I have a 98 TA with 57k miles on it. I am about to have someone install a set of lowering springs on it and I was wondering if I need to have new shocks installed as well.. Any thoughts?
Printable View
I have a 98 TA with 57k miles on it. I am about to have someone install a set of lowering springs on it and I was wondering if I need to have new shocks installed as well.. Any thoughts?
plenty have done it on stock shocks but it is highly recommended to swap shocks..strano makes a great set!!
So I should replace the front and rear shocks? Ok. What about an adjustable panhard bar? Do I need that? Everyone says you absolutely need it if you lower an fbody..
I swapped all my shocks and springs for best handling and ride..I also added a adj pan hard in the event you need to adjust the rear once you lower it... I didnt have to adjust mine.
Do it all at once, it will save you the hassle of doing the fronts twice when you get new shocks.
For lowewring springs Koni's would be my first choice then billstiens.
And an adj panhard bar is a must.
you can use stock shocks but they are beat. koni adjustables all the way around. . . .they are expensive but you get what ya pay for
shocks are a must... stock one suck.
By lowering, the rates are most certainely higher, making the stock shocks even worse on that situation... so you'd want shocks regardless.
shout out to a fellow Ohio'n. I've been through mansfield a few times enroute to the in'laws.Quote:
Originally Posted by RaceMyLS1
that said-don't trust everything you're told by internet posts, etc. Talk to suspension specialists like Sam Strano (how about he doesn't even sponsor here, but we all just know lol).
I find this hard to believe. :dunno:Quote:
Originally Posted by Pewter_LS1
you can trust my posts :flex:
just 'cuz he "didnt have to adjust it" doesn't mean it's in the right place. although most lowering kits require panhard adjustments, strange enough as it may be, some cars just seem to keep the rear in place. i really dunno why, it must be variance in position of the panhard body mount from factory, 'cuz i've seen more than one car with perfect geometry after lowering.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Luos
If it's perfect after lowering with the stock PHB my guess would be the bar is bent.Quote:
Originally Posted by side2000
I have yet to see even a stock height car with the rear centered properly.
so if it's not centered properly from factory, it might just fall into place after lowering. :cry2:
i'm certainly not saying i would avoid putting an adjustable panhard rod on my car. no matter what, i'd put one on any f-body i owned, and check geometry/adjust accordingly. in fact, i check/adjust between every race.
Impossible considering the bars need to be shortened after the car is lowered.Quote:
Originally Posted by side2000
Actually the Watts link is a better setup anyway.
if the rear isn't aligned from factory, either raising the car or lowering the car is gonna put it in place. . .but i wasn't originally saying that for debate sake. it was more a joke than anything else. i was stating my experience with suspension setups, to be heeded however by whoever.
Sorry man I'm not here to argue with anyone.
Most of the Factory F-bodies I have seen have the rears biased towards the Left side. And to properly center them the bars need to be shortened. When I added my staggered wheels I ended up getting an adj PHB even though I was on stock springs.
What about non-adjustable rear panhand bars? You can look at signature for mods.
here's a good way to put it: because of the delicacy of the rear axle position (by design of the components that hold axle in place) it is crucial to constantly check the geometry and adjust accordingly. that means you will have to adjust it constantly due to stress, change in ride height, bushing wear, or you may get away with seldom adjustment/one-time adjustment, or never adjusting it at all.
Ok, so in addition to my lowering springs, I have an adjustable panhard bar and a set of front & rear shocks on the way. How do people adjust the panhard bar? Just like by using their eye or a tape measure, or what? I'm planning to have a shop install all of this, since I really don't trust myself. Or if anyone in my area wants to make some quick $$ + pizza + beer, let me know, haha..
if you were around me i'd do it for bud light. it's not hard and it comes with instructions. you are gonna pay a shop through your johnson to get it done. yep, to adjust panhard bar you can start by eyin' up the rear on both sides @ fender, then gettin in there with a wrench to adjust. that's usually good enough, but a tape measure is only way to get it 100% perfect in your driveway. need to make sure car is oncompletely flat surface.
By the way, which panhard rod did you get? some panhard rods can't be adjusted on the car, which kinda defeats the purpose of having adjustability.
The panhard rod I have is from UMI Performance. It's the powdercoated red single adjustable one, so that means it cant be adjusted while on the vehicle.. A customs shop here in my town is charging me $250 to install 4 springs, 4 shocks, and the adj panhard bar (they will adjust it too). That isn't bad at all considering the average price around here just to install a set of lowering springs is $350..
what springs and shocks are you going with? I'm planning on getting the Koni's and Strano springs real soon...please post some before and after pics
KYB shocks & Eibach Pro-Kit springs with a UMI Performance Adj. Panhard Rod. I duplicated this set-up from my friends 1998 Z28, his handles and looks excellent. It will be done by the end of this week, I'm just waiting on my parts. They should be here by Wednesday morning, so I'll post before and after pictures by this weekend...
been running stock shocks w/ the pro springs from eibach for 50k+ miles. theve bout had it. saved me money @ first which is y i did it. duznt ride bad or anything to me. just the trouble of havin to change out the front now. no big deal. if u got the money do the konis
Pics ftw after the install, we all wanna see how good it looks :yup:
Only thing keeping me from lowering is my damn driveway...the incline from the road to the driveway is too steep. I gotta go up crazy crooked to keep it from scraping the bumper
Install date is March 3rd at 9AM sharp :) Will post pics..Quote:
Originally Posted by Poppn
You are wasting your money on those KYB shocks....Quote:
Originally Posted by RaceMyLS1
Keeps You Bouncing
Get Koni's or start saving for them if you plan on running those springs. Not much else will keep up with them.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...mer234/kyb.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Luos
KYB is a highly respected brand and their AGX series is nothing to make fun of.. I know quite a few high dollar performance cars around town riding on KYB's.. Even if Koni's are better, I don't autocross nor do I ever plan to. It's only a mild 1.2" drop anyway..
And I can bet most of those high dollar cars are 1/4 mile setups.Quote:
Originally Posted by RaceMyLS1
KYB is a highly respected brand and their AGX series is nothing to make fun of.. I know quite a few high dollar performance cars around town riding on KYB's.. Even if Koni's are better, I don't autocross nor do I ever plan to. It's only a mild 1.2" drop anyway..
For cornering, the damping curve isn't appropriate for our cars... especially in the single adjustable, cause you have to chose between a decent compression or a decent rebound... while the other one won't be that well set.
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l1...b569a1a969.jpg
with 315/35/17 on the back and 275/40/17 on the front. the back does sit a little higher though even with the same profile tires.
Another problem with KYB's is that they won't warranty their shocks when used with lowering springs.
i've sent my koni's back once already to get rebuilt (lifetime warranty). . .no questions asked they just did it. i have heard others complain about the service, though.
Do the rear tires rub at all? I have 285/40 17 on the rear but in need of a new set.Quote:
Originally Posted by LUV2SK8TE17
with 315/35/17 on the back and 275/40/17 on the front. the back does sit a little higher though even with the same profile tires.
Just wanted to add my experience with my car.Quote:
Originally Posted by 9T8W66
I know you say "most", but mine was actually biased towards the passenger side at stock height...although I don't recall the exact amount, I want to say nearly 1/2" ? With the Strano springs now on the car, it is actually closer to perfectly centered than it ever was. When the weather breaks and I swap on the 17x11" rims and 315/35 tires, I guess I'll see exactly how close to centered that it is now. I know with a weighted string line taped to each quarter panel and centered to the wheel's center, measuring from string line to rim, it's close enough now that I'd feel confident saying that neither fenderlip is closer to either tire at this point.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pewter_LS1
Same thing with mine. Used the Eibach Prokit, changed to the UMI non-adjustable PHB, and it's perfect.
:ughlaugh:Quote:
Originally Posted by RaceMyLS1
KYB is a highly respected brand and their AGX series is nothing to make fun of.. I know quite a few high dollar performance cars around town riding on KYB's.. Even if Koni's are better, I don't autocross nor do I ever plan to. It's only a mild 1.2" drop anyway..
I sell them and I'll make fun of them. I make no claims that they are anything more than a workable (if not great or long term) solution to damping springs. They have the balls to do it, while they last but they never go about it in a very graceful manner and frankly they are not my favorite option.... In fact you'd be better off performance wise to keep stock springs and put your spring and PHB money to the Koni's.
All I want to do is lower my vehicle slightly. The proper way to do that is to get a adj. PHB and upgrade the shocks. In my non-racing daily driver situation, spending $1000+ on just shocks alone sounds crazy to me, especially for a 12 year old f-body that would still get spanked in the twisties by some punk in a stock Miata. If the AGX series is good enough for the $55,000 Supra's here in town, then I'm sure I'll do just fine with them driving to the grocery store...Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Strano
No offense intended, but you are continuing to show your ignorance here.Quote:
Originally Posted by RaceMyLS1
First, Koni's are not $1k+ in fact, they start @ $732 a set. Cheap? No, but that's some 27% less than your $1k+ assumption.
Second, shocks have no idea where you are driving your car. They are dampers, the control weight and in turn your handling and ride are effected. Those of us who compete don't run Koni's because they are Koni's. We run them because they offer the best control and we want the best handling, least upsettable car. These are things many want on the street as well.
As for the thinking that the Supra's do it so it must be great... well, I can't argue with that sort of thinking. It's just not rational thinking.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Strano
So you're saying get Koni's or nothing? There is no competition against them?
that's kinda like saying get a Corvette or nothing if you want a performance car.
koni's are just so good. . . . .
Did I say that? I don't think so. Show me where I said that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Poppn
Now, if you want a shock that's worth a damned and isn't fragile then I'd stay away from AGX's. If you don't want to that's your call and you won't be first to realize you get what you pay for. I sell AGX's, and Bilstein, and Koni, and Edelbrock, and I can sell QA1, and Monroe, and Gabriel, and on the other end uber-dollar shocks like Penske, Moton and AST.
Believe me, don't..... really doens't much matter to me personally. Do you deny that a Corvette is a better starting point for a performance car than a Camaro? You can't think a Z06 of even a C5 FRC, or even a C4 is inferior to an F-body in any number of ways...
I'm saying this. If you want to do research and find out why Koni's rock there is plenty of information. If you want to pull facts out of the air that really aren't true, like Koni's being $1k+, or that QA1's are better simply because they are Double adjustable (without knowing what that means and why it doesn't really matter for handling in most cases), or that AGX's are great because a bunch of guys with Supra's have them well that's your business.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Strano
I'm not looking to pull over 1 g on a skipad. I think some of us just want to lower our cars for a respectable price.
And again, you are showing just how little you know about this subject. Shocks do not make you pull 1g on a skidpad. Most important thing there are tires, by far.
If you just want to lower the car for a respectable price, then just slap some springs on and be done. Can't get cheaper than that.... well, you could if you cut you stock springs, so why not do that?
Not all of us are trying to become SCCA Champions. Not all of us have as much money as you. We all agree with you Koni's are the best, but you make it sound as if I should sell my car and give up on life if I don't install Koni's.. God forbid someone has a different opinion than you.. Sorry. (PS: you have the Koni logo tattooed on your body somewhere, don't you..? :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Strano
You guys are digging yourself a hole.
Do you think the car knows where it's being driven? I don't. Do you think somehow mass that needs damped suddenly evaporates when driven on the street? I don't.
I'm sorry that I have some credentials that can go to back up my findings. I'm sorry you think I'm so biased, despite my best efforts to enlighten those who are a bit more clueless. With attitudes like this it's any wonder I keep doing it. Ask around. When you talk to those who've had various shocks including Koni's which they like best, it won't be KYB or QA1's.
Maybe a great part isn't for you. Sometimes folks prefer saving money, and that's fine as long at they UNDERSTAND and don't have delusions that AGX's are as good as a Koni (or frankly built nearly as well as Bilstein's). You guys seem to be doing exactly that.
I think it's humorous that somehow the fact I've been successful in competition that somehow makes me incapable of understanding anything but competition. Funny, my car is tagged and street driven. I have taken customers for rides and the rides generally sells product because they see just how well I can make the car work (including riding less crashingly than stock).
Eh, what do I know? :rolleyes:
You are the most educated on this website, no doubt about that, and your famous in the f-body community (they love your springs, haha).. I'm happy that I get to ask you questions and that I get your input on things. Please don't write me off as some punk kid in a LS1, as I will want your advice on many future car dilemmas I will have.. I definitely understand that the AGX is not even close to Koni. I would love to have Koni's, but im paying $300 per used book for college, lol...
Quote:
Originally Posted by RaceMyLS1
no doubt +1
koni!
I have to thank all you guys on here for posting your individual opinions. When I decided I was going to upgrade my shocks and springs I initially thought about just going with the Bilstein BTS kit...but after doing some research I've decided to wait and save up for the Koni/Strano set up. Def not the cheapest setup but most raved by who have experience with them. My car is still covered and up on stands but before it comes down for the season I plan on contacting Sam.:wave:
strano performance parts huh? sounds like a typical self praising "champion" who doesnt care about people on a budget just trying to make ends meet and improve their car a little! you aint shit cuz youre not listening to me and youre buying cheaper parts other than my award winning set-ups. just shoot us then we wont embarass the motor-sports community any more.
sounds like someone really wants a set of strano's but is frustrated by the economy:leghump::jk::nana:Quote:
Originally Posted by dklowrider
not at all. i was listening to some of the posters trying to explain their position. i can buy whatever i want for my car, or the bike. i just choose where to spend my hard earned money. one consideration is the attitude of the people im giving it to.Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe00SS
My job is to offer the best parts and advice I can for a customer based on their wants and needs. If you think I should compromise automatically because some people like you can't afford, or are otherwise too cheap to pony up for quality parts, I'm sorry--I won't.Quote:
Originally Posted by dklowrider
I sell less expensive shocks, springs and swaybars (in fact I have less expensive versions of most everything I sell). Why? Because based on the *CUSTOMERS* wants sometimes those things will work, and when they will, I'll use them. But it's rare when someone calls and says "I want mediocre, can you help me?".
I don't know what your problem is here dklowrider, but there are always a few haters in every forum that just want to attack instead of learn and try and understand. Best of all, generally they have never ever even talked to me. I can only surmise hey just hate the idea that someone might have more knowledge than they do.
BTW, you aren't far away. My car is tagged for the street and I take folks for ride on the local PA roads all the time (and they are worse than yours in Harrisburg). When they get a load of how composed the car is, how not harsh it is, and how stable they are always somewhat impressed. I'd invite you to experience before judging. And you want cheap stuff instead, I can accomodate that as well. But don't delude yourself into thinking AGX's are Koni's, or that Eibach's are the same as my springs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Strano
Dude, no one ever said that the Koni/Strano setup wasn't the best. But you should accommodate customers requests when they say "I don't want to spend that much, and I understand that there will be a difference in performance, so what else do you have?"
i think you should reread all your postings here if you want to see who the hater is.while you're at it reread mine, i can buy anything you got any-time i want it, so you dont need to play me on the jealous, broke, wanna-be side. the people im talking about do have real world issues,school,family, whatever, and you talk down to them real bad. if you dont see it, denial is in full force.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Strano
and you just keep feeding the ego. :sillyme:Quote:
Originally Posted by Poppn
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Strano
get off your high horse.
