limits of mail-order tune

**02WS6dream** · 02-21-2008, 07:46 PM

I've seen that a couple of our sponsers offer mail-order tunes, which are attractive to me since i don't have anyone near me that tunes and I would trust a sponser here that I can see knows what they are doing and has experience with these particular cars. I am not planning on modding it enough to justify the money and time investment of tuning it myself. All I have done now are lid and catback, but am interested in a stall torque converter. I'm afraid to do that without access to a tuner to adjust shift points etc. The point of all this is: Would a mail-order tuned pcm be a good option for me? I've read a lot of negative about hand-helds and feel I may get a more personalized, effective tune going the mail route. Could a specific converter be tuned via mail without having access to the actual car? Aside from that, would I see any other performance increase as a result? Another long post..sorry..been wondering this for a long while now and haven't found many answers... Thanks for reading and any advice!

**Eagle** · 02-22-2008, 01:10 PM

Something like a Diablo would suit your needs well. A mail order tune will work for 1 time and IMO just doesn't make the sense to do that when you can get a hand held unit (albeit limited tuning abililty) will still get you past everything you've mentioned so far.

GL,
-Eagle

**02WS6dream** · 02-25-2008, 11:56 PM

thanks eagle!! I shy away from that because although i'm interested and continue to learn, i would prefer to have someone that is knowledgeable about all the parameters and the best way to set everything up at this point. the car is still my only means of trans. to work and school--so it's not something i'm ready to play around with for days at this point--eventually; in 2 years when its payed for and i have another DD, i will have learned more and be more willing to 'experiment'. Where ya at Frost??? Make me a pitch...what can you do for me?

I know we have other tuner sponsers, but i see Frost on here quite a bit....and I appreciate you for the time you spend helping us out here!

**Frost** · 02-26-2008, 03:44 AM

Well I am a bit biased and as such, was going to stay out of this thread and let the members hash it out.

Handhelds had their place in the history of tuning LSx's, but IMO now fall into the same area as the MAF translator. Tuning with a handheld is like operating on a person with a chainsaw. They make huge sweeping changes. For instance, from the factory, at WOT there is a "valley" in the middle of the timing map. It makes some tq just bringing it up. This is basic, yet with a handheld in order to raise some area of timing you must raise the ENTIRE map. This makes for a useless feature. Also, WOT AFR tends to move about here and there, and with the remedial PE editor you can only makes changes to large blocks of range again. To fix part-throttle fueling, they butcher a known-good table that is based on a real, physical and tangibly measureable value set; the injector flow rate table. The REAL error is VE/MAF. Also it's true they can push your WOT shift RPMs around a bit, and run 2-3 general "trans tunes" based on some number for firmness that is pulled out of the air. On a stock cammed and sprung car, there is really no need to move shift points, you can end up in valve float territory quickly.

The Vinci tuners are a little different, and make some more meaningful changes, particularly if you have a cammed car, though I still am in favor of in-person tuning to really maximize the driveability of such a setup.

A mail order tune is only $125 and I will make any changes desired for 90 days, you simply pay for shipping on the PCM. How much is a handheld again? I *NEVER* lock any PCMs that I tune.

**OnEbAdReDSS** · 02-26-2008, 07:51 AM

I can't wait for frost to do the mail order tune when i send it in next month!

**02WS6dream** · 02-26-2008, 08:50 AM

Thanks Frost!!! And so I'm clear; you are able to tune a specific TC through mail (w/out it being there?) Also, you went in to detail about your capabilities over a handheld--i'm curious as to other benefits i could expect aside from TC set-up--is it still worth doing if i don't do a TC? Car has lid/catback--that's it.

**Frost** · 02-26-2008, 10:00 AM

Typically I say to get the most for your dollar, M6 cars ideally will have headers at least. A4s gain through reduction of torque management, so a lid/catback car can pick up decently from tuning.