truck research

**0rion** · 01-04-2016, 04:28 AM

Getting to the depressing point looking at trucks. Been researching makes and years to narrow down my target list. Diesel only since I haul with it. The '11+ GM's are pieces of shit, the dodge's are pieces of shit, and the ford's are big enough pieces of shit that I won't even look at them. I'm now down to looking at the exact same truck I have now ('06) only in crew cab with low miles. We just need more room. GM's cp4 and their def/dpf emissions stuff have serious issues. No shortage of people having to replace that cp4 and fuel system at about $12k a pop when the cp4 grenades. The def/dpf stuff I can pull from the truck but would rather not have to work on a truck when I first get it just to keep it reliable. Dodge front ends have basically loaded the market down with buy back vehicles. Pretty frigin depressing really. Makes me not even want a new truck.

**sjgreen6** · 01-04-2016, 01:53 PM

I'll assume there is actually a question hiding in there somewhere so I don't feel that I'm offering unsolicited advice. So don't get a new truck. Find an older (2004-ish) F250 with the 7.3 that has a good body still with the normal high miles and do a full up restoration. New engine, new trans, new interior, update the suspension and you would still be cheaper than buying a recent model. The 7.3 will run an awfully long time if maintained properly.

**Firebirdjones** · 01-04-2016, 02:52 PM

Damn Orion, it doesn't seem that long ago that you got your 06 duramax. Time flies I guess. My father wanted a diesel when he was looking. Like you, he wasn't too thrilled about all that emissions stuff they toss on them now, filling up that DPF thing all the time didn't thrill him the least bit at all either, that's just more money. He ended up going with a 2015 3/4 ton gas crew cab with the 6.0 and 6 speed auto. Not the best tow rig but he'll get by with it, it was mainly more inside room he was after.

I've pretty much decided with my 05 duramax that it's the last truck I ever plan to buy, and if it needs something, I'll just fix it. Crate motors are relatively cheap (compared to what I'm paying for machine work nowadays

) I don't worry too much about the Allison trans, but it'll get replaced too if it ever needs it. I'm just glad I went with the crew cab right off the bat. I like the truck.

If it helps, my neighbor will be selling his 01 or 02 duramax (can't remember which year) he bought it new, garage kept, 30k original miles, crew cab long bed 2wd (we don't really need 4x4's out here

) It's a nice truck. He bought it with plans to buy a camper and travel, but never bought the camper, so he never towed with it, it just sits most of the time. I was thinking about snagging it myself just to have it, but I can't justify it having 2 trucks already.
I feel for ya bud, I hate even thinking about buying a newer car, I don't like the stress, most stuff out there is run into the ground, prices are high, insurance and tags are high, I just don't care to do it anymore. I'm keeping my old crap running.

**0rion** · 01-04-2016, 03:03 PM

that was more of just me bitching than asking anything I guess but advice is always welcomed. The 7.3 is a dependable engine but it just made shit for power. I'm also not very familiar with the trans ford used in those trucks. It would take a lot to get me into a ford period. Really the 06 duramax I have now is one of the better trucks as far as power and dependability. It's one of the most sought after duramax years because it was before all the def/dpf shit got tossed on them. I just kinda hate making a sideways move but it's really looking like that's my best option. Even then nothing is guaranteed...the 06's have their share of common problems too. Tranny cooler lines leaking, cp3's, pump rub, ect ect. My buddy has an 06 that he's sunk about $10k into the last 2 years. I saw an 06 on autotrader that had 58k miles on it in crew cab for $29,900. That's just too much money for that truck IMO. NADA says my truck is worth $20k give or take with 136k so I'm getting a crew cab and gaining 77k miles for $10k although I wouldn't pay asking price.

**0rion** · 01-04-2016, 03:41 PM

Originally Posted by Firebirdjones

Damn Orion, it doesn't seem that long ago that you got your 06 duramax. Time flies I guess. My father wanted a diesel when he was looking. Like you, he wasn't too thrilled about all that emissions stuff they toss on them now, filling up that DPF thing all the time didn't thrill him the least bit at all either, that's just more money. He ended up going with a 2015 3/4 ton gas crew cab with the 6.0 and 6 speed auto. Not the best tow rig but he'll get by with it, it was mainly more inside room he was after.

I've pretty much decided with my 05 duramax that it's the last truck I ever plan to buy, and if it needs something, I'll just fix it. Crate motors are relatively cheap (compared to what I'm paying for machine work nowadays

) I don't worry too much about the Allison trans, but it'll get replaced too if it ever needs it. I'm just glad I went with the crew cab right off the bat. I like the truck.

If it helps, my neighbor will be selling his 01 or 02 duramax (can't remember which year) he bought it new, garage kept, 30k original miles, crew cab long bed 2wd (we don't really need 4x4's out here

) It's a nice truck. He bought it with plans to buy a camper and travel, but never bought the camper, so he never towed with it, it just sits most of the time. I was thinking about snagging it myself just to have it, but I can't justify it having 2 trucks already.
I feel for ya bud, I hate even thinking about buying a newer car, I don't like the stress, most stuff out there is run into the ground, prices are high, insurance and tags are high, I just don't care to do it anymore. I'm keeping my old crap running.

the more I think it out the more it looks like a lateral move and staying in an 06 is the way I want to go. It's an idiot penalty for not getting the crew cab to begin with knowing I have 3 kids.

There's a lot of upside and downside to staying with an 06. I already know their weak points so there shouldn't be a ton of surprises.....hopefully. The downside is I've about got them all fixed on mine

I've did new brake lines, hubs, rebuilt the hydroboost, new power steering lines, new fuel lines, ect ect. I'll have to do all of that shit over again most likely. I'll also have to pull my stereo, subs, and speakers to put in the new truck. I'm not leaving my nice crap in this one only to spend the money again. Hopefully I still have my stock radio....I know I have one out in the shed but seems like I gave one of the 2 I had in there to someone several years ago. Want to guess the odds I gave away the one for this truck and kept the older one that went in our 98 blazer?

**Firebirdjones** · 01-04-2016, 04:34 PM

yeah that's how it works, you probably have the blazer radio in there.

I hope you find a truck that suits your needs without too much trouble. The tough part is all the upgrades done to what you already have. I'd be in the same boat, I've done exhaust, suspension, tires, custom switchable tune, air intake mods etc... I'm not going through that again on another truck.
I think finding one with low miles is the toughest part. Everyone seems to drive the wheels off these things, especially now that diesel is $1.74 a gallon out here, lol.
I'm not much of a fan for anything with 4-doors but I went for the crew cab for a couple reasons. One, I liked the extra storage it provided to do things like grocery shopping and keeping the food out of the weather in the bed. That back seat folding down flat is pretty cool.
Probably an extended cab would have sufficed for us, but I also started thinking about my parents living here, getting older, and we all needed a big vehicle that could seat 5 people at once, be spacious and comfortable at the same time, road trips, it had to tow, be a 4x4, etc... So another truck made sense to do all those things with one vehicle. Even though I have another truck it didn't do all those things.
In the end that's what led me to a crew cab truck with a diesel engine. If it weren't for getting hooked on a diesel engine, I would have bought a suburban, I really really wanted a suburban. So much so I was even serious about buying a suburban diesel conversion done by a couple different companies and was in contact with one in the Carolinas, but the prices were absolutely ridiculous, wanting $60k for a 15 year old burb just because it had a duramax swapped in. Nicely done, looked factory, but I wasn't paying that kind of money for it. So a pickup with a factory duramax is the route I ended up taking. No regrets though, I like the truck. These things pull like a friggin' locomotive, drive like a Cadillac to me, and more creature comforts than I can figure out how to use, or even need.

**5.0THIS** · 01-04-2016, 10:28 PM

My uncle has a 13 duramax, no issues other than a steering box. Get a new one, that's what a warranty is for, you wont have it beyond five years anyway

**0rion** · 01-05-2016, 02:40 AM

Originally Posted by 5.0THIS

My uncle has a 13 duramax, no issues other than a steering box. Get a new one, that's what a warranty is for, you wont have it beyond five years anyway

new just isn't going to happen....mid $50k's+ just isn't in the cards for me so I was stuck looking at years that seem to be the closest to having issues. The def/dpf problems seem to be better after '11 and that wasn't even what I was worried about because I could've taken all that shit off there. It's that damn cp4 and 4.2 that scares me the most. Not only does it seem fairly common it's frigin damn expensive when it does go out.....$10k-$12k. Just not the kinda money I'm willing to gamble with at all. I even thought about going back to gas...at least then the repairs are much cheaper and overall ownership is much cheaper than a diesel. I just can't see me towing 10k pounds with that out through Virginia every year. I'm sure with the 6.2L it could handle it......I just don't see it being much fun while doing it. I would also probably be close to payload with my 5th wheel hitch weight in the back of the truck and 5 of us in the truck.

**Firebirdjones** · 01-05-2016, 03:34 AM

I agree, I definitely wouldn't want to tow much with a 6.2 gas engine. Especially any long distance at all. My father and I have done that, with his new 2015 truck but it has the 6.0 in it. Wasn't fun on the hills.
Oddly, he was trying to buy one with a 6.2 in it last year, all the dealers kept telling him it wasn't available. All the 2015 3/4 tons he looked at were all 6.0's.
It's better with the 6 speed and that ridiculously low 4.xx first gear, helps it get moving, but that's the only benefit of that. Once up to speed the darn thing still struggles on the hills.
When we bring the big trailers back we are thinking about having him wait at the bottom of the mountain while I pull mine up with the duramax, then come back and unhook his and pull it up the mountain for him.

**Zinergy** · 01-05-2016, 05:41 AM

Well the tow capacity for a 06 duramax 2500 extended cab 6.5 ft bed is 12,000 lbs. The tow capacity for a 2015 Silverado 1500 with the 6.2 liter is 12,000lbs. Which one would tow nicer? Probably the 06 dura still but it would be interesting to drive both and really compare. But a 2015 1500 with the 6.2 liter is a 55k+ truck so once again we are going over your budget. You could probably find a 2012 1500 6.2 liter in your price range but their tow capacity is 10,800lbs and I don't think you can get the crew cab and 6.5ft bed in 2012 1500.

I am a bit disappointed in some aspects of the newer trucks as well. Like how the ram 1500 tailgate flexes like crazy when I step on it. Yea the tailgate is light and closes easier than my Silverado but you can actually see it flex when you step on it. Plastic bumper covers etc. Crap like that makes me look at older trucks. In fact I just test drove a 06 1500HD crew cab with the 6.0 liter and 40k miles on it. They were asking 19,995. Had it been a duramax with 40k on it I'm sure they would want 30-35k as that is what I see those low mileage 04-06 duras going for.

I do however like that you can now get crew cab and 6.5ft in all 1500s instead of the 5.8ft bed. It is an extra option though.

**Firebirdjones** · 01-05-2016, 05:55 AM

Rated tow capacities are all fine and dandy, but it really doesn't reflect how well the truck does when you have to pull up a grade.
Sure the 6.0-6.2's can do it, I'm not knocking it, it's just slower and takes twice as long, lol. I tend to wonder how long those little gas engines would last running them that hard and towing 10,000+ lbs. loads somewhat frequently.

They do okay, but even my old 79 454 1 ton still runs circles around both of my fathers newer 6.0 3/4 ton trucks when we pull trailers together. They do well out on the open road and around town....as long as it's flat. We hit grades and he struggles, mashing throttle and hunting for gears.
I would have really liked to see GM stick to some sort of larger gas engine to give the buyer more options but unfortunately they are stuck on this LS platform with nothing bigger than what....376 cubes?? The ability is there for GM to throw more stroke in these things and make some serious torque down low in the rpm range where it's needed in a truck, and offer it in the trucks exclusively. Unfortunately if you want towing power, the only option nowadays is diesel, and that tacks another $10k on the sticker around here.

**Zinergy** · 01-05-2016, 06:53 AM

That's why I said the dura would probably still tow nicer. But it would be interesting to actually real world compare the two. Last gen diesel vs newer gasser as sometimes they are the same price.

All the manufactures got rid of the big block v8 and v10 options. Everyone went diesel crazy and a very small percentage of consumers were buying big block gassers over the diesels. There just isn't enough benefit.

I can't really speak for the domestic trucks because almost everyone in the trades buys diesel but I have a buddy who works for a company who has a early 2000s tundra that has over 200k on the stock drivetrain which pulls a 8-10k work trailer for most of it's life although they only used it for local jobs, they would use a diesel for jobs further away.. Granted it did have the frame replaced as part of a recall Toyota issued so many things were replaced at that time but it already had 200k+ on it iirc. They also had a 2005ish ford f350 6.0 and a 7.3. He said they spent over 20k on each ford over the past how ever many years and spent a quarter of that on the tundra. They finally retired the damn thing to a plow only truck and sold the fords when they bought two 2014 Ram 3500s.

**0rion** · 01-05-2016, 08:59 AM

My problem with a 1500 would be payload or gvwr because I'm sticking 1300 lbs of hitch weight into the bed of the truck. That and unlike what seems to be the trend now I don't want to be right at the ragged edge of what the truck can do. It's not safe and it's not comfortable. I know the manufacturers say they can do it but the manufacturers aren't the ones hauling my family around in my truck....I am.

**Zinergy** · 01-05-2016, 10:46 AM

Originally Posted by 0rion

My problem with a 1500 would be payload or gvwr because I'm sticking 1300 lbs of hitch weight into the bed of the truck. That and unlike what seems to be the trend now I don't want to be right at the ragged edge of what the truck can do. It's not safe and it's not comfortable. I know the manufacturers say they can do it but the manufacturers aren't the ones hauling my family around in my truck....I am.

Right, I don't like being right on the edge either. I really don't like to tow more than 6,000 or so lbs for long hauls in my 1500 that is rated for 8800lbs. But that's also my point. The limits on the new 1500s are the same as your 06 diesel. So if you're not on the edge now then you won't be with the new truck based on ratings. Most new 1500s are rated around 1700-2000lbs payload capacity which is right on par with the 06 2500 duramax max capacity of 1850lbs, depending on options some new 1500s are rated 150lbs more than your 06 2500. Except the new 1500s with the 6.2 are too damn expensive. So it's an irrelevant point in your case.

You have to remember 1/2 ton, 3/4 ton, 1 ton are just words that mean nothing these days. Most 1/2 ton trucks are above 3/4 ton in payload capacity... some are even in 1 ton territory.

**Zinergy** · 01-05-2016, 11:10 AM

Here's a cool story. Went out to my truck on lunch to run to get some food. When I got back to my truck from Panera it wouldn't start. Have power, tried to jump for shits and giggles. Nothing. It won't even attempt to turn over. Yay

**0rion** · 01-05-2016, 12:04 PM

starter solenoid maybe? Knock the shit out of the starter. Is it clicking or doing anything? It could also be lose/corroded battery cable. Those will supply enough power to turn lights, radio, and shit like that on but as soon as you put a load to it there's not enough there to turn the engine over. I'm reading that as the engine isn't even cranking right?

**Zinergy** · 01-05-2016, 12:14 PM

Right, no cranking at all. No noises either... other than the hum of my fuel pump. I knocked the starter a bit with a knife I had but I will go back after work with a hammer and some wrenches. Normally I have a crate back there with some tools but I took that out for dump runs on Sunday and didn't put it back in. Damn my lazy tendencies. This is when working 25miles from home really sucks.

**0rion** · 01-05-2016, 01:12 PM

damn...that does suck. Make sure to check that hot wire going to the starter too....may have broke off or something. Tap on the starter relay too while you're at it. Good luck. Probably nice and warm up there today too so a perfect day for this shit to happen.