Proposed bill would allow Illinoisans CCW

**BrntWS6** · 01-27-2009, 08:03 PM

Getting the IL Sheriff's Association support is BIG TIME. Illinois is one of two states that don't allow any form of LTC.

http://qconline.com/archives/qco/dis...cealed%20carry

Taking up arms: Proposed bill would allow Illinoisans to carry concealed handguns
Originally Posted Online: Jan. 24, 2009, 6:44 pm
Last Updated: Jan. 25, 2009, 4:09 pm
By Stephen Elliott, selliott@qconline.com

Illinois law enforcement officials are divided over a new attempt to permit the state's residents to carry concealed handguns.

Rep. John Bradley, D-Marion, has proposed a "Family and Personal Protection Act" that would set statewide standards for issuing concealed-carry permits and would exempt permit holders from various unlawful use of weapons laws. The bill, HB0245, was referred to the rules committee after first reading last week.

Similar bills have been introduced, and shunted aside, in most recent legislative sessions. This year, though, the idea could get a boost from the Illinois Sheriff's Association.

That group's new president, Henry County Sheriff Gib Cady, a supporter of concealed-carry laws, will urge the association to endorse the idea when it holds its annual meeting at the i wireless Center in Moline in February. He said he believes a majority of Illinois' 102 county sheriffs support a concealed-carry law provided there is training and background checks.

He said statistics show crime goes down in states with concealed-carry laws.

Not everyone in law enforcement feels that way, however.

"The threat to law enforcement would be enormous with that many people out there allowed to carry guns," said Moline Police Chief Gary Francque. "I am a supporter of a person maintaining a weapon in their home and defending in their homes, but to be out running around with concealed weapons, you're asking for a huge increase in violence."

East Moline Police Chief Victor Moreno warned that a concealed carry law, besides creating the possibility that handguns carried for protection could be taken away by criminals, would alter the way police and public interact. He said it would change officers' approach to an individual because of the potential of them carrying a handgun.

"Is that positive?" Chief Moreno asked. "The contact you have with the public will be different."

Proponents, though, believe a concealed-carry law will enable citizens to protect themselves.

"We know when somebody is mugged or robbed at gunpoint, they have zero chance of resisting," said National Rifle Association spokesman Todd Vandermyde. "Now, we're leveling the playing field."

Illinois is one of two states (Wisconsin is the other) without some form of a concealed-carry handgun law.

Sheriff Cady, who's held his office since 1978, said the 2008 U.S. Supreme Court decision that overturned a District of Columbia ban on handgun ownership is fueling new attempts to approve the concealed-carry law.

"It's out there," the sheriff said of concealed-carry. "The sheriff's association always strives to represent the wishes of the people, while at the same time maintain maximum public safety for those we represent."

"We're going to make a run at it," the NRA's Mr. Vandermyde added. "We're cautiously optimistic. We wouldn't be handing permits out like movie tickets."

State Rep. Pat Verschoore, D-Milan, who says he's in favor of concealed-carry, isn't so optimistic the law will pass.

"It's going to have a tough time, I think," Rep. Verschoore said. "You've got the Chicago legislators and most of the suburbs that will probably be against it. Most Republicans will vote with the downstate Democrats (for it). I'm like Gib (Cady) in that I believe there has to be stringent guidelines to this.

"You have to take a course and have a complete and thorough background check so you don't have some former felon or a person with a mental condition (carrying a handgun)."

State Sen. Mike Jacobs, D-East Moline, also supports a concealed-carry law.

"One day, the right to carry will be something that will be at their (citizens') disposal," Sen. Jacobs said. "The way I see it is that people have to make sure, if you're going to carry, to be trained."

Sheriff Cady agreed. "One of the issues is a person who makes an application for concealed-carry must expect a lot of scrutiny," he said.

Mercer County Sheriff Tom Thompson said he supports a concealed-carry law, provided proper training is in place for gunowners.

"Our concern is to make sure people allowed to carry (handguns) are, first of all, qualified to carry it," Sheriff Thompson said. "Obviously, you don't want everybody around with concealed weapons. I think it can be (a law) if it is written properly. It can be a good thing. A lot of people feel strongly on both sides."

Laimutis Nargelenas, deputy director of the Illinois Association of Chiefs of Police in Springfield, said the association is opposed to concealed-carry legislation.

"We do have police chiefs, particularly in southern Illinois, that think it might be a good thing," Mr. Nargelenas said. "Most of the chiefs in the suburbs in the Chicago area are concerned with that many more people on the street carrying firearms.

"We've been looking out there as an organization at various studies. Some (studies) show it may have an affect on crime. Others, it appears it doesn't."

Henry County State's Attorney Terry Patton said he would support concealed-carry legislation if data shows it reduces crime.

"I think it ought to be studied," Mr. Patton said. "Most people, their initial reaction is if you allow conceal carry, it would turn into the wild, wild west. But if evidence from conceal states proves that's not the case, that's reason to look at it in Illinois."

Rock Island Sheriff Mike Huff has a slightly different take. Sheriff Huff said he supports concealed-carry for correctional officers, prosecutors and judges. He wants more information before making a decision on allowing the general public to carry handguns.

Rock Island County States Attorney Jeff Terronez, Rock Island Police Chief John Wright and Rep. Mike Boland, D-East Moline, did not return phone calls seeking comment on the issue.

**Z28Thunder** · 01-27-2009, 08:08 PM

Good luck I hope the law passes. We have CCW here in Oklahoma. And can understand others wanting their state to allow it. To me there is no reason a law abiding citizen should not be able to carry. Its okay for the criminal to point a gun to your face and kill you. Give me the chance to meet force with force. And if that force is a gun the only like force is another gun IMO.

**ArcticZ06** · 01-28-2009, 03:41 AM

In AK you don't even have to get a permit to have a concealed weapon. Everyone is allowed that is legally allowed to purchase a firearm. Still not allowed in all the usual places like schools, bars, etc... No biggy there though.

**ibanez7** · 01-28-2009, 06:53 AM

its a tough debate especially when you live in IL, such as I do.

yes it would be great to beable to carry a gun for security measures!

however the debate is; IL is full of too many people that are too close to snapping or being pushed over the edge. IL is a very stressful state. Which in turns means, allowing civilians to carry guns would increase people going postal, in other words shooting up offices of employment, even commercial retail stores and rush hour traffic.

I enjoy shooting and owning guns. I dont believe or feel IL is a stable enough state to allow for a right to carry guns.

Will the right to carry a gun in IL, protect you from criminals, sure but is it needed? NO. if you live outside of the ghettos (in chicago) you are pretty safe. yes there are random acts of violence or domestic disputes, however you have a better chance of being struck by lightening twice before being shot by a bullet. Now if you live in the ghetto, you already own a gun without a permit/foit card so this law doesnt apply.

I feel that suburbs outside of chicago would see a steady increase in violence of people going postal.

**hutch1999** · 01-28-2009, 07:06 AM

I really hope that we get concealed carry. Look at it this way most of the people applying and getting these permits are going to be law abiding citizens. The "thugs" and "gangstas" already illegally carry firearms, most are already felonals. This law would help the common man and make a crimmal think twice about carjacking, robbing, or raping someone in Il. I understand we have the police, but the police don't prevent rape, a .45 will.

**Tobynine9** · 01-28-2009, 07:37 AM

Originally Posted by ibanez7

its a tough debate especially when you live in IL, such as I do.

yes it would be great to beable to carry a gun for security measures!

however the debate is; IL is full of too many people that are too close to snapping or being pushed over the edge. IL is a very stressful state. Which in turns means, allowing civilians to carry guns would increase people going postal, in other words shooting up offices of employment, even commercial retail stores and rush hour traffic.

I enjoy shooting and owning guns. I dont believe or feel IL is a stable enough state to allow for a right to carry guns.

Will the right to carry a gun in IL, protect you from criminals, sure but is it needed? NO. if you live outside of the ghettos (in chicago) you are pretty safe. yes there are random acts of violence or domestic disputes, however you have a better chance of being struck by lightening twice before being shot by a bullet. Now if you live in the ghetto, you already own a gun without a permit/foit card so this law doesnt apply.

I feel that suburbs outside of chicago would see a steady increase in violence of people going postal.

I'm not trying to pick a fight but that theory has been used time and again as more and more states legalized CHL/CCW permits through the 90s and 2000s as an argument against such laws. It has never proven true.

**SouthernBornThriller** · 01-28-2009, 08:19 AM

I hope it passes. I've always been a big supporter of concealed carry, and still continue to support people trying to allow concealed carry on campus.

Said this many times, but anyone who wants a gun can get one. Hell, I'm not old enough to apply for a CCW, but I could make a phone call or two, dig up a couple hundred bucks in cash, and have a pistol in my pocket by the end of the night if I wanted. The only ones any anti-gun laws hurt are the law-abiding citizens.

Personally, if I'm planning on robbing a store or bank or whatever in a place like Illinois...all I've got to worry about is any security guards on duty, and getting out before the cops show. If I plan the same thing in say, Texas...I've got to consider the fact that every single person in that store or bank may turn, laugh, and pump a couple hundred rounds into me. Guess where I'm gonna go to rob my bank?

**ibanez7** · 01-28-2009, 08:22 AM

Originally Posted by Tobynine9

I'm not trying to pick a fight but that theory has been used time and again as more and more states legalized CHL/CCW permits through the 90s and 2000s as an argument against such laws. It has never proven true.

your not picking a fight..

I all for being able to carry a gun, however I dont think IL stable enough for it.

yes maybe southern IL, or northwest IL, but not closer to chicago.

**rbob93** · 01-28-2009, 09:26 AM

This statement makes me laugh;

"The threat to law enforcement would be enormous with that many people out there allowed to carry guns," said Moline Police Chief Gary Francque. "I am a supporter of a person maintaining a weapon in their home and defending in their homes, but to be out running around with concealed weapons, you're asking for a huge increase in violence."

I guess he doesn't realize that criminals carry firearms whether or they are allowed or not.....one of the reasons they are called "Criminals."

**KahanaReef** · 01-28-2009, 09:32 AM

I'd like to see that passed in CA too.

**hutch1999** · 01-28-2009, 09:32 AM

Originally Posted by rbob93

I guess he doesn't realize that criminals carry firearms whether or they are allowed or not.....one of the reasons they are called "Criminals."

Thats exactly what I said in my post

**rbob93** · 01-28-2009, 09:44 AM

Originally Posted by hutch1999

Thats exactly what I said in my post

Yes you did basically.....

The statement I quoted came from the chief of police in Moline, that's why I pointed out the irony.

**KahanaReef** · 01-28-2009, 09:44 AM

And, they are the reason we need to carry guns in the first place.

**rbob93** · 01-28-2009, 09:47 AM

Originally Posted by KahanaReef

And, they are the reason we need to carry guns in the first place.

They are also the reason I always have.....legally or not.

**hutch1999** · 01-28-2009, 10:19 AM

Originally Posted by rbob93

They are also the reason I always have.....legally or not.

People should look at Texas, violent crimmals think twice about armed robbery, just for the simple fact that Texans love to pack and have the right to pack. They know if they pull a gun they better be prepared to get one or several pulled on them.

**BrntWS6** · 01-28-2009, 07:55 PM

Although some fear that allowing concealed weapons would lead to an increase in violent crime, the effect in the 48 states that allow it has been quite the opposite. Responsible adults that have been trained in the legal ramifications of carrying a firearm, of firearm safety, and in marksmanship have little reason to commit crimes with their handguns. For a license-holder to commit such a crime would mean financial and personal ruin, imprisonment, and the lifetime loss of the right to possess any firearm. In regard to concerned and law-abiding citizens, such a risk would virtually never be worth taking unless their life or bodily integrity was in serious danger. For these reasons, neither law enforcement nor non-carrying citizens need to fear a licensed civilian.

This is true even in highly populated areas. This notion of a "wild west" mentality breaking out simply is false and has never happened.

**nhraformula** · 01-28-2009, 08:17 PM

Originally Posted by BrntWS6

This is true even in highly populated areas. This notion of a "wild west" mentality breaking out simply is false and has never happened.

Being a chicago person, im gonna disagree.
you seem to forget that our murder rates beat out other bigs citys every year.
go on the south or west side, it already has the wild west shoot out mentality. put more guns in the hands of those idiots, it will be all out crazy.

**KahanaReef** · 01-28-2009, 08:31 PM

Originally Posted by nhraformula

Being a chicago person, im gonna disagree.
you seem to forget that our murder rates beat out other bigs citys every year.
go on the south or west side, it already has the wild west shoot out mentality. put more guns in the hands of those idiots, it will be all out crazy.

Well then, I guess that when I can finally move out of CA... I'll make sure to scratch IL off my list of possible relocation states

**Z28Thunder** · 01-28-2009, 08:40 PM

Originally Posted by nhraformula

Being a chicago person, im gonna disagree.
you seem to forget that our murder rates beat out other bigs citys every year.
go on the south or west side, it already has the wild west shoot out mentality. put more guns in the hands of those idiots, it will be all out crazy.

Most of those idiots can not legally own a gun. I just get tired of people saying CCW are idiots.

Taking this from BrntWS6

For a license-holder to commit such a crime would mean financial and personal ruin, imprisonment, and the lifetime loss of the right to possess any firearm. In regard to concerned and law-abiding citizens, such a risk would virtually never be worth taking unless their life or bodily integrity was in serious danger.

I like me freedoms to much to loose them as an idiot.

But when a criminal points a gun at my face or gf or wife or ....... KIDS... I want the option to be able to defend myself with like force. How do they have the right to point and shoot. Yet you do not want to give me the right to defend myself.

And as stated above also. All the states that have allowed it have not shown an increase in Civilan crimes.. AkA the non fellon...

**Tobynine9** · 01-29-2009, 04:33 AM

Originally Posted by nhraformula

Being a chicago person, im gonna disagree.
you seem to forget that our murder rates beat out other bigs citys every year.
go on the south or west side, it already has the wild west shoot out mentality. put more guns in the hands of those idiots, it will be all out crazy.

Your city also has some of the most restrictive laws regarding the ownership and possession of firearms in the country. "Those idiots" are already carrying guns. We might as well let the non-idiots correspondingly arm and protect themselves, no?