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New clutch install fail?

This is a discussion on New clutch install fail? within the Manual Transmission forums, part of the Drivetrain category; Stock 01 WS6. Installed LS7 clutch, slave, Tick extended bleeder. During bleed, pedal stuck to floor each push, manually pulled ...

  1. #1
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    New clutch install fail?

    Stock 01 WS6. Installed LS7 clutch, slave, Tick extended bleeder.

    During bleed, pedal stuck to floor each push, manually pulled up. Never let reservoir run dry.
    After half quart of DOT 3, the bleed wasn't working well anymore (slow reservoir empty). Clean fluid was coming out of bleed to that point, so I put it all back together and got a little resistance and return on clutch pedal.

    Started car, and clutch catch point was near the floor, and very weak pedal return. Hard to put into any gear, but could get each gear engaged, even reverse.

    Will try to bleed again tomorrow, but wondering if this is symptom of the one thing I didn't change: master cylinder? Also, does a new clutch "smell" a little when first installed? I got 198K out of the stock clutch, so this is my first experience.

    Thanks for your time!

  2. #2
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    I had a similar issue with my car after a clutch swap a few years ago. I replaced the slave, master and put in an LS7 clutch. Pedal was spongy and it engaged so close to the floor that it was grinding nearly every gear. Turned out in my case the new master was bad right out of the box.

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    Thanks for your time and reply. I've ordered a new Master. Just hope it's not a bad slave "right out of the box." Already dropped the tranny on my thumb the first go around!

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    2016 Camaro SS - Summit
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    It really is a love/hate relationship with these cars Good luck, I hope you get it fixed without too much more headache.

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    Man. So, I replaced master. Used pressure bleed method with Tick speed bleeder, and got the thing fully bled. Still, could not get clutch to engage and get shifter into any gear when engine running (can access all gears when engine off). So, assumed that since I never measured shim, that was likely the issue.... NOT. Removed tranny again, and measured shim, and A-B = 0.222in. Close enough according to Tick Performance experts. Soon, to reinstall tranny, but nothing has changed, and I have little faith it will work the second go-around. Any ideas as to how I might tell if I got a bad master or slave when purchasing both new, or does anyone have another suggestion? Just blindly throwing darts now.

  6. #6
    Junior Member jybravo70's Avatar
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    I have a very similar issue with a McLeod Street Extreme kit put into a 2002 CETA, replaced a leaking slave with OEM, installed a Tick Performance speed bleeder line and adjustable master cylinder. Removed helper spring on the clutch pedal, new pilot bearing and transmission fluid for good measure. It still didn't work. Got the Tick shim kit and installed middle shim, not working. Took the car to a shop to measure gap, they installed ALL the shims, it worked for 1 day and stopped. Found a part fell off of something, shop was calling it the pilot bearing but I saw the one that came out and the new one put in. Anyway they are telling me the pressure plate finders are either bent or springs too weak? I am calling McLeod to ask some questions but for now, the car won't go into gear with all 3 shims installed, system bleed 5 times, and all new parts everywhere.
    2002 Pontiac CETA #1315

    Stock Engine, McLeod clutch kit/Tick MC in T56, stock suspension

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    Man, that sucks. Seems I might be on similar path. Thanks for the reply. I'm going to shim into the suggested 0.125-0.200 range just to see what happens. Good luck to you!

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    Update: So, I pulled tranny second time after replacing master. Went ahead and put in a 0.055" shim from Tick Performance to move the A-B tolerance from 0.222" to fully within specs at 0.137". Had racing bros check my install and help put tranny back in (man it's so much easier with help!!). We bled system with some super vacuum canister he hooked up to the air compressor.

    Still, would not go into gear with engine on (every gear can be accessed with engine off). So, Mr. racing guy says, "You've done everything right, now you just have to get the clutch to set." Suspicious, I followed his advice. Put car in gear with engine off. Turned on and s l o w l y released clutch to get moving. Drove around neighborhood, slowly, using clutch as much as possible, stopping on hills, and slowly releasing clutch to get going. Everything started to loosen up, and go into gear a bit easier. He says, "you'll be fine. Keep driving, and the clutch will set itself." Not happy, I said thanks, and sent him on his way.

    After a second day of driving around, a few hard launches, and otherwise normal neighborhood driving, I'm having no problems. Catch point is just right off the floor, but now can go into any gear with engine running. Won't be completely satisfied until it behaves perfectly as expected, but looks like he was right. I would've never accepted this advice from the clutch manufacturer, but hope this story helps someone in the future.

  9. #9
    Junior Member jybravo70's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Black Dragon WS6 View Post
    Update: So, I pulled tranny second time after replacing master. Went ahead and put in a 0.055" shim from Tick Performance to move the A-B tolerance from 0.222" to fully within specs at 0.137". Had racing bros check my install and help put tranny back in (man it's so much easier with help!!). We bled system with some super vacuum canister he hooked up to the air compressor.

    Still, would not go into gear with engine on (every gear can be accessed with engine off). So, Mr. racing guy says, "You've done everything right, now you just have to get the clutch to set." Suspicious, I followed his advice. Put car in gear with engine off. Turned on and s l o w l y released clutch to get moving. Drove around neighborhood, slowly, using clutch as much as possible, stopping on hills, and slowly releasing clutch to get going. Everything started to loosen up, and go into gear a bit easier. He says, "you'll be fine. Keep driving, and the clutch will set itself." Not happy, I said thanks, and sent him on his way.

    After a second day of driving around, a few hard launches, and otherwise normal neighborhood driving, I'm having no problems. Catch point is just right off the floor, but now can go into any gear with engine running. Won't be completely satisfied until it behaves perfectly as expected, but looks like he was right. I would've never accepted this advice from the clutch manufacturer, but hope this story helps someone in the future.
    Great News on your clutch working out. McLeod RMA'd my kit and it was sent back for investigation. I asked if I could "downgrade" the kit from ceramic to organic and that was a big No, only a like for like warranty. No big deal, just hope it isn't too harsh, the Tick master has adjustable pedal height so if it is too close to the floor I can raise it a bit.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by jybravo70 View Post
    Great News on your clutch working out. McLeod RMA'd my kit and it was sent back for investigation. I asked if I could "downgrade" the kit from ceramic to organic and that was a big No, only a like for like warranty. No big deal, just hope it isn't too harsh, the Tick master has adjustable pedal height so if it is too close to the floor I can raise it a bit.
    Man, I hope it works out for you. I can certainly share the pain of frustration. Best of luck, and thank you for the encouragement previously.

  11. #11
    Spaz is My Mentor SMWS6TA's Avatar
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    In the 11 yrs I've had my TA I've had the stock clutch till it wore out at 108k

    Then LS7 Clutch Kit - Drove with this for 3 years till I blew up the LS1. For sub 500hp a solid clutch for stock replacement or even mild bolt ons.

    With new 403 build, I then used a Monster stg 4 that I bought off a member on here that was slightly used. Ran it for 3 yrs. Ran it like a rented mule, hard at the track and street.
    Great clutch, kinda miss it but it eventually died too.

    Currently on the SPEC III+ clutch, Monster had a long back order at the time and I needed one asap, plus it was on sale $100+ less and available. It has more back pressure then the Monster but only enough that I noticed the change. Could be that it was new vs the old worn clutch of the previous one. It bites instantly, no fade into, your either on/off period. So when you drop the clutch better be ready to go, it will go. Not so street-able as the Monster but I've gotten used to it.


    I've had the Tick MC since the LS7. It's finally given up the ghost. I have to pull mine and send to Tick to have it rebuild (Lifetime warranty)



    McLeod Clutch for our cars have had a huge let down. Not sure why just I've never heard anyone having any good satisfaction using them. If you ever have to replace your bell housing just save time, frustration and go with Quicktime. I had to fight to return the McLeod BH because it wouldn't fit due to the scatter shield interfering with the oil pan. They wanted me to cut it to fit, sorry no. That would have void the return and more importantly the SFI rating.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by SMWS6TA View Post
    In the 11 yrs I've had my TA I've had the stock clutch till it wore out at 108k

    Then LS7 Clutch Kit - Drove with this for 3 years till I blew up the LS1. For sub 500hp a solid clutch for stock replacement or even mild bolt ons.

    With new 403 build, I then used a Monster stg 4 that I bought off a member on here that was slightly used. Ran it for 3 yrs. Ran it like a rented mule, hard at the track and street.
    Great clutch, kinda miss it but it eventually died too.

    Currently on the SPEC III+ clutch, Monster had a long back order at the time and I needed one asap, plus it was on sale $100+ less and available. It has more back pressure then the Monster but only enough that I noticed the change. Could be that it was new vs the old worn clutch of the previous one. It bites instantly, no fade into, your either on/off period. So when you drop the clutch better be ready to go, it will go. Not so street-able as the Monster but I've gotten used to it.


    I've had the Tick MC since the LS7. It's finally given up the ghost. I have to pull mine and send to Tick to have it rebuild (Lifetime warranty)



    McLeod Clutch for our cars have had a huge let down. Not sure why just I've never heard anyone having any good satisfaction using them. If you ever have to replace your bell housing just save time, frustration and go with Quicktime. I had to fight to return the McLeod BH because it wouldn't fit due to the scatter shield interfering with the oil pan. They wanted me to cut it to fit, sorry no. That would have void the return and more importantly the SFI rating.
    Doubt the home Finance Minister (wife) will allow any build up of horsepower in the near future, so hopefully this LS7 clutch will do. Day 2 of driving with a 1/19 inspection sticker (hoping the men in blue will understand) after this poor car sitting for a year. Man, it's nice to drive her again.

    None the less, although I'm going into gears now with little resistance, if I launch, it is not yet wanting to go into 2nd from 1st easily. Have to double clutch it in there, so won't be revving next to any mustangs any time soon. Do those of you with experience think this might work itself out? The clutch does catch RIGHT off the floor, and without an adjustable Master, I guess that's just how it's going to be.

    Again, I appreciate all the input received from members here. As a fair weather and infrequent poster, happy not to receive dismissal from cliques as happens on other sites.

  13. #13
    Spaz is My Mentor SMWS6TA's Avatar
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    New clutch install fail?

    how many miles on the transmission?

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    Quote Originally Posted by SMWS6TA View Post
    how many miles on the transmission?
    197.7k
    "You won't get wise, with the sleep still in your eyes, no matter what your dreams may be." -Peart

  15. #15
    Spaz is My Mentor SMWS6TA's Avatar
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    Any rebuilds on the transmission?

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    [QUOTE=SMWS6TA;1145592615]Any rebuilds on the transmission?[/QUOTE

    No. Clutch made it 197.7k, and I see where you're going.... Highly likely the tranny could use some work. Currently, trans sounds great, and was shifting perfectly when clutch died, but yes, it does have 197.7k miles on it.

  17. #17
    Spaz is My Mentor SMWS6TA's Avatar
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    Syncro's are probably long overdue. That's why I asked.



    The clutch like brake pads do have to break in for a bit. But if it keeps happening over 500 miles then you may need to redress it.

    Now when installing the clutch did you use the alignment tool? Checking it slides in and out freely as you tighten the bolts?




    Here's a question and I'm not trying to insult you but it has happened. Was the clutch disk installed correctly facing? If it's flipped around it could be doing the stuff you're having issues with.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SMWS6TA View Post
    Syncro's are probably long overdue. That's why I asked.



    The clutch like brake pads do have to break in for a bit. But if it keeps happening over 500 miles then you may need to redress it.

    Now when installing the clutch did you use the alignment tool? Checking it slides in and out freely as you tighten the bolts?




    Here's a question and I'm not trying to insult you but it has happened. Was the clutch disk installed correctly facing? If it's flipped around it could be doing the stuff you're having issues with.
    No offense, I very much appreciate your time! I was warned, so yes, clutch disk verified in proper direction. Used the alignment tool, and its slide was super smooth all the way in and out (abstaining from sexual jokes). Torqued everything to specs step-wise carefully, while ensuring alignment throughout the process.

    I'll give it some time as I don't have 20 miles on the clutch yet. My first clutch install since I was 16yo on a '70 Torino, so I am essentially total noob, but hey, it lasted 197.7k! I have nothing to complain about. I'll look into some tranny maintenance anyway. Thanks again for your time.

  19. #19
    Junior Member jybravo70's Avatar
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    Not that this would make a huge difference but when was the transmission fluid last changed? Judging by the condition of the fill and drain plugs I believe there was 20 year old fluid in my transmission. When we started the clutch work I went ahead and changed all the fluids, clutch system (had to due to it kicking off the whole messy project I ended up in) Transmission and rear differential (which identified a leaking pinion seal. My shifting IS different, I can "feel" the engagements as I move the shifter around. The only issue I have is the skip shift feature seems worse. I picked up a skip shift delete pigtail and will most likely put it in when it gets warmer (normal 1st to 3rd no issues, just when the light comes on does it become a pain to do).

    I did get an error code P0704 (clutch input switch error) which was due to my Tick adjustable being an inch or so below OEM position. When I investigated I found the clutch MC shaft from the pedal was bent! After straightening and re-adjusting the pedal engagement the clutch is night and day difference.

  20. #20
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    Tranny fluid had never been changed until now, with the clutch install. Since my last posts, and 2-300 miles of driving, everything seems to be working properly. I had performed the resistor skip shift delete from Install University, back in '05 or so. That's flipped out about your bent shaft! I replaced the MC with an O'Reilly's cheapo, and was worried all of this was r/t that. But again, everything is working properly, and not missing the 3rd gear screaming up the on-ramps now. I'd question things more, but don't want to look a gift horse in the mouth. I did change that rear pinion seal while things were apart, as it was obviously leaking, as well as the rear main seal while tranny and clutch were out. Really hope the replacement works well for you!!

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