What is the quickest and cheapest way to get a stock 2002 WS6 6-speed to 500 rwhp? How much time and how much would it cost?
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What is the quickest and cheapest way to get a stock 2002 WS6 6-speed to 500 rwhp? How much time and how much would it cost?
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:shrug:Quote:
Originally Posted by justinmc978
full bolt ons, dyno queen(bigger)cam/head package, nitrous, and proper tune all of 3500-4000 if all parts are new. that is for just strictly power. you will need to spend alot to hold up to that power as far as the rear end, and thats not even any suspension to get the power to the ground if you actually want to use the 500hp.
you know if its 500hp at the wheels your pushing over 550hp at the crank.. If you dont have a bullet proof bottom end you will have a pile of twisted bunt things that used to look like a engine .. not to mention your gears and such in the rear end and tranny ...
I dont think trying to reach 500hp the "cheapest" way is the right approach to this.
Hey guys sorry for the confusion. I am talking about a sustainable car. Front to back. Including how much work needs to be done to be rearend, not just the engine itself.
well as far as everything but motor,
you'll need wither a 9inch or a moser 12 bolt
285+ width tires
subframe conectors
and maybe an upgraded torque arm
Crombie02 nice car man I seen it the other day. Im from Richmond also, well Waco
Thank you for the compliment. The only real mods I have are an SLP lid with K&N filter, TT II's with 275's up front and 315's in the rear, SFC's and a catback with turn downs. The next thing I am really looking at before the end of the year is headers and dual electric cutouts.
You can subscribe to a thread without posting in it.Quote:
Originally Posted by justinmc978
Since you are wanting cheap HP, just throw nitrous on it.
long tube headers are a must.ls6 crate motor(405 hp)http://www.crateenginedepot.com/stor...268-P10C0.aspx and 150 shot of nitrous.
i think nitrous is like renting somthing, i'd rather buy a mod that doesnt just 'run out' and then i need to buy more
You must have never rode in a car with a healthy hit of nitrous. It obvious when it hits, you own it.Quote:
Originally Posted by justinmc978
OP, You asked for the quickest and cheapest way to 500 RWHP. There is no other option for that question besides nitrous. Cheap, reliable, safe, big power.
And I just happen to have a kit for sale that would look very nice mounted in you trunk.:bino:
my friend has an 01 ss with a 150 shot, its fun, but i'd rather have a large cam and some true internal upgradesQuote:
Originally Posted by Hi-Po
I am with you on that, I would be afraid to cook my engine.Quote:
Originally Posted by justinmc978
What do you guys know about Hooker Super Comp with 1 7/8" primaries? Good start and worth it for the money?
if your willing to pay for them, yes:thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by crombie02
i would suggest Pacesetter long tubes.had mine for almost a year and they are very high quality and still look damn good(ceramic coated)
How big of a difference overall does the size of the primaries affect performance? Especially when you plan to do internals further down the road.
Cheap, reliable, fast.
Pick two.
+1Quote:
Originally Posted by Hi-Po
that answers your question doesn't it? Its the fastest, cheapest way to 500HP. For $1000 you will have amassed power that will kick you in the ass when you hit the juice.
Of course, your tranny will probably be first to go, or your intake if its not tuned right. I'm not sure about the engine. I ran N2O with no mods until my tranny went. The engine had a tune for Nitrous, but had no other mods at all. I put about 30k miles on that engine before it was built. The tranny lost 6th gear first, then slowly progressed to destruction.
How about the cheapest way to get a fast and reliable car?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Luos
well as Mr. Luos posted he asked you to pick 2 for 1 there is no way to get reliable horsepower that is Cheap( if you go nitrous thats the only cheap most bang for your buck ) that is reliable sooner or later the parts will break and you will be thinking why didnt i just build it the right way. Now if you want reliable horsepower and you have a Second car you can either turn your motor into a stroker diamond producs are top of the line in my book so that all the internals are new and quality parts not just powered metal like the connecting rods that come stock in your engine will give way after hitting it with nitrous within a year. Now if you want to buy a drop in motor that is brand new i know of many companys that you can order a drop in motor 580 hp to the flywheel for under 7 grand with all forged parts that is just the engine though. the rear end is a diffrent story if you like traction control and abs expect to pay big bucks to keep them in the 9 inch fords or 12 bolt moser's(Neither will be a permanent fix though) . You can easily go pick up a mid 70's muscle cars rear end and beef it up and have a reliable diffrential for many years to come for under your rear end there are ways to save money with quality parts we are in a recession so if youre going to have modifications done now is the time to get 1 awesome of a deal . I am an Engine builder so i have seen the ins and outs of every ls block architecture fyi.
I'm in the middle of my 500 horse build. Cheap is not and option, unless you want parts falling out the bottom, or rapidly loosing horse[power as the engine eats itself. I won't be using nitrous, cause it just isn't my thing. I've seen it in too many Honda's. I plan on a 383 stroker, magic stick 4 cam, Texas speed heads, Fast 90/90 intake, and longtubes. I should easily hit 500 crank horse.
As everyone else already said, you need to put it too the ground. I already have SLP 3 point SFC's, UMI a-arms, UMI control arms, UMI panhard, UMI torque arm w/ relocation mount, Koni shocks w/ B&G springs, and a Moser 12-bolt rear w/ 3.73's.
The engine build is going to run about $6k doing all the work myself. Then I have to pay for a dyno tune, at the amount of $500 minimum. I already spent about $2500 on suspension and chassis, and about $2200 on the rear. So to get to where you want to be, you are looking at almost $12K if you can wrench it yourself.:suicide:
Thank you for that! That was really what I was looking for! How bad of an idea would it be to just drop a LS3 in the car? I am not sure how well it would match up or if it would even fit. I know a few places that have a ton of wrecked vettes, cts-v's and now new cameros.
Fitment isn't really an issue. It's roughly the same size as the LS1. The problem is going to be computer compatibility, and can't even begin to help you with that:pQuote:
Originally Posted by crombie02
Trick Flow 515 package
Full Intake/Exhaust
Tune
Supercharger/Turbo or nitrous
9-Inch Rear end
2 ways.
forged bottom end, tons of giggle juice, and a perfect tune.
or
supercharger/turbocharger
forged bottom end suggested here as well. lol
basically, another way to save money is to know what you want and do it right the first time,Quote:
Originally Posted by TmaxicanA
LOL...AMEN to that!!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by justinmc978
i think you are looking at this wrong to tell you the truth OP...also why 500rwhp ?? for bragging rights ? or to run at the strip ..as running at the strip isnt about rwhp ..as much as setup...do you want N/A ? or FI?
also cheap is a relative term ..1k extra isnt much when you have a 11-20k build
i wont get into how to get the power...but i will give a a VERY rough guide to the supporting mods needed.
9" rear end assembly 2300-4000 (depends greatly on 3rd member and other options and types of 9")
new clutch and flywheel 700-2000
new torque arm 400
new panhard bar 200
shocks 400-1k
springs 300ish-400
tires 1k -2k
wheels 500-2k (used or not plays into the price)
that is just a really rough run down on suspension etc supporting mods....as you can see ..saving a few bucks here and there wont mean anything when you are dealing with these price ranges
200 shot should get you to 500ishwhp. Yay we did it!!!!!! BOOOOOOOM
w00tQuote:
Originally Posted by Zinergy
How is that trick flow 515? I havn't heard much about it i know its FWHP but still seems like a good buy if your shooting for 11's like myself thanks.Quote:
Originally Posted by tatertot91
FWHP? This isnt a Honda forum. And i think theres a few people on that have bought it and made like 440hp at the wheels. Im considering the on of the larger kits for when i do my 408 because its matched partsQuote:
Originally Posted by Itllrun
Flywheel horsepowerQuote:
Originally Posted by T/A98
I didnt even think of that. I always refer to that as hp at that crank.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hi-Po
Well, the quickest and easiest way is to find a car that has it…..then buy it. It doesn’t get any faster or easier then that.
Are different electronics needed for the LS6 replacement?Quote:
Originally Posted by 02transamce
No.Quote:
Originally Posted by herculesrider1
The 500 rwhp is more for bragging rights and street racing. I have never taken my car to the track but street race all the time. There are a few fox body stangs around here and I have recently been trying to get them to race. They say they have around 400hp and about $5K-$7K in mods done. How much of it is the truth is up in the air. They do at least have a full exhaust however, because they sound good.Quote:
Originally Posted by shady milkman
crombie a little heads up on a black notchback. It is turboed and runs pretty dam good. all stock appearing "SLEEPER" the White hatch with the gunmetal wheel should not be a problem for you. :devil:Quote:
Originally Posted by crombie02
Yup, you just gotta deal with the last owners problems/screwupsQuote:
Originally Posted by waldo
But it is faster
Like this one
http://miami.craigslist.org/mdc/cto/1498973881.html
There is a 515HP Package by Trick Flow for $3,099, possilbly on sale for the holidays, and with a FAST intake 90/90 and Long Tubes, with the right rear end, you'll be damn close to it. Most Dynos show up to 475 with the correct Mods. You could sale the heads and by 243cc heads for even more power. Always a thought.
Does the white one have blue stripes? Does anyone here have the Trick Flow package you are talking about?Quote:
Originally Posted by casperss
badass2000ss i believe is his name. he has it
Yeah but 500hp and 500rwhp are two different thingsQuote:
Originally Posted by 00z28bubba
That setup i believe is 515 with Headers
You would need more than just an intake
He has a fast 92 makes 440 rwhp
The 515 package is a great one. Most dynos report 410-440whp depending on the dyno which is really good numbers. The package comes with heads, valve train, pushrods, cam, head gaskets, head bolts, exhaust gaskets and balancer bolt. They also include that this package should be used with a ls6 or fast intake manifold.Quote:
Originally Posted by tatertot91
Stickers..... LOTS of stickers.....
:lmao:Quote:
Originally Posted by suede
just a ton of the hand stickers that are on every honda in town,right. lolQuote:
Originally Posted by 402 Guru
yea thats the one....Quote:
Originally Posted by crombie02
Very much so.Quote:
Originally Posted by tatertot91
I figure I loose just over 100 HP through the driveline.
That would put you at 100rwhp :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Luos
Give or take three.Quote:
Originally Posted by tatertot91
so anywhere from 97-103?:lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Luos
Why everyone got to point it out to me? :(Quote:
Originally Posted by justinmc978
:itsok:Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Luos
Quote:
Originally Posted by justinmc978
I didn't like the idea that I had to drive 50 miles to refill the bottle each time.
If I had a refill station within 5 mile of my house. I would have NOS'd my car a number of years back. Had all the pieces dirt cheap. After thinking about what I was actually doing I sold it all for a profit and saved for the SC.
However, I know I could have built the motor cheaper.
Problem is I still wanted to be street legal / smoggable. Only way to do that was SC'd
Plus when I SC'd and intercooled the knock index went down and no worries about that
anymore. ;-)
So, that ended up being the cheapest way to go for me.
Harden the tranny, $2K of suspension / rear end work, and SC... your done.
Add a couple grand for wider meat /slicks and you have a great ride.
Over 500 HP you want to start thinking about stronger cranks etc... I think ours are reliable to ~ 600HP
again, make your plans, measure twice, and do it right the first time. best way to save moneyQuote:
Originally Posted by Mecinoid
He's right about that ...Quote:
Originally Posted by justinmc978
Stronger cranks? The crank can hold alot more than 600hp, its the other internals you need to worry about.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mecinoid
:yup: you beat me to it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zinergy
:haha:
:lmao:
poor Mr. Luos!!! Can't get a break, can he???!!!!
interesting thread. im subscribing to this 1
So are we saying that the motor internally should be able to handle 600 HP and then rods and pistons are issues? What are we talking about here? I was told by my the builder crank was the weak link. Maybe he was just suggesting a crank in my case. ???? Maybe he figured with all that I plan to do I'll eventually need it.
I figured my next step was a cam, rods, pistons and a good set heads.
There is no set number of HP for how long a stock motor will last. Mostly in the tune, but set-up plays a big role.
The crank is NOT the weak link.
Dan is running the stock one...and has seen 800+ on the dyno.
Thanks, I think I'd rather just put the money into heads, rods, pistons, pins, and connecting bolts etc... The bolts, pins and rods should add some strength. All nicely balanced and a blueprint job might help some.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Luos
Definately on the right track. Bolts can cause you problems more than the carnk. It's hard to put a failure hp number on any internal part. The number of factors involved like compression, rpm, crank case pressure, oil system, etc. all factor into how long a part will last.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mecinoid
i miss dan..i still need to come out to CO and see you guys.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Luos
He is still a sarcastic bastard, but it is all in the name of funny. His car is still mean as hell.Quote:
Originally Posted by shady milkman
Drove to the track 100 miles...went 11.40 or so. Drove home 100 miles. Not too bad for Nitto DR's and almost 4000 pounds.
I am so damn busy lately...feel free to come on out here though.
D-1SC Procharger. Thats what I put on my car and it makes 450 to the ground.