The "New" GM Scores Another Win

I honestly don't know what more GM could do to drive away customers.

Hot on the heels of denying warranties comes news that OnStar will continue to track you and your driving habits even after you cancel the service

Spying On You For Profit

Yeah, this news will cause a rush of buyers into the showrooms.

I'm sure everyone wants a vehicle that continuously reports their speed, location, seat belt usage, and all the locations they regularly visit.

Boneheads.

Maybe they'll offer a new model that doesn't have OnStar and call it the Paranoia Prowler, you know, to make fun of people who might have a totally unfounded objection to this data being collected. It's obviously being done for your own good.

Yeah state farm sent me a letter 2 months ago and told me they would pay my activation and monthly bill, yeah right, so stupid. Maybe I'll just send them pictures of my spedo at 110 once a month.

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Originally Posted by Danger731

Yeah state farm sent me a letter 2 months ago and told me they would pay my activation and monthly bill, yeah right, so stupid. Maybe I'll just send them pictures of my spedo at 110 once a month.

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You don't have to send them a picture. If you have onstar activated or not they know how fast you are going.

The way things are going, there'll be a device like that on all makes and models of vehicles in the future.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XzQyutekBc

Like smartphones, GPS's, and the like don't already track you.....

Hell, some people tell the world their every move on FB.

True, but those are choices people can make. People need a car. I don't have to have a smart phone or GPS.

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Originally Posted by Mr. Luos

Like smartphones, GPS's, and the like don't already track you.....

Hell, some people tell the world their every move on FB.

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I am the only 24 year old i know who does not have a facebook. I have never had one. It does not have to be a smartphone to be tracked.

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

I am the only 24 year old i know who does not have a facebook. I have never had one. It does not have to be a smartphone to be tracked.

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This.

The signal between towers can be tracked.

A GPS enabled smartphone just makes it much easier.

And to make sure you stock up on tinfoil for hats, consider this:

The Japanese K supercomputer can perform over 8 PFLOPS (8 petaflops, or 8 quadrillion operations per second. 1 quadrillion = 1 trillion x 1000).

Since there are less than 7 billion people on Earth, this means it is capable of performing over 1 million operations per second on every individual person, 24/7/365.

Now go watch the first Terminator movie again. I for one welcome our silicon based overlords. Skynet will be pleased.

So, what if you don't get the Onstar service when you purchase the vehicle are they still tracking you even though you never used the service or are a current "customer"?


It's funny how ppl still don't know about the black boxes in their cars.



1984 anyone? :nilly: :nilly:

With each technological advancement made, our anonymity and privacy, what's left of it, in our lives, lessen.

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Originally Posted by SMWS6TA

So, what if you don't get the Onstar service when you purchase the vehicle are they still tracking you even though you never used the service or are a current "customer"?

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Any new GM will come with a complimentary subscription to OnStar, not sure how long the introductory service lasts though. I know Sirius has been hounding me to continue my satellite radio since my introductory service ran out. They don't seem to understand that since I rarely listened to it when it was free I will not likely be paying to listen to it.

But yes, even if you don't renew, the system will still track your behavior.

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Originally Posted by SMWS6TA

So, what if you don't get the Onstar service when you purchase the vehicle are they still tracking you even though you never used the service or are a current "customer"?


It's funny how ppl still don't know about the black boxes in their cars.



1984 anyone? :nilly: :nilly:

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Yes even if the dealer never activated it they can remotely activate it at anytime.

Black boxes are completely different. They have to be accessed by a shop or dealer with the black box being right there. They cannot remotely access the black box.

If I ever get a chevy* again I'll have to look into how to do a permanent solution for disconnect.















* - will not buy under current management

I say a couple snipped wires can fix the problem lol!!

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Originally Posted by SiggyZ

True, but those are choices people can make. People need a car. I don't have to have a smart phone or GPS.

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Unless you're carrying the classic 80's cell phone your phone already has a GPS in it...

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Originally Posted by bluehawk2000

I say a couple snipped wires can fix the problem lol!!

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I know on the early 2000's W Body deleting it all saves around 20 pounds.
Not overly hard to do though some cars and trucks you could possibly lose your satellite radio

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Originally Posted by SMWS6TA

If I ever get a chevy* again I'll have to look into how to do a permanent solution for disconnect.














* - will not buy under current management

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yep
:yup:

If ANY cell phone can track us...then we are ALL screwed. I have noticed at times, my phone lights up and drains its battery for no reason. Thing will stay lit for almost if not more than an hour.

:lol: Point taken, but like I said, I don't have to have a cell phone.

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Originally Posted by GTP231

Unless you're carrying the classic 80's cell phone your phone already has a GPS in it...

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Originally Posted by cammed goat

If ANY cell phone can track us...then we are ALL screwed. I have noticed at times, my phone lights up and drains its battery for no reason. Thing will stay lit for almost if not more than an hour.

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if it makes you feel any better (or maybe worse), anything w/ an electromagnetic signature can be "tracked" in some way or another... especially cell phones, even w/out an embedded GPS receiver, your phone communicates w/ several towers in "cells" around your immediate vicinity... the provider tracks your phone from "cell-to-cell", and can even pinpoint (w/in some spatial error) your location by triangulation - it's the nature of how it all works...

:D

Oh well. As long as I don't see any red/blues in my rearview when I am out having fun(for a short time), then I'm good. :lol:

You don't NEED a car either....bikes or nikes work.


My point on this...I am okay with it tracking. Even off.
What if your wife and kids get into an accident on a road with little traffic?? Track them?? YES PLEASE!

When you work 30miles from home you need a car.

If you are really worried about the wife or kids when they are driving you can put a GPS or your own tracker in the car. You dont need to rely on the governments to track them and everywhere you go

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Originally Posted by Mr. Luos

You don't NEED a car either....bikes or nikes work.


My point on this...I am okay with it tracking. Even off.
What if your wife and kids get into an accident on a road with little traffic?? Track them?? YES PLEASE!

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i can see the benefit in an emergency situation - car jacking, auto theft, ...but other than that you might be concerned about the civil liberties aspect, ...i.e. who's "lists" are you on?

I guess I just don't care.
The likelihood of them actually tracking me is probably less likely than if the family needed it in an emergency.

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Originally Posted by wileyCoyote

i can see the benefit in an emergency situation - car jacking, auto theft, ...but other than that you might be concerned about the civil liberties aspect, ...i.e. who's "lists" are you on?

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This :yup:

It's one thing if you opt in to pay for and use the service. It's another if you opt out but are still being 'tracked'. It may not seem like an issue to some, but, sometime in the future, unfortunately, it may. IMO, It's not the place of the government to track our every move. And these days, GM=government.

Funny thing is when my Z-71 was stolen a couple of years ago I told the officer taking the report that it was equiped with On-star but I didn't pay for the service. They could switch it on and see exactly where my truck was.......Nope! They don't do that.....so my insurance paid me over $18K to replace it and they never found a single piece of my ride! Makes a bunch of sense doesn't it? :bs:

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Originally Posted by Mr. Luos

I guess I just don't care.
The likelihood of them actually tracking me is probably less likely than if the family needed it in an emergency.

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there are some who relish in attitudes like this, ...there names are Google and Apple

...if you aren't sure what i mean, ...do a web search on "location gate", ...

:cool2:

I have nothing from either of them. Although I do use google search once in a while.
But again, I do nothing to create alarm. I do nothing to require me to be tracked. I am not concerned.
Oh shit, someone knows where I am.....while I am sitting here having lunch with my kid. So what? :dunno:

I will continue to worry about the things I can control....and try not to worry about those I can't.


I get the "civil liberties" aspect. I do.
Don't want it, don't buy it. :)

...pizza anyone???

The Big Brother Pizza Shop - YouTube

Looks like GM caved in to negative response to their "benefit".

Tracking Will Be Disabled

Wife gets in car, starts it up*
"Hello Mrs. Smith, this is OnStar. We've noticed that on weekdays between 4-5pm your husband goes to the same address for 45 minutes before coming home from work. We've run the address through our database and noticed its a well known "massage" parlor. May we offer you the services of our OnStar divorce lawyers?"

"How did you know I was the one in the car? I don't even have the service anymore"

"Focus on whats important Mrs. Smith. Your husbands cheating on you with a dirty massage tramp. If you'll just respond we can set up a payment plan for the OnStar Divorce lawyer"

"What is this, I don't even"

"Thanks for the confirmation, papers will be delivered to your address and you'll get the bill later. Thank you for using OnStar"

I'm sure that's just been said to get people to shut up. It'll probably still be active to an extent.

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Originally Posted by CJREX

Looks like GM caved in to negative response to their "benefit".

Tracking Will Be Disabled

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disconnect the antennae connector for on star

i'm sure they'll just follow the lead of Google and Apple, ..i.e. what our customers don't know about what we are tracking, ...won't hurt them..

Looks like we are all screwed.

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

Yes even if the dealer never activated it they can remotely activate it at anytime.

Black boxes are completely different. They have to be accessed by a shop or dealer with the black box being right there. They cannot remotely access the black box.

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This.... My 08 H3 has OnStar and I simply pressed the "blue botton" and activated it from the car when I purchased it..

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Originally Posted by SMWS6TA

If I ever get a chevy* again I'll have to look into how to do a permanent solution for disconnect.
* - will not buy under current management

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Good luck with that brother.. OnStar is completely intergraded into the vehicle.. They can start your car, shut it off, know that your air bags are deployed, and how many passengers are in the car via sensors in all the seats.. They can even tell if the vehicle has rolled over, or even which tire may have cause the accident.. The hands free OnStar system activates under conditions consistant with an accident.. Your location is immediately transmitted as a distress call and the local police, and EMS are alerted.. A person actually comes on and starts calling you by name in those instances, if you are able to speak you simply call out and they can hear you.. Our H3 also has a seperate botton for police/EMS push it and it calls the cops/EMS closest to you automaticly..

Yeah but it requires an antennae to send the signal. If it is disconnected it won't work.

I know this all sounds crazy to some of you and it sorta does to me as well..

However,, I have a wife and young child, and look @ the system as a possible life saver..

Different strokes for different folks.. The 08 H3 has a 5-star crash rating and is built like a tank..

If it's hit or in a crash that deploys all the bags as it's equiped with side curtains too it's likely to be a pretty bad accident so OnStar gets my vote..

I can see the want for privacy too, personally I have pleny of older toys that don't even have air bags or "black boxes"..

As long as all my stuff sits on ground I own I don't get to concerned about big brother without a warrant..

But it's nice if I am out on some trail in the middle of nowhere to know help can find me and/or my family if there's trouble..

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Originally Posted by SMWS6TA

Yeah but it requires an antennae to send the signal. If it is disconnected it won't work.

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Yes however the system is equipt with an internal antenna as well in the event that the outer one is damaged or ripped from the vehicle..

Basicly like a distress becon(sp) so if you can't be raised audibly OnStar will automaticly notify authorites..

That does'nt mean if you rip it off they call the cops, the vehicle will still have to show an accident has accured..

When I bought my 2009 HHR SS, I made sure the dealer did not activate the complimentary subscription.

I got the standard fear mongering letters for a couple months before I decided on a more permanent solution.... there was a nice big fuse marked "ON STAR"... problem solved, box has no power it can't do anything.

Luckily on that particular car, I didn't lose any functionality that I cared about... the OnStar box provided Bluetooth for the phone and XM radio, neither features that I cared about.

Shortly after I pulled the fuse, I received one more letter from GM that stating that my vehicle had stopping checking in to the OnStar system, and I should have it serviced immediately." :ughlaugh:

I can understand why people may want this service, but I don't understand why it has to mandatory. Well... I do understand... think of the value of the data.

All, for the record On Star has reverse its policy on this matter. Now a customer has to opt in to have it continue to monitor.



But would you really trust them?

Good that they reversed their policy, Bad and sad that someone high up thought it was good idea in the first place.

They absolutely had to know that there would be a huge backlash if this information got out, which is exactly what happened.

My guess is that they fully knew the risks and decided to chance it anyway, hoping to cash in on selling the collected data before the chickens came home to roost.

A black eye on an otherwise good system for those like it. If you guys buy a car with Onstar, it is very easy to disable it without affecting anything else on the car. The new systems have a battery back up built in, so if you just unplug it, you'll have to wait a few hours/days/not sure for the backup battery to run out.
You guys are probably a little more paranoid than you need to though. Like a lot of "tracking," Onstar claims their data collection gets anonymously combined into statistical research to better help future products and services. It kinda like giving the cashier at Best Buy your zip code. Anonymous research. That is...if you trust Onstar is actually doing what they say they are.

I never give my real zip code or phone number to cashiers

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Originally Posted by Zinergy

I never give my real zip code or phone number to cashiers

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Ha ha! Me too. Even back when I used checks, I kept my phone number off of them. The cashiers would always ask for it and I'd tell them, 'if I wanted to give it to you, it'd be on my check. So no' :)