long time, they should be family or business workhorses. I hate leather in trucks, dont need a sunroof. Power windows, locks, tow package, a good set of tires and a decent radio is all I really want.

At a minimum I want power seats, sun roof, rear power window, and a couple other things, the 6.2 would be nice as well. Leather would be nice but isn't necessary right now.

Cloth is so much more comfy. That is the reason I have cloth carpet in my bedrooms and not leather. Power seats are ok but they take to damn long to adjust. Manual seats you just grab ahold of the lever or bar and boom you're done. Maybe they just need to Tim the Tool Man Taylor them and put some bigger motors in those seats for my liking.

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

Cloth is so much more comfy. That is the reason I have cloth carpet in my bedrooms and not leather. Power seats are ok but they take to damn long to adjust. Manual seats you just grab ahold of the lever or bar and boom you're done. Maybe they just need to Tim the Tool Man Taylor them and put some bigger motors in those seats for my liking.

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I actually like all the features you can have but my charger was fully loaded which is probably why. I do prefer leather over cloth as I like the expensive feel and I have texture issues with some cloth. The power is nice especially for fine tuning adjustments.

I am definitely going to see if I can get a good deal on a new truck or at least explore that option.

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Originally Posted by theorangeguy

I love my rams...i've owned a few of them. I dont live up north so I cant speak to how they react in the salt winters tho...

this is usually where GTP comes in and blasts the hemi :rotfl:

Right after I posted this I found this article...seems like Ford and Dodge are doing better in salt than GM.

GM resists more recalls

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You see what you see when working in the service department. Since you called me out :p

Damn I found a 2014 red Ltz for 35k out in Tacoma Washington and another for 38k in Texas. These are just what they are listing them for too prior to negotiation. I am hoping I can get into one of those or similar and have it shipped here.

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

Damn I found a 2014 red Ltz for 35k out in Tacoma Washington and another for 38k in Texas. These are just what they are listing them for too prior to negotiation. I am hoping I can get into one of those or similar and have it shipped here.

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Two other places to check are Jeff Belzer's Chevrolet in Lakeville,MN, and Rydell Chevrolet in Grand Forks, ND.

Holz in Milwaukee has some ok deals. I know right now they have having 8k off in rebates and on top of that their own sale. Up tp 10k off msrp. I saw a couple 1500 crew cab silverados with the 5.3 and 4WD for 34k. Not sure about LTZs though.

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Originally Posted by az gt eater

I am pretty sure that is factory height. My work truck is a 12 2500 HD and it sits the same.

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I guarantee that Silverado that was posted has been leveled up front. It's a 1500, not a 2500. The 2500s typically do sit a bit more level than the 1500s.

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

The engine is nice though, 390hp. GM needs a 6.2 liter to make more power than that.

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The older 6.2 made 403hp. The new one makes 420hp. And FWIW, when Car and Driver tested all the new pickups, they said the new GM 5.3 (355hp) felt stronger than the Dodge Hemi.

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Originally Posted by 5.0THIS

I guarantee that Silverado that was posted has been leveled up front. It's a 1500, not a 2500. The 2500s typically do sit a bit more level than the 1500s.



The older 6.2 made 403hp. The new one makes 420hp. And FWIW, when Car and Driver tested all the new pickups, they said the new GM 5.3 (355hp) felt stronger than the Dodge Hemi.

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GM still needed a 6.2 liter to make more power than dodges 5.7. The 6.0 never did.

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

GM still needed a 6.2 liter to make more power than dodges 5.7. The 6.0 never did.

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:chuckles:

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

GM still needed a 6.2 liter to make more power than dodges 5.7. The 6.0 never did.

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I pretty much disagree. GM chose not to make more power. They didn't "need" to increase the cubic inch at all.

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Originally Posted by FasstChevys

I pretty much disagree. GM chose not to make more power. They didn't "need" to increase the cubic inch at all.

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what...? why would they chose to not make more power?

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Originally Posted by theorangeguy

what...? why would they chose to not make more power?

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I highly doubt GM's primary goal is to build the most horse power, at all costs, all the time.

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Originally Posted by FasstChevys

I highly doubt GM's primary goal is to build the most horse power, at all costs, all the time.

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True but dodge still provide you with more power.

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

True but dodge still provide you with more power.

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Which has nothing to do with cubic inch alone, as far as this topic goes.

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Originally Posted by FasstChevys

Which has nothing to do with cubic inch alone, as far as this topic goes.

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at the end of the day I still love the 6.2...after driving an escalade I almost bought a vortec maxx truck. I was sold at that point but dodge wanted to keep me in a dodge...my next truck will either be the eco-diesel from Dodge or a 6.4 Hemi Truck. Im sold on these for a while...

I do have an obsession with the new Sierra's tho...I love those trucks.

There is actually a 2008 vortec max crew cab silverado ltz near me with every option but priced close to a 2014 crew cab ltz with no additional options. I could probably get them to go a lot lower when I mention that I could get a brand new ltz for the price they are asking.

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

There is actually a 2008 vortec max crew cab silverado ltz near me with every option but priced close to a 2014 crew cab ltz with no additional options. I could probably get them to go a lot lower when I mention that I could get a brand new ltz for the price they are asking.

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any kind of warranty on the 2008...? I would take the vortec max over a 5.3 if it were me, but you'll have to weigh out mileage and warranty vs a new one.

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Originally Posted by theorangeguy

any kind of warranty on the 2008...? I would take the vortec max over a 5.3 if it were me, but you'll have to weigh out mileage and warranty vs a new one.

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And interest rate!

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Originally Posted by theorangeguy

at the end of the day I still love the 6.2...after driving an escalade I almost bought a vortec maxx truck. I was sold at that point but dodge wanted to keep me in a dodge...my next truck will either be the eco-diesel from Dodge or a 6.4 Hemi Truck. Im sold on these for a while...

I do have an obsession with the new Sierra's tho...I love those trucks.

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For sure - someone should always stay with what they like, and are sold on. :cheers:

And, yes, I love how the Sierra's look too. :love:

I'll have to ask about the warranty but it only has 37k miles on it and my interest rate is really low regardless if I buy used or new. Based on KBB the truck is worth between 34 to 37k and they have it listed for 33k. I was planning on offer low to mid 20s and see what they come back with.

The truck:

http://i737.photobucket.com/albums/x...psed851d9e.png

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

The truck:

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looks good to me from what I can see in the picture. I wouldnt worry about the 37,000 miles either...I know guys who buy these trucks with 100,000+ miles all day long with no reservations or worries. Keep in mind the 6.2 will get worse gas mileage, but other than that nothing out of the ordinary. Buddy of mine in Alabama pulls a camper with his just about every weekend and he loves it.

Might have to run 89 octane and up in the 6.2...I think I remember reading that somewhere.

It's a 6.0 not 6.2. It should be better than my charger despite it's weight. My charger gets horrible mileage.....I also don't really care about the gas mileage. For used cars as long as they are under 80k I am fine with the mileage. I personally think that 37k miles on the truck is low for it's age.

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Originally Posted by FasstChevys

Which has nothing to do with cubic inch alone, as far as this topic goes.

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Regardless of what it has to do with one truck has more power than the other truck in the same price range(dodges are actually a little cheaper). And it does it with a smaller engine then the midgrade GM engine.

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

I'll have to ask about the warranty but it only has 37k miles on it and my interest rate is really low regardless if I buy used or new. Based on KBB the truck is worth between 34 to 37k and they have it listed for 33k. I was planning on offer low to mid 20s and see what they come back with.

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Interest rates are always lower on brand new vehicles. You can get 0% with a good enough credit score on brand new. You can't get that on a 08.. .no matter what your score is.

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

It's a 6.0 not 6.2. It should be better than my charger despite it's weight. My charger gets horrible mileage.....I also don't really care about the gas mileage. For used cars as long as they are under 80k I am fine with the mileage. I personally think that 37k miles on the truck is low for it's age.

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Your charger only gets 20 freeway? If you do city driving and like to use more than 20% throttle you will probably average 15-16mpg with the truck.

I do mostly city driving but I do get some highway driving in and it averages to around 14 to 15 in the charger, it is rated 25 highway but I have never gotten that. My point was that my interest rate is low regardless not saying that you can't get lower in a new vehicle as I know I can but it is really low to begin with since I have excellent credit.

I picked up a brand new Ram last year for 27000. I looked at the Silverado and they were going to match it. Wish you could get the bigger engine in the GM trucks without getting the higher end model. Then I would have gone Chevy. You should be able to find a new truck for what they are selling the other trucks you are looking at.

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

GM still needed a 6.2 liter to make more power than dodges 5.7. The 6.0 never did.

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lol. no. As has been pointed out, GM hit their target power goals for the 6.2 when it came out. And to this day it is still the most powerful gas engine you can get in a half ton truck. The hemi hasn't outpowered the 6.2 in any model year that I know of, and the cubic inches is of little relevance. Ask anybody and it's pretty obvious the GM motor has more potential. We can start looking at head and intake flow numbers if you really want to make an argument about which motor is better engineered.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

True but dodge still provide you with more power.

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In what? They really don't, unless you're talking about certain cab/bed configurations where GM doesn't offer the 6.2 (which is stupid).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

Regardless of what it has to do with one truck has more power than the other truck in the same price range(dodges are actually a little cheaper). And it does it with a smaller engine then the midgrade GM engine.

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The midgrade GM engine is the 5.3. And like I said, the new 355hp DI 5.3 apparently outruns an equal size Dodge truck with the hemi. And I don't think GM really cared that the hemi outpowered the 5.3. With the 5.3 GM made an engine that perfectly suited the needs of 95% of half ton truck buyers, and did so very reliably. I assume that was their goal. And if someone wanted more, there's the 6.2, which shits all over the hemi. And I've never heard a hemi ram owner that had to resort to ricer arguments about horsepower per liter :lol:.

And if your beef is with the 6.0 in the HD trucks, I can only assume GM still uses it there because it's bulletproof, and because they're trying to push people up to the diesel.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 5.0THIS

lol. no. As has been pointed out, GM hit their target power goals for the 6.2 when it came out. And to this day it is still the most powerful gas engine you can get in a half ton truck. The hemi hasn't outpowered the 6.2 in any model year that I know of, and the cubic inches is of little relevance. Ask anybody and it's pretty obvious the GM motor has more potential. We can start looking at head and intake flow numbers if you really want to make an argument about which motor is better engineered.



In what? They really don't, unless you're talking about certain cab/bed configurations where GM doesn't offer the 6.2 (which is stupid).



The midgrade GM engine is the 5.3. And like I said, the new 355hp DI 5.3 apparently outruns an equal size Dodge truck with the hemi. And I don't think GM really cared that the hemi outpowered the 5.3. With the 5.3 GM made an engine that perfectly suited the needs of 95% of half ton truck buyers, and did so very reliably. I assume that was their goal. And if someone wanted more, there's the 6.2, which shits all over the hemi. And I've never heard a hemi ram owner that had to resort to ricer arguments about horsepower per liter :lol:.

And if your beef is with the 6.0 in the HD trucks, I can only assume GM still uses it there because it's bulletproof, and because they're trying to push people up to the diesel.

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Point being you have to spend extra money to get the 6.2 liter if want more power than the dodge 5.7 which is considered by most to be the standard for the dodge gassers. The normal and most used engine in these 1500 is the 5.3 liter for GM and the 5.7 liter for dodge. Which has supplied consumers with more power than the other 1500s with the normal engine since it came out in 2002 with 345hp, back when the 5.3 was making 285hp. Your arguments are null and void as they are comparing a optioned out extra cost truck vs the dodge standard. Dodge has been supplying its customers with more power for well over a decade and they are generally cheaper with the standard engines. I still prefer GM trucks for other reasons but the facts are facts.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

Point being you have to spend extra money to get the 6.2 liter. The normal and most used engine in these 1500 is the 5.3 liter for GM and the 5.7 liter for dodge. Which has supplied consumers with more power than the other 1500s with the normal engine since it came out in 2002 with 345hp, back when the 5.3 was making 285hp. Your arguments all are null and void because dodge has bee nsupplying its customers with more power for well over a decade and they are generally cheaper. I still prefer GM trucks for other reasons but the facts are facts.

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true story...5.7 is pretty much standard in the dodge. They do offer a 4.7 but the 5.7 is the one that sells.

If you want an accurate comparison it would be the Hemi 5.7 vs the GM 5.3 and then the Hemi 6.4 vs the GM 6.2. Thats class for class comparison...saying the 6.2 is better than a 5.7 is pointless because they arent really designed to compete with each other even tho the 5.7 does compete with it lol

Buddy of mine in Huntsville has a vortec max and we lined up when I first bought the truck I have now about 2 years ago and I put about half a truck on him. Thats real world scenario, not whats on paper.

How does a thread about a couple of GM trucks turn into a paperweight er hemi nut swinging fest?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GTP231

How does a thread about a couple of GM trucks turn into a paperweight er hemi nut swinging fest?

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Not sure since I have no interest in Dodge trucks. The few I have seen lack a lot in the interior and appearance department as their interior sucks compared to my 2006 Charger Daytona, except maybe brand new ones but then GM trucks seem better in my opinion still.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GTP231

How does a thread about a couple of GM trucks turn into a paperweight er hemi nut swinging fest?

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true story...partially my fault because somebody "I think it was zinergy" compared the hemi to a gm motor and it went from there...5.0 helped by comparing engines from a different class to the 5.7 :rotfl:

Doesn't every thread get derailed on some other topic at some point?

This is the intertron boys. Nothing stays on topic.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

Point being you have to spend extra money to get the 6.2 liter if want more power than the dodge 5.7 which is considered by most to be the standard for the dodge gassers. The normal and most used engine in these 1500 is the 5.3 liter for GM and the 5.7 liter for dodge. Which has supplied consumers with more power than the other 1500s with the normal engine since it came out in 2002 with 345hp, back when the 5.3 was making 285hp. Your arguments are null and void as they are comparing a optioned out extra cost truck vs the dodge standard. Dodge has been supplying its customers with more power for well over a decade and they are generally cheaper with the standard engines. I still prefer GM trucks for other reasons but the facts are facts.

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If your point was to convince us that Dodge trucks are cheaper, we already know that. Dodge has always had to undercut GM and Ford just to sell a fraction of the same number of trucks that Ford and GM sell. My comparisons are absolutely valid though. Obviously most customers didn't give two shits about the hemi having more power, as they bought more expensive 5.3 trucks in spades. Why? Because it's been a better truck and the 5.3 got the job done just fine (a point I made that you conveniently ignored). And as I also stated, it seems the new DI 5.3 is right on par with the hemi, despite being rated for less power. Dodge isn't impressing anyone with the Hemi in the ram as the only real option for a gas motor. If I was buying a ram I wouldn't even bother with the hemi.

Your original argument was that GM needed more displacement to make more power than the 5.7. Doubtful, as most mopar owners would admit the LSx motors have more left out of the box compared to a hemi. Your next argument was that Dodge offers you more power. It doesn't, not in a half ton truck. And then you had to tack on another qualifier to suit your argument that Dodge offered more power for less money. :lol: And then, bafflingly, you stated that Dodge did it with a smaller engine than the midgrade GM engine (see your quote above). The midrange GM engine is the 5.3. Last time I looked, 5.7>5.3. So by your own logic, Dodge needed more displacement than the midgrade GM engine to make more power. I cant even say it without thinking of the Honda civic owner that just got smoked by an F body, but still bragging along that they have more horsepower per liter :rotfl:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by theorangeguy

true story...partially my fault because somebody "I think it was zinergy" compared the hemi to a gm motor and it went from there...5.0 helped by comparing engines from a different class to the 5.7 :rotfl:

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Dodge's top 1/2 ton gas offering= the hemi. GM's top 1/2 ton gas offering is the 6.2. Only an idiot would deny that comparison. Or maybe you should keep denying it because the 6.2 continues to shit all over the hemi (even the 6.4 version) :lol:

In fact it's kind of sad now that GM's mid level V8 now directly competes with Dodge's top gas V8 in the half tons.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 5.0THIS

If your point was to convince us that Dodge trucks are cheaper, we already know that. Dodge has always had to undercut GM and Ford just to sell a fraction of the same number of trucks that Ford and GM sell. My comparisons are absolutely valid though. Obviously most customers didn't give two shits about the hemi having more power, as they bought more expensive 5.3 trucks in spades. Why? Because it's been a better truck and the 5.3 got the job done just fine (a point I made that you conveniently ignored). And as I also stated, it seems the new DI 5.3 is right on par with the hemi, despite being rated for less power. Dodge isn't impressing anyone with the Hemi in the ram as the only real option for a gas motor. If I was buying a ram I wouldn't even bother with the hemi.

Your original argument was that GM needed more displacement to make more power than the 5.7. Doubtful, as most mopar owners would admit the LSx motors have more left out of the box compared to a hemi. Your next argument was that Dodge offers you more power. It doesn't, not in a half ton truck. And then you had to tack on another qualifier to suit your argument that Dodge offered more power for less money. :lol: And then, bafflingly, you stated that Dodge did it with a smaller engine than the midgrade GM engine (see your quote above). The midrange GM engine is the 5.3. Last time I looked, 5.7>5.3. So by your own logic, Dodge needed more displacement than the midgrade GM engine to make more power. I cant even say it without thinking of the Honda civic owner that just got smoked by an F body, but still bragging along that they have more horsepower per liter :rotfl:




Dodge's top 1/2 ton gas offering= the hemi. GM's top 1/2 ton gas offering is the 6.2. Only an idiot would deny that comparison. Or maybe you should keep denying it because the 6.2 continues to shit all over the hemi (even the 6.4 version) :lol:

In fact it's kind of sad now that GM's mid level V8 now directly competes with Dodge's top gas V8 in the half tons.

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Sometimes you are just a little douche. Let me spell it out for you because you are a little slow. THE STANDARD ENGINE IN THE 1500S IS 5.7 AND 5.3. THE 5.7 IS A MORE POWERFUL ENGINE WHICH YOU CAN HAVE THROUGH DODGE WITHOUT PAYING EXTRA FOR THE BIG ENGINE OPTION.

The standard engines are the 5.3 and 5.7 as far as most consumers are concerned. Yes you can pay extra for the 6.2 but most consumers don't see it as cost effective. But I can almost guarantee you that if GM said the 6.2s are now the same price as the 5.3s very very few people would go with the 5.3. Or if GM used a bigger standard engine with more power almost no one would complain.

My only point is that standard vs standard dodge has more power.

Saying the new 355hp 5.3 liter is on par with the dodge engine because of some testers butt dyno is a BS argument that has no place in a factual one. Fact is the standard 1500 engine for GM makes 355hp and the dodge 395hp. Deal with it.

I stated before that I still prefer GM, hell I DD a chevy 1500 with the 5.3 in it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

Sometimes you are just a little douche. Let me spell it out for you because you are a little slow.

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Just a little????

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 67CamaroRSSS

Just a little????

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Just a little, he hasn't been a big douche towards me yet. Just a little one. Probably used on orientals.

I never saw a window sticker for a hemi that didn't show them costing extra. Same with a 5.3. They must sell trucks differently out bere

You'd be surprised how many 4.8s are out on the road honestly Zin

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GTP231

You'd be surprised how many 4.8s are out on the road honestly Zin

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Or how many of the new ones are the v6s.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

Sometimes you are just a little douche. Let me spell it out for you because you are a little slow. THE STANDARD ENGINE IN THE 1500S IS 5.7 AND 5.3. THE 5.7 IS A MORE POWERFUL ENGINE WHICH YOU CAN HAVE THROUGH DODGE WITHOUT PAYING EXTRA FOR THE BIG ENGINE OPTION.

The standard engines are the 5.3 and 5.7 as far as most consumers are concerned. Yes you can pay extra for the 6.2 but most consumers don't see it as cost effective. But I can almost guarantee you that if GM said the 6.2s are now the same price as the 5.3s very very few people would go with the 5.3. Or if GM used a bigger standard engine with more power almost no one would complain.

My only point is that standard vs standard dodge has more power.

Saying the new 355hp 5.3 liter is on par with the dodge engine because of some testers butt dyno is a BS argument that has no place in a factual one. Fact is the standard 1500 engine for GM makes 355hp and the dodge 395hp. Deal with it.

I stated before that I still prefer GM, hell I DD a chevy 1500 with the 5.3 in it.

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Nice job resorting to name calling :lol: It was fun going through your comments in this thread and picking them apart. By the way, when they tested the acceleration of a new Silverado (5.3) against a new hemi ram (both trucks same configuration), here were the results:

0-60:
Silverado- 6.7
Ram-7.1

1/4 mile:
Silverado- 15.3@92
Ram- 15.6@88

Some butt tester's dyno indeed. If you're still having trouble, let me know if you need me to spell it out for you. BTW, I'm sure you're just waiting for me to nail you with points for a post like this so you can play victim. :hasquint:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 67CamaroRSSS

Just a little????

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I'm glad you think I'm a douchebag, and take every opportunity to pile on with whoever's talking shit to me :cool2:

5.0 calls me an idiot and then bitches about name calling in the same thread...? Genius!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GTP231

You'd be surprised how many 4.8s are out on the road honestly Zin

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I guess I would be. I never see them and trucks are probably the most driven vehicles around here. When I go to lots a large majority of the GMs are 5.3s. The only time I see the 4.7s or 4.8s or 4.3s are tradesmen work trucks. Most are also only 2wd. Jobs that don't require heavy hauling. I rarely see them for personal use.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GTP231

I never saw a window sticker for a hemi that didn't show them costing extra. Same with a 5.3. They must sell trucks differently out bere

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Technically they do cost more than the 4.3 v6 but when I say standard I mean the actual definition of the word. The norm... and the 5.3 from what I have seen is the norm for the GM trucks.

Here is an article quote from Sept 2013.

"Demand for the trucks is exceeding a supplier’s ability to produce certain drivetrain parts for the 5.3-liter V-8 engine, the most popular size, and GM is limiting how many dealers can order, said two of the people, who asked not to be identified because the matter is private. While one of the people said the issue could be resolved soon, another said it could take longer than a couple of months. They declined to identify the supplier."

Because they are so popular that is what lots are loaded with and that is what the average consumer for personal use expects to see.

Same article.

"The 5.3-liter engine made up about 80 percent of the previous truck’s sales and was expected to be the same going forward, Baum said."

How does the most popular engine translate to standard no cost option?

Why the heck are the Dodge trucks cheap up here or at least when compared to GM.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

Why the heck are the Dodge trucks cheap up here or at least when compared to GM.

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GM vs dodge is a pretty big difference down here. I've never been able to find a GM truck with the same options as a dodge for the same price. GM is almost always more expensive...that's why I was shocked at the prices you have been listing. I have been told many times that GM products are cheaper up north for some reason but I don't know why...a buddy of mine down here buys all his Chevy's from Michigan and drives them back to the south.

I live near DC. Everything is expensive lol.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

Why the heck are the Dodge trucks cheap up here or at least when compared to GM.

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Dodge has always had to undercut GM and Ford on full size truck prices. Despite the lower prices, they still sell only a fraction of what Ford and GM sell. Dodge is making leaps and bounds though closing the gap between themselves and Ford/GM as far as quality and capability. Their new 1/2 ton diesel engine is awesome; I expect Ford and GM to follow suit with a similar offering in coming years if early sales numbers are a good indicator of popularity.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 5.0THIS

Dodge has always had to undercut GM and Ford on full size truck prices. Despite the lower prices, they still sell only a fraction of what Ford and GM sell. Dodge is making leaps and bounds though closing the gap between themselves and Ford/GM as far as quality and capability. Their new 1/2 ton diesel engine is awesome; I expect Ford and GM to follow suit with a similar offering in coming years if early sales numbers are a good indicator of popularity.

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my next truck will be a 1500 diesel...Nissan is coming out with a Titan that has a cummins in it, Dodge just released the eco-diesel, and like you said...Ford and GM should be following right behind them.

Found this for 26k with 13000 miles. It is a 2010 fully loaded except for Navigation.

http://i737.photobucket.com/albums/x...ps140d7161.png

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

Found this for 26k with 13000 miles. It is a 2010 fully loaded except for Navigation.

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looks familiar lol

http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z...96bfee7cd9.jpg

That truck I posted if GM would be high 30s if not 40s lol or at least in my area it would be.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

That truck I posted if GM would be high 30s if not 40s lol or at least in my area it would be.

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thats what i've always found as well...I tried to get GM to match but they wouldnt. All I can say is that if you are comfortable with GM products stick with them but if you want to get into something else Dodge is the way to go imo. I would not buy an F150 personally...dont like the 5.4's and the ecoboost is just not for me.

I would own a Raptor tho if I was in the market for something like that. I love that truck.

Almost forgot...im not sure if it matters or not, but the orange dodge that you posted is the Quad Cab so the back seat and back doors are going to be smaller than the Crew Cab that GM and Dodge offers. Mine is a crew cab and has a ton of room in the back seat. Just something to keep in mind...

Oh I thought it was a crew cab but that makes sense as it looked smaller. The dealership listed it as a crew cab lol. Yeah I need a crew cab.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GTP231

How does the most popular engine translate to standard no cost option?

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Where did I say no cost option? I said it is the standard for GM. Meaning the norm, what the personal consumer expects to buy. I was comparing dodges standard(aka the norm) the 5.7 liter versus GM. Then you stated that I would be suprised how many 4.8s and 4.3s are on the road. Well that number has to be less than 20% of GM trucks sold. Far less actually as the 5.3 liter makes up over 80% of sales. That leaves 19 or so percent left to be split up between the 4.3, 4.8, 6.0 and 6.2. Therefore the 5.3 liter is the norm, which is another word for standard.

GM considers the short bed to be the 5.8ft bed but the "STANDARD" bed is the 6.5 foot bed(which costs more crew cab vs crew cab). Because that is the standard for beds and has been for quite some time. Just as the 5.3 liter has been the standard engine since 99.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6

Oh I thought it was a crew cab but that makes sense as it looked smaller. The dealership listed it as a crew cab lol. Yeah I need a crew cab.

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Yes but the beds are smaller on crew cabs as well. Most people these days take the bigger back seat and the smaller bed as they usually aren't hauling. I still prefer the 6.5 ft beds. And I believe GM now offers the crew cab with the 6.5 ft bed in the 1500 with the 2014 plus models.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

Yes but the beds are smaller on frew cabs as well. Most people these days take the bigger back seat and the smaller bed as they usually aren't hauling.

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I can fit a 4wheeler in the back of mine and close the tailgate so im good to go. My father in law has a 2009 4 door silverado and my bed is just a tad longer...I can tell because if I put fishing rods in the back of my truck, they can only touch one corner but when they are in his, they will touch corner to corner. probably a 3-4 inch difference diagonally but nothing crazy. Mine also feels like it has a little more room in the back seat than his which is weird because you would think his bed would be longer at that point.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by theorangeguy

I tried to get GM to match but they wouldnt. All I can say is that if you are comfortable with GM products stick with them but if you want to get into something else Dodge is the way to go imo.

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I am comfortable with both GM and Dodge as I have owned both but for some reason I like GM better I don't know why. Although I found a fully loaded Longhorn edition with 46000 miles that I kind of like lol.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

Yes but the beds are smaller on crew cabs as well. Most people these days take the bigger back seat and the smaller bed as they usually aren't hauling. I still prefer the 6.5 ft beds. And I believe GM now offers the crew cab with the 6.5 ft bed in the 1500 with the 2014 plus models.

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I won't be hauling much in the bed so any size bed will pretty much work for what I would haul when needed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by theorangeguy

I can fit a 4wheeler in the back of mine and close the tailgate so im good to go. My father in law has a 2009 4 door silverado and my bed is just a tad longer...I can tell because if I put fishing rods in the back of my truck, they can only touch one corner but when they are in his, they will touch corner to corner. probably a 3-4 inch difference diagonally but nothing crazy. Mine also feels like it has a little more room in the back seat than his which is weird because you would think his bed would be longer at that point.

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That is strange as the ram crew cab is rated at a 5.7ft bed and the sierra/silverado a 5.75ft bed. Maybe the dodge bed is wider???

I ride dirt bikes and they are longer than 4 wheelers. There have been quite a few times where I have used my whole bed and then some. But as I said for most people the sub 6 foot beds handle what they want them to do.

2015 3500 Sierra Denali Duramax.

http://i1.ytimg.com/vi/Tk3HPC22Xm0/maxresdefault.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

That is strange as the ram crew cab is rated at a 5.7ft bed and the sierra/silverado a 5.75ft bed. Maybe the dodge bed is wider???

I ride dirt bikes and they are longer than 4 wheelers. There have been quite a few times where I have used my whole bed and then some. But as I said for most people the sub 6 foot beds handle what they want them to do.

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I could see that being the case because im basing my experience on laying them in from one corner to the other. If I lay them in straight, they will stick out no matter what truck they are in because they are all 6feet or longer. Width could very easily have something to do with it.

Nice looking truck, but it is overkill for 90% of personal consumers. It is quite the fad now for people who don't off road, or haul anything big to own diesel trucks. Some say it is for the gas mileage... BS in most situations they don't get any better mpg than the gassers.