ABS Removal

**hot93rod** · 06-19-2011, 07:49 AM

Does anyone know what company offers the ABS removal kit for our cars... I found it about a year ago or so, but failed to note what the company name was. If anyone knows, or has done it, I'd like to hear from them! Thanks!

**ls1camino** · 06-19-2011, 08:01 AM

SMJ, I think. I have a kit sitting in my garage, I'll confirm it later.

**hot93rod** · 06-19-2011, 11:41 AM

I'll do a search on that in the meantime... but when you do get back to me, can I ask why you didn't install it if you have the kit?

**ls1camino** · 06-19-2011, 04:20 PM

Yeah, it's SMJ Manufacturing...I'll PM you the link to their website.

I'm not sure...I want to ditch it, but I'm also afraid that I'm going to have to do some hard braking/maunvering for some reason and I'm going to miss my ABS.

**35th-ANV-SS** · 06-19-2011, 05:22 PM

Any reason for wanting to remove ABS? Just curious. I can see traction control, but I don't really see the reason to want to remove ABS.

**Too Fast** · 06-20-2011, 02:19 AM

^^^I agree. Hot Rod, why don't you want it? This is one electronic thing I really like, especially on wet or dry quick stops. Winter, not so much, but I don't drive mine in the winter.

You could pull the fuse, or disconnect a wheel speed sensor, but then the light would be on.

**ls1camino** · 06-20-2011, 03:31 AM

Weight reduction and cleaning up the engine bay.

Like I said, if my car wasn't driven on the street more than the track, I would have ripped it off the car months ago.

**35th-ANV-SS** · 06-20-2011, 06:09 AM

The weight savings you get by not having a critical feature on the car that could result from crashing or not doesn't seem favorable to me.

**ls1camino** · 06-20-2011, 07:10 AM

I think you guys don't fully understand the point of ABS. It's supposed to enable you to steer while braking. It actually increases your braking distance by a little, because it's locking and unlocking your brakes. If you don't drive in rain or snow, ABS is almost completely pointless on dry pavement, cause if you're braking as hard as it takes to activate the ABS, you're too close to the object that you're not going to be able to steer out of the way as well.

**bouigha123** · 06-20-2011, 07:28 AM

My truck didn’t have abs and I never had a problem. If you know how to drive without it then you should be ok, I took a course on it a few years ago. You hit the brakes first to slow let off make the turn and go back to the breaks, this uses the weight of the engine to make the tires bite and make the quick turn. It took me a lot of practice to get it down, but now that I have abs I don’t think id want to go back haha.

**35th-ANV-SS** · 06-20-2011, 07:44 AM

Originally Posted by ls1camino

I think you guys don't fully understand the point of ABS. It's supposed to enable you to steer while braking. It actually increases your braking distance by a little, because it's locking and unlocking your brakes. If you don't drive in rain or snow, ABS is almost completely pointless on dry pavement, cause if you're braking as hard as it takes to activate the ABS, you're too close to the object that you're not going to be able to steer out of the way as well.

Correct, if I need to brake hard because an object is in front of me, yes, I want to be able to steer out of the way at the same time. ABS allows me to do that. You don't have to "slam" on your brakes for ABS to activate.

Also, ABS does not increase your braking distance, at all. In fact, it decreases it. ABS slows a wheel that is skidding (no traction) down faster. Keeping the wheels from skidding while you slow down gives you two benefits; you slow down faster and you can steer while slowing down.

You "pumping" the brakes isn't anything like ABS at all. ABS is releasing and applying the brakes in "mili-seconds". You can't even come close to hitting the brakes 15 times per second with your foot.

**hot93rod** · 06-21-2011, 03:00 PM

I have to say that from the research I've read about ABS LS1camino is spot on.... that is the main reason why I've considered removing my ABS. As well as cleaning up engine bay, and less front end weight... which that same weight will increase stopping distance (est. @ only 16 lbs, but every bit counts in my book). I think it was on car and driver, or motortrend or some similar car shot that showe abs vs. non, and each time wet, and dry stopping was improved w/o abs. When it comes to snow, no! abs is much better, but look up the research for yourself, don't listen to what we say (seriously), b/c when messing w/factory safety stuff, you have to make an educated decsion for yourself

**Too Fast** · 06-21-2011, 03:14 PM

^^^Uh, from personal experience ABS drastically decreases the dry stopping distance and increases the snow stopping distance, since it won't allow snow to build up in front of the tires. Try it for yourself sometime. I have. I disconnected a sensor on my Trans Am and proved it. Try to modulate the brakes as fast as the ABS does, you cannot do it.

It also gives you electronic brake force distribution.

But if you want to steer out of the way, then you don't want to allow the snow dam to build in front of the tire.

Do you have any links to what you claim?

**hot93rod** · 06-21-2011, 03:26 PM

nope, i just started looking it up here by doing a search, like i said i only saw it on a car show w/certain sports cars... what i'm finding is just like you said though. Maybe what i saw was based on older abs systems or something i don't know? But i do very much remember being surprised at the results they showed (abs not as effective as traditional brakes) in straight line stopping. So far, it seems i've been proven wrong! But hey, we should def. all do our own homework on it, the best thing to do is test it for yourself, which is what i might just have to do, haha. Thanks for the input.

**35th-ANV-SS** · 06-21-2011, 03:26 PM

ABS makes you stop quicker in ALL weather conditions...period.

**Too Fast** · 06-21-2011, 05:08 PM

^^^try it for yourself on snow/gravel, then report back.

**35th-ANV-SS** · 06-21-2011, 05:56 PM

I don't drive my car in snow or on gravel

**Too Fast** · 06-22-2011, 02:29 AM

With a different car, silly! I don't drive Too Fast on snow/gravel either. At least, whenever possible. Sometimes the Garmin takes me on gravel roads, by then it's too late to detour lol.

**35th-ANV-SS** · 06-22-2011, 06:19 AM

Oh

I was about to say! I just might. I know in both dry and wet pavement though, ABS will make the car stop quicker.

Like mentioned, ABS works by pulsating the brakes about 15 times per second when it is activated. This in return allows the wheel to not slide, or at least resist sliding. Without ABS, if you hit the brakes hard and you begin to slide, you have zero traction and thus zero steering manuevering. When you're sliding, you're not stopping quicker.

**JohnnyBs98WS6Rag** · 06-22-2011, 08:46 AM

Originally Posted by 35th-ANV-SS

Oh

I was about to say! I just might. I know in both dry and wet pavement though, ABS will make the car stop quicker.

Like mentioned, ABS works by pulsating the brakes about 15 times per second when it is activated. This in return allows the wheel to not slide, or at least resist sliding. Without ABS, if you hit the brakes hard and you begin to slide, you have zero traction and thus zero steering manuevering. When you're sliding, you're not stopping quicker.

"Zero traction" is a tad bit of an exageration. True, if the front wheels are not rotating, you have no steering control. But thats not the result of having zero traction, its the result of the slip angle going to zero when the same patch of rubber remains in contact with the pavement. You could rotate that patch of rubber WRT the pavement sliding under it by turning the steering wheel, but the slip angle stays at zero since the tire rotation is zero.

If traction was zero when the tires stopped rotating, you'd never stop by locking all 4 wheels. But you are correct that maximum traction is achieved by preventing lock-up, regardless of the surface conditions. Theoretically, you could stop faster without ABS because ABS relies on tire-slipage to detect lock-up. Those short bursts of tire slipage reduce net average traction during a stop, and if you could just linearily keep the tires from barely slipping, you should stop shorter. However, you have only one pedal to control 4 wheels, which under less-than-ideal conditions don't have equal amounts of traction, so one of them will inevitabiliy lock-up before the others. ABS takes the advantage back from the human by controlling each wheel independently.