98 Trans Am vs 05+ GTO....

**Street Lethal** · 02-11-2006, 07:35 AM

A few night's back.... took a ride over to a seven-eleven on Route 34 @ around 9:00PM. Wasn't really in a racing kind of mood (problems at work), and as I made my way past the Outback Steakhouse, I placed the directional towards "left", and waited patiently at the light. Delayed green took a few minutes, and when I finally got the go ahead, I started turning left onto Route 9 south. Before I even completed my turn, an 05+ GTO was coming opposite my direction, and as he made his right onto Route 9 south, we both paired up right in front of an Exxon gas station.

The Goat sounded pretty throaty, and just as I suspected, he hit it, and started to pull (I kept my cool all the way til the next light @ Old Mill Road). Eagerly waiting for me at the light in the middle lane, I pulled up right next to him in the left one. He's looking at my car, and I'm looking at his. In the corner of my eye I see that infamous "Safe Corridor" sign again....

"Screw it", I said to myself.... as I waited patiently for the light to turn green. I see the Goat pull up slightly, when bam, the light turned green. I gunned down hard on the throttle, and as my Trans Am desperately searched for any traction that it could get, I felt her starting to pull sideways on me. Suddenly, she hooked hard, and as the front end felt as if it was going to rip itself right off from the rest of the car, I was now pulling car lengths on him.

In the midst of things, I looked down at my speedo, which read "80", and as I came to my senses, I applied the brakes. I brought her back down to "55", with the GTO now running to my immediate right. Right in the heart of the Safe Corridor, this putz looks as if he wants to go from a roll now. Something inside of me was insisting that I didn't, and as I looked over at him to wave my finger "no", he hit it, then started to pull.

Still on Route 9 south, and now approaching Fairway Lane, I was hoping to pull up along side of him, and go from a dig again. He seen me speeding up to make sure I got along side of him again (traffic was light), but unfortunately, he immediately got in his right lane, hit the brakes hard, and pulled over into one of the newer gas stations. I got to the light over by Fairway Lane, and as I sat there waiting, doubt started to set in, "why would he pull away like that. did he even lanch with me back then. did he just want to see me launch. what, why, how, if etc..".

Suddenly, some guys in a 350Z pull up along side of me. Trying to get my attention, I rolled down my window with them saying out loud, "daaaaamn bro, what the hell you got in that thing". I started laughing out loud, then asked, "did that GTO even launch back there", they were like, "hell yeah, he too went a little sideways... but when you hooked, he hooked, but you were seriously pulling him"....

Of course, they then asked if I wanted to race. I placed a big grin on my face and said, "lets go". The light turned green, they began to pull, while I turned right, went home, and went to bed...

**mrr23** · 02-11-2006, 09:06 AM

nice job

**blue02Z** · 02-11-2006, 03:08 PM

Damn good story, damn good kill!! Your mods?

**Street Lethal** · 02-12-2006, 05:35 AM

Thanks guys...

Minor mods consisting of; SLP Lid, K&N Filter, FRA Mod & Stall Speed Converter. SLP pulley is going in this afternoon (finally found the time, thanks to the snow)...

As for the valvetrain, there's a slight possibility I have a "mystery cam" in there, as although I was told she was stock, she consistently kept pace with my buddy's ZO6 last year from a dig. Hmm...

**Capster78** · 02-12-2006, 11:08 AM

What kinda stall. That can make a big difference. I think the 05+ GTO's are prety evenly matched with an LS1

**Street Lethal** · 02-12-2006, 01:50 PM

Originally Posted by Capster78

What kinda stall. That can make a big difference. I think the 05+ GTO's are prety evenly matched with an LS1...

TCI SSF-3500

Very true about making a difference against the Goat, but not that much of a difference... unless I'm running against a horrible driver (which I've since been suspecting).

**Capster78** · 02-12-2006, 04:36 PM

Originally Posted by Street Lethal

TCI SSF-3500

Very true about making a difference against the Goat, but not that much of a difference... unless I'm running against a horrible driver (which I've since been suspecting).

Are you serious.. A stall converter can knock .6 tenths off your 1/4 mile time just by keeping you in the meat of the power band.. It does make a huge difference. If you get some suspension under there youll drop even further by being able to take advantage off all that lost torque down low at the line when you spin. I went from a 13.39 to a 12.72 with my 3500 stall on my 99 I use to have. Then with some suspension work and moving a little weight around I droped it to a 12.26.

**Street Lethal** · 02-12-2006, 04:58 PM

Originally Posted by Capster78

Are you serious...

I'm very serious. Even with the stall, my Trans Am, employing it's stock 16" rims, should not have pulled an M6 GTO that seriously. We both broke loose, and once hooked, we were both well within our respected powerbands. I'm very familiar with what a stall can do... but pulling on him as if he accidentally shifted from 1st, to 6th, is not one of them.

**Capster78** · 02-12-2006, 05:26 PM

You should pull a GTO prety well from a dig with that stall. If you know how a stall works it basically multiplies your torque down low.. your car is lighter than a GTO and it has a ton more torque down low.. not brain surgery.. Your going to pull it as long as you know how to use the stall.

**Street Lethal** · 02-12-2006, 05:41 PM

Originally Posted by Capster78

You should pull a GTO prety well from a dig with that stall. If you know how a stall works it basically multiplies your torque down low.. your car is lighter than a GTO and it has a ton more torque down low.. not brain surgery.. Your going to pull it as long as you know how to use the stall.

Had I had the proper traction from the dig, I'd agree with you. Plus, were both assuming here that the driver of the GTO does not know how to launch, or bang gears. I have not had the chance to run my newest project yet, but high 12's, with traction, is pretty obvious to me. Not saying that my Trans Am wouldn't take him in the 1/4, I'm just saying that I'm not too convinced that he gave it it's all....

**moat2005** · 02-12-2006, 09:42 PM

For all that it's worth, I drive an A4 05' GTO stock and I pulled an 02 WS6 M6 stock by two car lengths up to 100mph. In the stock form, depending on the driver the LS2 in my opinion is faster than any LS1.

**bluegoat06** · 02-13-2006, 09:39 AM

first of all, nice kill man
2nd and a question for Capster78, could you elaborate on your "a lot more tq down low" comment??? the weight difference is only 200-300lbs average between both cars unless he has one of those factory stripped out z28's.

**toneloc60** · 02-13-2006, 12:31 PM

Nice kill. I've seen a few races of F-body vs. GTO. Of the ones I've seen, F-bodies have one most of them. The only ones that I have seen where the GTO beats the F-body was when the GTO had a lot of mods and running on ET Streets.

From what I know, the GTO is a little tricky to launch. The IRS throws a different wrench into the mix. That added to the fact that most F-body drivers have had more of a chance to learn to launch their cars. But, whatever.

Good kill. Keep it up.

**Capster78** · 02-13-2006, 03:54 PM

Originally Posted by bluegoat06

first of all, nice kill man
2nd and a question for Capster78, could you elaborate on your "a lot more tq down low" comment??? the weight difference is only 200-300lbs average between both cars unless he has one of those factory stripped out z28's.

He has a high stall torque converter which multiplies the torque at the bottom of every gear by keeping the car in its power band longer. A torque converter will normally net .6 tenths improvement with the proper tires and a small ammount of suspension work all this just by geting it out the whole faster and generating more torque at the bottom of the power band. I to have seen several F-bods take out GTO mostly because of the launch and the weight advantage the F-bods have. Its really a drivers race when you get into the earlier model F-bods 98-99.. But 00-02 will normally nose out a GTO.

**moat2005** · 02-13-2006, 07:09 PM

I would agree that 00-02 WS6 vs. the 05,06 GTO would be a drivers race. However, the GTO has a lot more horsepower and torque out of the box. Even though the GTO is 300lbs heavier, I think that with a good driver, the GTO is a faster car stock for stock. I understand that the M6 GTO is hard to drive. I personally have an 05' A4. Notice I said stock for stock. I am from Indianapolis Indiana, and I have seen some wicked f-bodies around here! So I am here to say that I have total respect for all f-bodies.

What are some of the posted times for the 00-02 WS6
or Camero SS in stock form?

How about a stock 03,04 cobra? Have you ever heard of an f-body or ls2 out driving a stock cobra in the stock form?

In closing I know that there are a lot of 05, 06 GTO's running high 12's and trapping 109-110. With drag radials the GTO's are easily running 12's. So please give me some feedback!

**Capster78** · 02-13-2006, 07:23 PM

Originally Posted by moat2005

I would agree that 00-02 WS6 vs. the 05,06 GTO would be a drivers race. However, the GTO has a lot more horsepower and torque out of the box. Even though the GTO is 300lbs heavier, I think that with a good driver, the GTO is a faster car stock for stock. I understand that the M6 GTO is hard to drive. I personally have an 05' A4. Notice I said stock for stock. I am from Indianapolis Indiana, and I have seen some wicked f-bodies around here! So I am here to say that I have total respect for all f-bodies.

What are some of the posted times for the 00-02 WS6
or Camero SS in stock form?

How about a stock 03,04 cobra? Have you ever heard of an f-body or ls2 out driving a stock cobra in the stock form?

In closing I know that there are a lot of 05, 06 GTO's running high 12's and trapping 109-110. With drag radials the GTO's are easily running 12's. So please give me some feedback!

There have been a few f-bods in the high 12's with just drag radials. However it is really rare. Most GTO's Iv seen are running mid 13's at best. Its kind of hard to belive that drag radials are cuting almost a half second off.. but then again iv seen crazier things.

**TransAm45** · 02-13-2006, 07:28 PM

Originally Posted by moat2005

... How about a stock 03,04 cobra? Have you ever heard of an f-body or ls2 out driving a stock cobra in the stock form?...

About a week and a half ago.. I was riding with my buddy in his '05 GTO with 2400 miles on it. We were on 435 S in kansas city.. and an 03+ cobra pulled up along side us. They both slowed down to around 50-55 and the cobra gave 3 honks. The Cobra jumped but by about 125-130 the GTO had the cobra by almost 2 lengths. It surprised me because the GTO is an auto.. but it runs strong.

**bluegoat06** · 02-16-2006, 07:47 AM

Originally Posted by Capster78

There have been a few f-bods in the high 12's with just drag radials. However it is really rare. Most GTO's Iv seen are running mid 13's at best. Its kind of hard to belive that drag radials are cuting almost a half second off.. but then again iv seen crazier things.

Originally Posted by moat2005

How about a stock 03,04 cobra? Have you ever heard of an f-body or ls2 out driving a stock cobra in the stock form?
In closing I know that there are a lot of 05, 06 GTO's running high 12's and trapping 109-110. With drag radials the GTO's are easily running 12's. So please give me some feedback!

Capster78, if it's runnig mid 13's is only because traction issues. some people went with the 18" wheels option, with a 235/40 tire. bad for 340rwtq car street/stip, i went with the more standard 17" wheels and 245/45 tires for more or less that reason.

Moat2005, this happened last week at speedworld dragway in arizona,track elevation 1450ft, DA for the night: 1000, it was a GTO vs Mach1 kind of day.

one of the red gto's in the video is actuallly an 05 with mufflers delete,maf delete,air bags, and nitto 245 dr's. his best of the night was 12.5@111mph, his slowest time was 12.70@110mph, his 60's were between 1.8 and 2.0, the other 05 gto (also red btw) with nothing but nitto 245 dr's and headlight removed ran 12.7@109mph.

Also notice the silver 03 or 04 cobra on the video.he has CB and dr's,he was having traction issues, his best et for the night was 13.1, best trap speed was 111mph. the car should et better with a good driver, or at least with better tires.

http://videos.streetfire.net/recentv...15283C1A4C.htm

**bluegoat06** · 02-16-2006, 07:55 AM

Originally Posted by Capster78

He has a high stall torque converter which multiplies the torque at the bottom of every gear by keeping the car in its power band longer. A torque converter will normally net .6 tenths improvement with the proper tires and a small ammount of suspension work all this just by geting it out the whole faster and generating more torque at the bottom of the power band. I to have seen several F-bods take out GTO mostly because of the launch and the weight advantage the F-bods have. Its really a drivers race when you get into the earlier model F-bods 98-99.. But 00-02 will normally nose out a GTO.

it won't , the gto has the edge stock vs stock or similar mod vs similar mod , is heavier than then fbody yes, but hp/tq on the ls2 makes up for the weight difference. throw the same tc on the auto 05/06 gto and the difference would go to the gto again. of course, depending on the fbody mods the difference can be made up depending on who has more mods or not, and if the fbody is one of those factory stripped out z28's

and from a dig, on average, it would depend on who has more traction, the fbody rear live can launch better, but is not a mustang like rear end. both cars can get 1.8 60's with nothing but nitto 245 dr's on stock suspension.

stock 05 goat m6 vs T/A m6
http://video.projectcamaro.com/Playe...FC9-40EB-BFE4-