I'm not planning on making a career out of it by any means. 2 yrs tops and I'd probably move again if I couldn't transition into a VP title by then.
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I'm not planning on making a career out of it by any means. 2 yrs tops and I'd probably move again if I couldn't transition into a VP title by then.
It depends a lot on the industry you're in.Quote:
Originally Posted by 35th-ANV-SS
In general, anything over 1 year of time off from doing design is considered "stale". The same is true for many industries. Again, the interweb and Google will verify how extremely hard it is for people that have been out of work over 1 year to get a job.
Many slime-ball companies, and many companies looking to save money know that. So, they hire contractors and make job offers for a very low rate. Hey, taking a 30%->50% cut in pay is still better than unemployment. And, it gets a person "recent/current" experience. And, the company gets people very cheap.
I have very mixed feelings about those practices. But, after 2001, taking a low-paying contract job was my salvation in Engineering. Before that, I was very deep in the dot-com realm. That low-paying contract job kept the dead-time between jobs reasonable, the "then recent experience" looked good, and gave me a slight edge in going after jobs along with many dozens of other fully quailfied people.
You know the best the way to get into the position/area that best suits your desires and goals.
Yea, you need a job and you need to make money.
IMHO, if you can do what you love for work, even if it means making less money, then you're better off than 90% of the other people. Of course, some people's only goals are money.
I was in management for a few years in the 80's. I got out of that ASAP! I hated every second of every day of work.
For me, I love what I do now. It's a great fit. Will it last? Who knows? Before, I worked for the #2 and #3 computer companies at the time. I also worked for the #2 Networking company at the time. None of those companies exist any more.
Industry, technology, and the times change.
IMHO, doing what you love and what you're good at means that there's a better chance that you'll be better staying with the changing times, ways, methods, knowledge, etc.
That's my advice for someone that has seen ~60%->75% of his engineering co-workers leave the field within 15+ years. I'd say ~25% loss after 5->7 years. Close to 40%->50% after ~10 years.
If you've been in design for over 10 years, still get good reviews, good projects, have people ask you questions, then you're likely very good at what you do.
But, if you're desires are in another area, go for it! One thing that drives people from engineering, and contributes to them not being able to find a new job, is when they loose their passion/love for what they are doing. At that point "it's just a job". That's likely to not be enough in today's global economy and tough economy.
Good Luck!
Good luck with whatever you decide to do Jon.
I agree with trying to get into doing what you love.
Been doing what I love being self employed now for almost 10 years.
I'm 38 (as of this past March), and will wrap up my last job for other people ~ the age of 40..
Wife is 28 and will likely stop working @ age 30 or so if she wishes.
That's when we plan to do our major traveling as we want to see more of the country.
We've had our sights set solidly on that future for a while now and have been working towards that eventual goal.
I down sized already to only needing to work part time.
IMHO, I've said it before but if you want to make real money you've got to work for yourself.
Just my .02
Not certain I know what it is *I love*. Been in one industry doing one thing since I graduated college in 2001.
I guess love was a little much,, lol,, i guess "like very much" would have been better..:lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by 35th-ANV-SS
Usually, traveling pays well. I couldn't go anywhere and make what I do with my skill set.
I say do it, more money and it sounds like you wouldn't mind the position change.
Figure out the rest as you go.
I have just one thing to ask you. Can you sell ? You are not being asked to babysit customers, you are being asked to bring in revenue. I you can sell take it, if you are not sure then stay where you are. I have been in sales for over 25 years and the reason they are going to pay you more is because you are changing from a liability to an asset. Good luck.Quote:
Originally Posted by 35th-ANV-SS
I'm not confident I can. I'm confident where I am. I'm the best at what I do where I am. We are a global company and have positive earnings the last 12+ years. We have over 5000 employees and our net worth has grown from 1.2 billion to 3.6 billion since 2006. The company is on the verge of putting a strangle hold in the industry in the next 5 years.Quote:
Originally Posted by 2002ssslpI have just one thing to ask you. Can you sell ? You are not being asked to babysit customers, you are being asked to bring in revenue. I you can sell take it, if you are not sure then stay where you are. I have been in sales for over 25 years and the reason they are going to pay you more is because you are changing from a liability to an asset. Good luck.Quote:
Originally Posted by 35th-ANV-SS
I just don't want my talent to be wasted. This is why this decision is so tough for me. I'd be leaving everything I ever knew about corporate America.
I also never thought about how sales positions were the first to go in a lay off. Engineers are typically the last. Companies need engineers to keep designing new products even in the downturn so when the market comes back they have new products to offer.
My review is this month where I currently am employed at. I sent my resumé to the other company and it bounced back. Maybe it's a sign.
I'm pretty confused to be honest. I just want to make more money. I feel like I'm about 15K a year underpaid. I'm doing relatively well though.
to the OP:
1) you have a solid job, good at your tradecraft, company doing well (even in this shit economy), ...but you're unhappy??
2) one opportunity pops up, and you're ready to ditch your dog??? he may not be your best friend, ...but you are his...
:rock:
3) all worried about money, eh?... the more you make, the more somebody else will try to take (especially w/ the socialist tax rate on W2 income)...
4) you have a review coming up, ...and, by your account, are an indispensible asset?... i.e. you should have pretty good job security, ...why not take this opportunity to ask for a pay raise? - toot your own horn...
1099s' FTW! :DQuote:
Originally Posted by wileyCoyote
All good points, Wiley. Problem is, I don't feel secure. We have all new management now. All from an outside firm we bought several years ago. Pay raises are minimal now, where in the past they were decent. I really don't want to give up my dog either. She's an amazing pooch.
Go into your review with that thought in mind. If you feel that you are worth more then ask for it. The company will offer you a percentage but you need to go up to another level. Get a file together of what you have done since your last review and present to your boss before your review and SELL YOURSELF. Also keep the resumes going out to see what new opportunities are out there. I would also ask the company offering the technical sales job if you will have a contract and what the expectations are for the position. Do they have a gross sales figure for the year and what type of trainning will they provide. You can make alot of money in sales but you have to make alot more money for the company. Let us know what you decide.Quote:
Originally Posted by 35th-ANV-SS
I agree, you need to sell yourself in your review. If you can't do that, you can't do the sales part in the job you're applying for right? eh?
Maybe you'll get the raise your looking for, but applying for a job in a smaller PRIVATE company sounds really good to me. I work for a very small company and they treat us so well. Not saying that'll be your case, just saying.
If you are underpaid, send out resumes like others have mentioned. See if you get any bites.
I was also about to mention doggy day care...good luck.
Well...old thread brought back to life. Was contacted again. I sent in my resume. I had the interview today with the VP of Sales & Marketing. Went well. He discussed a lot. Ended things with telling me about the bonus plan, pension plan, and profit sharing.
I met with an ex co-worker a week ago to discuss this position with this company. He has been in the industry 20+ years. He said I'd be foolish not to take it.
The VP wants me to come to their plant next week for a plant tour.
I was told this family owned business does not fire people by several individuals now. Once you're hired, you're there for life unless you leave on your own will.
Looks pretty promising.
Being as im an animal lover and love my dog i personally couldnt think of getting rid of her, some may think thats crazy and who knows if the price was right and it was about me loosing my ability to sustain my car, home or food- i may have a change of heart but my dogs a part of the family now so it would be a difficult decision? Other then the dog issue sometimes a move is good so you dont get stale other times i think a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush:hmm:...yet all the bennies and perks sound good too cant say i wouldnt mind having your delema:naughty: :goodluck:Quote:
Originally Posted by 35th-ANV-SS
Most family businesses also have a ceiling for non family members so if your goal is upper management I suspect the pickings will be slim to none. My wife works for a family owned car dealership. They have many properties in Maine and are one of the top 50 largest businesses in the state. I went to school with the President. The bottom line is that non family members only advance to a certain point.
My maternal family business has been around since 1928. It has grown from my great grandfather and grandfather to a 100m per year construction business. There is a glass ceiling for non family members.
Please keep this in mind as you consider the pros and cons and don't let anyone blow smoke up your butt.
As it stands now, this entry level position I'd be making a substantial amount more right off the bat.
The current VP of sales and marketing is not in the family, neither is the engineering president. Both worked their way up the ladder.
Of course though, I'm sure the president and VP of the entire business unit is.
Regardless, I know I won't be president of a family owned business if there is someone in the family who wants that role.
I plan on using this opportunity to diversify myself and add experience to my current technical background in the industry. If I love sales, I'll work my way up to Regional Sales Manager and then VP of sales. If at that point I can't advance, I'll consider my options to move on to bigger things with another company.
Got the call today from HR and an e-mail from the VP asking for my salary requirements.
No idea on that. Thinking 15% more than what I currently make.
Aim high and see what they counter with, then meet in the middle. :dunno:
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