Reckless driving?

**Aetos** · 11-30-2008, 10:32 AM

Last night was driving out to go somewhere with a couple of friends.
Was being followed by my friend in his mustang,3 people in each car. We turn into a one-way,1-lane street, and proceed to semi-hit it and reach about 45-50mph.

At this point, we notice a guy come out from the sidewalk in the middle of the street, so I proceed to brake hard, needless to say it was a cop. He tells us to pull over, shut off our car, registration, license, etc. After all the bullshit, other cops come, his commanding office asking why we were disrespecting his officer(think the officer lied to his sergeant, as I complied with all his comands instantly). After they all leave, we were both issued a ticker for "reckless driving". The whole situation was witnessed by ONE cop, on the sidewalk who was issuing a parking ticket to some illegally parked car.

My question is, does he really have any basis to give us a "reckless driving" ticket? He does not know how fast we were really going, as he probably only heard us coming and thought we were going fast as both our car are somewhat loud. The street was only totally empty of all pedestrians and cars(road was empty until the next light, no cars whatsoever). He also forced us to brake hard as he walked right in front of our cars 10-15feet in front of us.

Would it be possible to fight this under the basic of A) I was going under the legal speed limit(>.>), B) he was the only officer there and was writing a ticket at the time, C) He had no way of tracking our speed, D) We weren't driving recklessly, nor were we racing because its a god damn one-lane road.

He "thought" I was going fast, because my MANUAL car was left in first gear meaning my RPMs were very high at a very low speed giving off the sound of speed, even though the speed was actually low.

Any ideas?

EDIT: I do not want to come out like what I did was right, and not illegal in anyway or form. I'm just wanting to try to get out of a ticket which I don't think I can "legally" be cited to from the information that officer had. I KNOW I AM WRONG.

**dpinson** · 11-30-2008, 10:45 AM

give it a try ive seen people get away with shit before

**TransAm11973** · 11-30-2008, 10:56 AM

u can try to fight it, but you will prob lose....i am sorry to say

**Banshee1967** · 11-30-2008, 11:06 AM

Originally Posted by Aetos

Last night was driving out to go somewhere with a couple of friends.
Was being followed by my friend in his mustang,3 people in each car. We turn into a one-way,1-lane street, and proceed to semi-hit it and reach about 45-50mph.

At this point, we notice a guy come out from the sidewalk in the middle of the street, so I proceed to brake hard, needless to say it was a cop. He tells us to pull over, shut off our car, registration, license, etc. After all the bullshit, other cops come, his commanding office asking why we were disrespecting his officer(think the officer lied to his sergeant, as I complied with all his comands instantly). After they all leave, we were both issued a ticker for "reckless driving". The whole situation was witnessed by ONE cop, on the sidewalk who was issuing a parking ticket to some illegally parked car.

My question is, does he really have any basis to give us a "reckless driving" ticket? He does not know how fast we were really going, as he probably only heard us coming and thought we were going fast as both our car are somewhat loud. The street was only totally empty of all pedestrians and cars(road was empty until the next light, no cars whatsoever). He also forced us to brake hard as he walked right in front of our cars 10-15feet in front of us.

Would it be possible to fight this under the basic of A) I was going under the legal speed limit(>.>), B) he was the only officer there and was writing a ticket at the time, C) He had no way of tracking our speed, D) We weren't driving recklessly, nor were we racing because its a god damn one-lane road.

He "thought" I was going fast, because my MANUAL car was left in first gear meaning my RPMs were very high at a very low speed giving off the sound of speed, even though the speed was actually low.

Any ideas?

Hmmm...bunch of guys in fast sounding and looking cars...cop almost gets hit. Would it have mattered or been different if it was a pedestrian, a woman with a baby or a man in a wheelchair...and the cop was only involved to write your citation?

Hard braking...(whether ped/cop fault or not)

His supervisor or Sergeant has no say in whether he writes infraction.

It only takes ONE officer to witness an infraction. Yes, he has the basis, depending on the criteria set forth in the state and the latter, the municipality the ordinance was issued. I suggest you "Google" Reckless driving followed by the state you live in. He does not necessarily need to have a radar gun on you. Experience has a strong weight.

If you feel wronged or disrespected by the cop, I suggest you file a complaint against him. But I will tell you what..I would be quite upset if you almost hit me with a "fast sounding first gear car".

You have the absolute right to fight the ticket. If you do not agree with the Magistrate, you typically have 7 days to appeal, post a cash apearance bond then your case is heard by a Judge. That decision is final.

To reiterate, if you feel wronged, file a complaint with the Police Department. And to answer that question you are thinking in your head, no, police, fot the most part do not "hide shit" or will they refuse to take your complaint.

Police misuse and abuse of authority is quite true. Just like we ALL know that ONE friend who drinks too much, smokes pot, drives without a license, insurance, slicks, NOS, beats his wife or girlfriend, cheats on his taxes...Just because johnny law has the authority, I wouldn't tout exclusivity as to who is the "prick".

In essence, We ALL are imperfect. Just becaust the cop checked you, I would seriously look at all the imperfections and flaws surrounding you. You never know, he may have or may prevent you from doing something stupid in the near future. I was given a chance 12 years ago by a cop who had my nuts dead to rights and I knew I was completely wrong. I manned up and took it like a man.

**Y2KSS1363** · 11-30-2008, 11:08 AM

Well, he could have written you up for speed contest, exhibition of speed, exhibition of acceleration, excessive noise, illegal mods, etc.

You could throw yourself at the mercy of the judge, that's likely your best hope.
Come clean and hope for the best.

Good luck.

**Aetos** · 11-30-2008, 11:12 AM

Originally Posted by Banshee1967

Hmmm...bunch of guys in fast sounding and looking cars...cop almost gets hit. Would it have mattered or been different if it was a pedestrian, a woman with a baby or a man in a wheelchair...and the cop was only involved to write your citation?

Hard braking...(whether ped/cop fault or not)

His supervisor or Sergeant has no say in whether he writes infraction.

It only takes ONE officer to witness an infraction. Yes, he has the basis, depending on the criteria set forth in the state and the latter, the municipality the ordinance was issued. I suggest you "Google" Reckless driving followed by the state you live in. He does not necessarily need to have a radar gun on you. Experience has a strong weight.

If you feel wronged or disrespected by the cop, I suggest you file a complaint against him. But I will tell you what..I would be quite upset if you almost hit me with a "fast sounding first gear car".

You have the absolute right to fight the ticket. If you do not agree with the Magistrate, you typically have 7 days to appeal, post a cash apearance bond then your case is heard by a Judge. That decision is final.

To reiterate, if you feel wronged, file a complaint with the Police Department. And to answer that question you are thinking in your head, no, police, fot the most part do not "hide shit" or will they refuse to take your complaint.

Police misuse and abuse of authority is quite true. Just like we ALL know that ONE friend who drinks too much, smokes pot, drives without a license, insurance, slicks, NOS, beats his wife or girlfriend, cheats on his taxes...Just because johnny law has the authority, I wouldn't tout exclusivity as to who is the "prick".

In essence, We ALL are imperfect. Just becaust the cop checked you, I would seriously look at all the imperfections and flaws surrounding you. You never know, he may have or may prevent you from doing something stupid in the near future. I was given a chance 12 years ago by a cop who had my nuts dead to rights and I knew I was completely wrong. I manned up and took it like a man.

Correction, I didn't nearly hit him, I stopped a good distance away from him, but he saw us coming down the street and I start braking as soon as I saw somebody look like he's about to go in the middle of the road(had no idea it was a cop, and wouldn't change my action anyway). I was nowhere NEAR hitting him, not even close, sorry if it seemed like I was stating that. From what I've been reading up on google for reckless driving, it usually has to be along with another type of citation, ie: speeding ticket, driving under influence of drinks/drugs, improper signaling, etc. I was given none of these, except a reckless driving ticket.

Originally Posted by Y2KSS1363

Well, he could have written you up for speed contest, exhibition of speed, exhibition of acceleration, excessive noise, illegal mods, etc.

You could throw yourself at the mercy of the judge, that's likely your best hope.
Come clean and hope for the best.

Good luck.

Yes, he could of, but he didn't. The only one where I believe he would have any sort of basis on would be excessive noise, but my car still isn't THAT loud anyway, i think. I don't have any illegal mods either(not yet). Don't you usually have to have like some sort of statement or record of speed to give some sort of "speeding ticket"? He didn't see me accelerating either, when he saw us I was at a cruising speed and started braking.

**Banshee1967** · 11-30-2008, 11:12 AM

§ 1212. Reckless driving. Reckless driving shall mean driving or using
any motor vehicle, motorcycle or any other vehicle propelled by any
power other than muscular power or any appliance or accessory thereof in
a manner which unreasonably interferes with the free and proper use of
the public highway, or unreasonably endangers users of the public
highway. Reckless driving is prohibited. Every person violating this
provision shall be guilty of a misdemeanor.

Key words..."unreasonably interferes with the free and PROPER use of the PUBLIC highway".

You were cited for not using the highway properly.

**Aetos** · 11-30-2008, 11:19 AM

Originally Posted by Banshee1967

§ 1212. Reckless driving. Reckless driving shall mean driving or using
any motor vehicle, motorcycle or any other vehicle propelled by any
power other than muscular power or any appliance or accessory thereof in
a manner which unreasonably interferes with the free and proper use of
the public highway, or unreasonably endangers users of the public
highway. Reckless driving is prohibited. Every person violating this
provision shall be guilty of a misdemeanor.

Key words..."unreasonably interferes with the free and PROPER use of the PUBLIC highway".

You were cited for not using the highway properly.

Yes, I read that before, but how did I not use the highway properly according to him? He has no indication of my speed, nor any other improper usage of anything else?

**Banshee1967** · 11-30-2008, 11:20 AM

Reckless driving in Michigan can mean traveling 45 in a school zone, 85 in a 70, passing a cop on a snow covered road and crashing.

http://www.newyorktraffictickets.us/...s-driving.html

**Aetos** · 11-30-2008, 11:26 AM

Originally Posted by Banshee1967

Reckless driving in Michigan can mean traveling 45 in a school zone, 85 in a 70, passing a cop on a snow covered road and crashing.

http://www.newyorktraffictickets.us/...s-driving.html

Of which I did none of.

"Often times a reckless driving traffic ticket is not given alone but given with multiple tickets which will add up easily to over 6 points."

Which again, i was only given one ticket, as he had no real basis for any other ticket, except probably excessive noise.

EDIT: I do not want to come out like what I did was right, and not illegal in anyway or form. I'm just wanting to try to get out of a ticket which I don't think I can "legally" be cited to from the information that officer had. I KNOW I AM WRONG.

**Banshee1967** · 11-30-2008, 11:30 AM

Originally Posted by Aetos

Yes, I read that before, but how did I not use the highway properly according to him? He has no indication of my speed, nor any other improper usage of anything else?

It is NOT accrding to HIM (police) It is up to the officer to make reasonable and just determination and for you, if you feel wronged, to fight it in court. A police officer merely observes and enforces. A Magistrate or Judge interprets such as a matter of your legal right of defense.

A police officer goes to a house where there was a murder and makes a report. A homicide detective makes scene and makes another report. Evidence techs makes the scene and makes a report, so does the coroner, crime lab processing the evidence. Another cop arrests suspect "X" in another state and makes a report and is extradited to the charging state.

A prosecutor makes a report...A Judge reads the prosecutors report who has read ALL the reports offered, from the police officer who first made the scene to the cop from the other state.

Then the defense has two options, plea or trial.

A jury hears and decides based on ALL the evidence. If requested, a bench trial (Judge only) can hear.

Point?

Guilt or innocence IS NOT based on the first responding officers report (in the above case) and observaitions, rather a "totality of the circumstances".

So with that a Judge hears both sides, time of day, traffic, road conditions, etc.

Like I said, if you feel wronged, take it to court. I highly suggest a blood sucking attorney though.

**Banshee1967** · 11-30-2008, 11:34 AM

Originally Posted by Aetos

Of which I did none of.

"Often times a reckless driving traffic ticket is not given alone but given with multiple tickets which will add up easily to over 6 points."

Which again, i was only given one ticket, as he had no real basis for any other ticket, except probably excessive noise.

EDIT: I do not want to come out like what I did was right, and not illegal in anyway or form. I'm just wanting to try to get out of a ticket which I don't think I can "legally" be cited to from the information that officer had. I KNOW I AM WRONG.

I said IN MICHIGAN (the quoted examples) Each state is different. You were exhibiting an unnecessarily need for speed, accompanied by hard braking (audible) with an almost near accident with a person.

Looks like a reckless driving ticket to me.

**Aetos** · 11-30-2008, 11:36 AM

Originally Posted by Banshee1967

Guilt or innocence IS NOT based on the first responding officers report (in the above case) and observaitions, rather a "totality of the circumstances".

So with that a Judge hears both sides, time of day, traffic, road conditions, etc.

Like I said, if you feel wronged, take it to court. I highly suggest a blood sucking attorney though.

Yes, I am well aware of that. I made this post to see if I have any relevant chance to actually fight this based on the circumstances of the given ticket? My license has no point or any citation on it so far even though I've only had it for about 2 years.

**Aetos** · 11-30-2008, 11:37 AM

Originally Posted by Banshee1967

I said IN MICHIGAN (the quoted examples) Each state is different. You were exhibiting an unnecessarily need for speed, accompanied by hard braking (audible) with an almost near accident with a person.

Looks like a reckless driving ticket to me.

I state it again. I was nowhere NEAR hitting the cop, NOWHERE near him, and the braking wasn't so hard that it was audible, it wasn't to the firewall braking hard, more like a bit more like 1/2 way down, maybe a bit more.

and the only reason I would have to brake hard in the first place was because some guy doesn't see upcoming traffic and decides to cross the street in the middle of the road when pedestrians have to use the corner of sidewalks to cross streets.

**Banshee1967** · 11-30-2008, 11:39 AM

Originally Posted by Aetos

Yes, I am well aware of that. I made this post to see if I have any relevant chance to actually fight this based on the circumstances of the given ticket? My license has no point or any citation on it so far even though I've only had it for about 2 years.

My opinion from what you have said? No.

There are three sides to every story. Yours, his and actual occurance.

I have also said to fight the ticket. Unwise not to.

You can try for a lesser charge, and I am sure a Judge or Magistrate would weigh the circumstances.

Like anything, this is 50/50.

**Banshee1967** · 11-30-2008, 11:40 AM

What was the speed limit and intersection?

What streets? What direction were you traveling on what street?

Time of day?

**Aetos** · 11-30-2008, 11:44 AM

Originally Posted by Banshee1967

What was the speed limit and intersection?

What streets? What direction were you traveling on what street?

Time of day?

Time of day was approximately 10pm on a clear night.

It was a one-way,one-lane road. with parked cars on both sides. Pretty decent sized lane though, can fit 2 cars side by side, but very very close, more for passing with a double-park.

Speed limit was 30.

The officer was on the sidewalk giving a ticket to an illegally parked car and was out of sight.

**c5z28** · 11-30-2008, 11:47 AM

Subscribed for outcome, if there is a shred of doubt for the court I think you can get off. The less info you give the better about what you were about to do. Probably going to have to higher a lawyer for them to do the fast talking for you.

**Aetos** · 11-30-2008, 11:49 AM

Originally Posted by c5z28

Subscribed for outcome, if there is a shred of doubt for the court I think you can get off. The less info you give the better about what you were about to do. Probably going to have to higher a lawyer for them to do the fast talking for you.

We honestly weren't planning to do anything. We were just driving to go meet up somewhere to hangout. Nobody ever actually goes 30 in NYC anyway, especially if the road is dead. Most people go 35-40, at least from what I've witnessed.

and yes, before anybody says it. I know its not legal to break the law if everyone else does it also.

**Banshee1967** · 11-30-2008, 11:50 AM

What streets?

Cars parked on both sides, fast approaching car, dark.

Unreasonable and unnecessary speed, close proximity is probably why he cited. If the officer has more than 5 years eperience as a traffic cop, most Magistrates and Judges would rule for the officer as experience as to relative speed. An officer need not be specifically trained to observe an approaching or passing vehicle and state "that car is traveling 44 in a 30". This lies with reasonable and prudent experience and observation. A Judge weighs heavier with an officer with 20 years as a traffic cop rather than one with 2 years.