Outer Tie Rods, help needed

**6-Speeder** · 12-09-2009, 11:30 AM

Hey i just took my car in to get an exhaust rattle taken care of and while they have taken care of that they say I need new outer tie rods as they are pretty worn out. So he gave me a quote which after some quick searching im calling BS on at least the price on parts not to mention he said he could only get them from the dealer. Quote was 600+ for it all btw.

So what I want to know is if theres anyone in the DC NVA area that can help me replace these or at least a better shop to get this done at. Weds is my only day off this and next week so if someone can get back to me today on this that would be great. Thanks!

**DIRTY JERZY** · 12-09-2009, 11:47 AM

you are correct to call bs it is not a 600 dollar job even with parts,labor,and the alighnment

**cammed goat** · 12-09-2009, 12:01 PM

I have NEVER heard of a tie-rod replacement/alignment costing $600. Not even for a 4-wheel alignment. Probably pulled a price outta his @$$ to avoid working on a GTO.

**Goat-E** · 12-09-2009, 12:04 PM

I got my tie rod ends from Kollar racing for about $53 shipped in 3 days and the shop I went to charged me another $50 to put them on. Here they are http://www.kollarracingproducts.com/...ars-Tie/Detail They are really easy to replace. I had to drop them down when I did my bushing kit. I could do them in 30 minutes.

**6-Speeder** · 12-09-2009, 12:10 PM

Originally Posted by Goat-E

I got my tie rod ends from Kollar racing for about $53 shipped in 3 days and the shop I went to charged me another $50 to put them on. Here they are http://www.kollarracingproducts.com/...ars-Tie/Detail They are really easy to replace. I had to drop them down when I did my bushing kit. I could do them in 30 minutes.

I saw those in my searching, I will prob grab them then. I dont have all of my tools where Im at now most of my stuff is in Richmond at my parents house. Ill be taking a look at the rods shortly im gonna go pick it back up in 20mins. I just have never had to look at that part and now i feel stupid seeing how easy a part it is to replace. Thanks though.

**cammed goat** · 12-09-2009, 12:32 PM

When you learn more about your car, and turn your own wrenches, you develop a sense of when someone else is BSin ya. But that's probably just me.

**Smittro** · 12-09-2009, 01:05 PM

With basic tools:

1. raise and support car.
2. remove front wheels.
3. clean off old tie rod end nut and threads with wire brush ( penetraiting oil and a rag will work) do the same to the rod threads.
4. remove cotter key.
5. spray tie rod end nut and threads with PB blaster or some penetraiting oil.
6. remove tie nut.
7. with short sharp blows drive (hammer) the tie rod end pin up out of the hub assembly.
8. wrap threads with black tape to mark were the joints location on the threaded rod.
9. remove old joint from the end of the rod by placing a wrench on the squared partion of the rod and another on the tie rod end.
10. thread new joint keeper (jam nut) nut on the threaded rod till it hits the edge of your taped mark, then thread on the joint.
11. rotate hub back into position and put the joint pin into place through the hole. (DO NOT HAMMER IN)
12. tighten nut down (this will pull pin down tight) then align the key holes.
13. push new cotter key through hole, bend one side of the key over in one direction and the other side to the oposite side.
13.5 With 2 wrenches tighten jam nut against the tie rod end..
14 put wheels back on. lower car
15 go and have it aligned you are done..

You are now only out the cost of the joints and for the alignment..

**mark21742** · 12-10-2009, 02:28 AM

$28 each through Pedders.

I'm just out of Hagerstown MD, I'd you want to drive up this way I'll put them in for you for free, then you just need to getthe alignment

**Goat-E** · 12-10-2009, 03:12 AM

I think all you need is an 18/19mm to take the bolt off of the top and a 22mm (I'm kinda guessing but its close to that) to loosen the locking nut off of the end plus a pair of wire cutters or needle nose pliers to take out the cotter pin. A ball joint for would be nice to drop it but you could get away with loosening the nut on top so it is just past the threads and smack it with a light sledge or a heavy brass hammer. A pair of vise grips to hold the rod and a pair of channel locks (slip joint pliers) to turn the tie rod end off. Count how many turns it takes to come off and then turn the new one on the same amount of turns. This should get you close to the same toe.

**mark21742** · 12-10-2009, 03:22 AM

Originally Posted by Goat-E

I think all you need is an 18/19mm to take the bolt off of the top and a 22mm (I'm kinda guessing but its close to that) to loosen the locking nut off of the end plus a pair of wire cutters or needle nose pliers to take out the cotter pin. A ball joint for would be nice to drop it but you could get away with loosening the nut on top so it is just past the threads and smack it with a light sledge or a heavy brass hammer. A pair of vise grips to hold the rod and a pair of channel locks (slip joint pliers) to turn the tie rod end off. Count how many turns it takes to come off and then turn the new one on the same amount of turns. This should get you close to the same toe.

I don't recomend it, but I did mine last spring and never got an alignment....no tire wear so far

**Goat-E** · 12-10-2009, 03:27 AM

Originally Posted by Smittro

With basic tools:

1. raise and support car.
2. remove front wheels.
3. clean off old tie rod end nut and threads with wire brush ( penetrating oil and a rag will work) do the same to the rod threads.
4. remove cotter key.
5. spray tie rod end nut and threads with PB blaster or some penetrating oil.
6. remove tie nut.
7. with short sharp blows drive (hammer) the tie rod end pin up out of the hub assembly.
8. wrap threads with black tape to mark were the joints location on the threaded rod.
9. remove old joint from the end of the rod by placing a wrench on the squared partition of the rod and another on the tie rod end.
10. thread new joint keeper (jam nut) nut on the threaded rod till it hits the edge of your taped mark, then thread on the joint.
11. rotate hub back into position and put the joint pin into place through the hole. (DO NOT HAMMER IN)
12. tighten nut down (this will pull pin down tight) then align the key holes.
13. push new cotter key through hole, bend one side of the key over in one direction and the other side to the opposite side.
13.5 With 2 wrenches tighten jam nut against the tie rod end..
14 put wheels back on. lower car
15 go and have it aligned you are done..

You are now only out the cost of the joints and for the alignment..

I'm cool with most of this but for the marking of the threads with the tape. The the after market ends are a little shorter than factory ends on the threaded side so 6 of one half dozen of the other. The toe in is probably going to be too great either way.
Also spray everything with PB blaster in the beginning. Let it set for a bit and tap the nuts lightly a couple of times to work the PB into the threads.
And use some jack stands!!!!! I don't want to see you on the news!

**mark21742** · 12-10-2009, 03:33 AM

Originally Posted by Goat-E

And use some jack stands!!!!! I don't want to see you on the news!

cement block cracked and I fractured 3 ribs several years ago

**Smittro** · 12-10-2009, 03:46 AM

Originally Posted by Goat-E

I'm cool with most of this but for the marking of the threads with the tape. The the after market ends are a little shorter than factory ends on the threaded side so 6 of one half dozen of the other. The toe in is probably going to be too great either way.
Also spray everything with PB blaster in the beginning. Let it set for a bit and tap the nuts lightly a couple of times to work the PB into the threads.
And use some jack stands!!!!! I don't want to see you on the news!

Yeah it's just the basics you'd definetly have to get her an alignment Asap. I know what you mean about the after market tie ends too my z34 was the same way for the new ones too. Tire sqwealed all the way to the alignment shop

I would definetly not recommend driveing far till she's aligned properly. But that will get ya there.. Oh yeah about the PB blaster part you mentioned. My bad I forget not everyone has non-rusty parts to work on.. Opps.

But 600+ for tie ends and labor made my jaw drop.. That's far too much for a relatively easy job..

**6-Speeder** · 12-10-2009, 07:47 AM

Well i ordered the parts, I remember him saying it would be like 105 for each tie rod end from the dealer, then labor, "taxes" and i think he was adding on the 108 bucks he charged for my exhaust work he did yesterday too.

If they do end up being shorter than my stock tie rod ends wouldn't I just screw it however many times less was necessary for it to measure up to stock position?

Mark21742 Ill let you know when I get my tie rods and see whats good.

**mark21742** · 12-10-2009, 08:07 AM

Originally Posted by 6-Speeder

Well i ordered the parts, I remember him saying it would be like 105 for each tie rod end from the dealer, then labor, "taxes" and i think he was adding on the 108 bucks he charged for my exhaust work he did yesterday too.

If they do end up being shorter than my stock tie rod ends wouldn't I just screw it however many times less was necessary for it to measure up to stock position?

Mark21742 Ill let you know when I get my tie rods and see whats good.

ok, wasn't sure how far you were from me, if you need me just let me know! its a very quick easy job

**Smittro** · 12-10-2009, 09:11 AM

Originally Posted by 6-Speeder

Well i ordered the parts, I remember him saying it would be like 105 for each tie rod end from the dealer, then labor, "taxes" and i think he was adding on the 108 bucks he charged for my exhaust work he did yesterday too.

If they do end up being shorter than my stock tie rod ends wouldn't I just screw it however many times less was necessary for it to measure up to stock position?
Mark21742 Ill let you know when I get my tie rods and see whats good.

You could but it would be hard to determine how many threads and turns are in the differance. IMHO Best to get them close to the mark and imediately get her to an alignment shop.. If you don't you could chew your tires up quick.

**Goat-E** · 12-10-2009, 11:34 AM

Originally Posted by Smittro

Yeah it's just the basics you'd definetly have to get her an alignment Asap. I know what you mean about the after market tie ends too my z34 was the same way for the new ones too. Tire sqwealed all the way to the alignment shop

I would definetly not recommend driveing far till she's aligned properly. But that will get ya there.. Oh yeah about the PB blaster part you mentioned. My bad I forget not everyone has non-rusty parts to work on.. Opps.

But 600+ for tie ends and labor made my jaw drop.. That's far too much for a relatively easy job..

GM rapes you on the parts price and they are selling you the same part that Kollar and Pedders are because there is only one manufacturer as far as I know. As far as rusty parts go, I might live down here in the sunny south but my GTO came fro Syracuse NY. Shoulda' seen the HELL I went through when I did the Pedders bushing kit. I had to file the rust off of some parts and re-paint them just to get them to go back on. The real miracle was getting the rear toe links to break loose and adjust plus keeping the rear cradle in alignment. But I did it! The car aligned 100% in the green! My alignment guy was shocked.

He did the alignment then told me to drive it for a couple of weeks then bring it back and he tweeked it for FREE!!!! That bitch is dead nuts now.

**Smittro** · 12-11-2009, 11:58 AM

Originally Posted by Goat-E

GM rapes you on the parts price and they are selling you the same part that Kollar and Pedders are because there is only one manufacturer as far as I know. As far as rusty parts go, I might live down here in the sunny south but my GTO came fro Syracuse NY. Shoulda' seen the HELL I went through when I did the Pedders bushing kit. I had to file the rust off of some parts and re-paint them just to get them to go back on. The real miracle was getting the rear toe links to break loose and adjust plus keeping the rear cradle in alignment. But I did it! The car aligned 100% in the green! My alignment guy was shocked.

He did the alignment then told me to drive it for a couple of weeks then bring it back and he tweeked it for FREE!!!! That bitch is dead nuts now.

Yes sir 4 wheel independant aint no cake walk IMHO for sure. Tho my 92z34 is a puller car she's 4 wheel independant as well. I get road wash directly on my drag links and directly on my rear calipers and LCA's. I had to break out the torches and cut the old stuff off..

I called it the HB&C setup (heat,beat&cut).... Because that's what I had to do to get the 2 piece LCA's apart to replace them and to put in a fiberglass longitudinal leaf spring with some KYB's..

**blackcar** · 12-11-2009, 12:13 PM

Originally Posted by Smittro

With basic tools:

1. raise and support car.
2. remove front wheels.
3. clean off old tie rod end nut and threads with wire brush ( penetraiting oil and a rag will work) do the same to the rod threads.
4. remove cotter key.
5. spray tie rod end nut and threads with PB blaster or some penetraiting oil.
6. remove tie nut.
7. with short sharp blows drive (hammer) the tie rod end pin up out of the hub assembly.
8. wrap threads with black tape to mark were the joints location on the threaded rod.
9. remove old joint from the end of the rod by placing a wrench on the squared partion of the rod and another on the tie rod end.
10. thread new joint keeper (jam nut) nut on the threaded rod till it hits the edge of your taped mark, then thread on the joint.
11. rotate hub back into position and put the joint pin into place through the hole. (DO NOT HAMMER IN)
12. tighten nut down (this will pull pin down tight) then align the key holes.
13. push new cotter key through hole, bend one side of the key over in one direction and the other side to the oposite side.
13.5 With 2 wrenches tighten jam nut against the tie rod end..
14 put wheels back on. lower car
15 go and have it aligned you are done..

You are now only out the cost of the joints and for the alignment..

Very important step that is easy to over look.

Had an old 4x4 one time and was changing a tie rod. Didn't do #3 above. Got the nut to break loose but as I was taking it off it got stuck in the dirt and rust. Put PB Blaster on it AFTER it got stuck, but didn't help. When I would crank on the nut the tie rod would just spin. I couldn't loosen it or tighten it. Ended up cutting the nut off. And this was before I had ANY power tools except a drill. I drilled a hole in the nut and finshed with a hacksaw and a hammer.