Clunking into gear... How do I fix it?

[Naaman]

I've been trying to figure out how to get my 6 speed to shift smoothly without so much concentration. I've driven a few different manuals in my life, and my Camaro is the most difficult to shift well. Some other members have mentioned the following:

Weak links of the T-56:

- synchro's are hollow stamped and not solid
- bushings are plastic and not bronze
- 3-4 shift fork is AL and not steel
- shift rails are poorly designed which do not allow you to shift it really hard/fast at WOT

These T56's are just notchy peices of,,,well, I'll keep it clean
We've had 3 T56 cars, and currently on our 4th one. They all acted about the same,,,notchy shifts, and very difficult to get a full blown power shift. I've used various clutches from Ram, to LS6 etc...as well as 3 different types of shifters, adjustable hydraulics, you name it.

I've been able to make the trans shift a little better with these changes, but never comfortable enough to feel like I could really throw the shifter around at 6500 rpms. I chuck it up to the internal design of the trans with crappy factory blocker rings and sincros, along with a very notchy rail style shifter mechanism. Without actually tearing the trans itself down, and modifying blocker rings, better internal parts (which it needs anyway), the shift feel really isn't going to change.

I'm like you, I have other stick cars here, namely classic stuff with good ole muncies. Power shift all day without a problem. With adjustable linkage, a good shifter, and adjustable mechanical clutches, there just isn't anything better in my opinion. I'm so used to the butter smooth shift feel of a muncie I'll probably never get used to the T56

Let's assume that I have the resources to do the work myself. What parts and tools would I need to address these issues? Ball park cost of parts?

Can synthetic, or some sort of high performance trans fluid help any?

I LOVE driving my car, but I HATE botching a shift when I'm just cruising around town.

[My00Z28]

I've been trying to figure out how to get my 6 speed to shift smoothly without so much concentration. I've driven a few different manuals in my life, and my Camaro is the most difficult to shift well. Some other members have mentioned the following:






Let's assume that I have the resources to do the work myself. What parts and tools would I need to address these issues? Ball park cost of parts?

Can synthetic, or some sort of high performance trans fluid help any?

I LOVE driving my car, but I HATE botching a shift when I'm just cruising around town.

snap ring pliers, gear splitter/press, and average ratchet set not much needed to disassemble them just need to know what your are doing...

parts cost between 200-500 depending on what your are doing could even be more!

and fluid probably will not help, you want fluid that is not too slick, always use stock spec fluid!!

[Naaman]

snap ring pliers, gear splitter/press, and average ratchet set not much needed to disassemble them just need to know what your are doing...

parts cost between 200-500 depending on what your are doing could even be more!

and fluid probably will not help, you want fluid that is not too slick, always use stock spec fluid!!

That's a pretty wide dollar range. Which parts would I need to replace in order to change the way the drive train responds to a shift? Synchros? Snap Rings? For the moment, I can live without powershifting...

[My00Z28]

Synchro rings and some small stuff could be around 250

[35th-ANV-SS]

The notchy shifting is inherent to the T56 by design. If you want smooth shifting at high RPM, the T56 is not for you.

[Naaman]

The notchy shifting is inherent to the T56 by design. If you want smooth shifting at high RPM, the T56 is not for you.

No, no... I'm talking about smooth shifting below 2000... unless I come off the clutch extremely slowly and hold it in the sweet spot for moment, there is about a 35% chance the transmission will "clunk" when I release the clutch... the whole car jutters when this happens, and I want to correct it.

[35th-ANV-SS]

[Knight]

You've got bigger problems than synchros, with the symptoms you're describing. Sounds like shift forks, gears, bearings, or all three. You'd be better off sending the tranny out to get rebuilt/upgraded. I can shoot you a pm of where I had mine done, if you want. I have no problems with mine. Shifts like butter....even at +6000 rpm.

[Naaman]

You've got bigger problems than synchros, with the symptoms you're describing. Sounds like shift forks, gears, bearings, or all three. You'd be better off sending the tranny out to get rebuilt/upgraded. I can shoot you a pm of where I had mine done, if you want. I have no problems with mine. Shifts like butter....even at +6000 rpm.

Interesting... now we're talking about thousands of dollars worth or headache, right? People who are much more knowledgeable than me (including professionals) have driven my car and not commented on anything like that.

I thought my issue might be with an aftermarket clutch (I know that performance clutches tend to be more difficult to drive casually), but others have commented that the T56 has parts that diminish the smoothness of the gear changes (maybe they misinterpreted my explanation?).

To be clear: I'm not concerned with the operation of the stick shift. Only the engagement of successive gears as my foot releases the clutch pedal.

[35th-ANV-SS]

I had my transmission sent off to RPM Transmission, which is a reputable company, and got their level IV upgrade on my T56. I haven't had any issues (it's been 2 years now) and soon will be testing it's durability with 540rwhp.

I drive my car pretty spirited , but do have low miles.

I can say that in stock form, my car shifted flawlessly at lower RPM's and still does. I never had any issues with the T56 or stock clutch.

I currently run a Spec Stage 3+ clutch with the built T56 and again, no issues.

What you are describing as a "clunk"...does this happen in all gear changes or just randomly and in one particular gear change?

Just as a FYI - I spent right around 2K to have my T56 removed, shipped, rebuilt, shipped back, and re-installed.

[Naaman]

Okay... let's see if I can describe it:

You know how if the car has enough forward momentum, you can shift without worry of stalling out (no need to raise the rpm)?

When I'm driving hard, I don't need to baby the clutch pedal. I can just press and release, shifting in between. If I'm just shifting (especially into 2nd, 3rd or 4th) during normal driving, I have to be very careful to release the clutch very slowly or else it just slams into gear (sometimes). I have to work the clutch (even at 15 or 20 mph) the same as if I were idling through a parking lot or a traffic jam (in the case of idling, the engine would stall... what I'm describing requires this same kind of footwork to prevent that slam/clunk when the vehicle is already forwardly mobile).

One thing that seems to be true: If I don't go all the way to the floor, but instead just push the clutch enough to be able to shift, it engages much smoother when I come off the pedal.

[Naaman]

Okay, I drove home from work and I counted no less than 35 up shifts... I was unable to duplicate the problem that I'm trying to explain (albeit I wasn't trying to clunk my tranny)... maybe I'm just inconsistent because I suck at standard...?

[wileyCoyote]

could it be driveline backlash/slop that you are experiencing? i wouldn't be surprised if this is amplified if the clutch is in bad condition/old, or if you work it in/out quickly at the lower engine rpms.

[Naaman]

I certainly feels that way (clunks feel like they're coming from aft of the driver seat), it feels that way since it's rear-wheel drive...

Though I still have not had an occurrence since my last posting... hmmm.

[Cutlass]

To me it sounds like you are describing a very grippy/grabby clutch. Or some sort of drivetrain clunk, like a bad TA mount, trans mount, motor mount, or excessive clearance in the rear end gears, u-joints, or transmission gears.

[35th-ANV-SS]

yeah I was starting to think u-joints myself...

[Naaman]

To me it sounds like you are describing a very grippy/grabby clutch. Or some sort of drivetrain clunk, like a bad TA mount, trans mount, motor mount, or excessive clearance in the rear end gears, u-joints, or transmission gears.

Well... the research is definitely cut out for me! I appreciate all the feedback.

Today on my way home, I had an experience as I was coming off the clutch in 1st gear. I let off the clutch just like any other gear, but I got the "juttering" as I released the clutch. I let it out "too fast." I was already going about 7 or 8 mph by the time I fully released the pedal. To me, it seems as if I'm not rolling fast enough for some part of the drive train, though it doesn't feel like it wants to stall...

I guess I'll start with the mounts. I noticed that you mentioned the torque arm. I was thinking about swapping to a tunnel brace mounted torque arm anyway... if that is the problem, might it be the whole problem?

[35th-ANV-SS]

I can't really relate. I don't think I've ever shifted my car under 2500RPM in the last 10 years I've owned it.

[Naaman]

I can't really relate. I don't think I've ever shifted my car under 2500RPM in the last 10 years I've owned it.

Wait why not? Is it bad to shift that low? Even from 5th to 6th? (Or going into 1st from a stop.. then what?)

[35th-ANV-SS]

Try shifting at a higher RPM and see if it still happens. I'm just curious.