Would you spray?

**RealLiveMD** · 04-20-2008, 08:14 PM

I have one of the weaker HC combo making about 400rwhp 375tq. All the mechanic say that my cheatr cam 214/230 .601/.575 117 LSA would love nitrous. They're figuring a 125 shot should easily put me over 525rwhp, 500tq. I mostly just like to punch it from time to time on the street. Would you spray? I've read the sticky and I know that most people around here run 125 shots on stock motors with no problems, but I'm not sure if it's somehow more stress on the motor since I already have 400rwhp. Yes, I'm a noob to nitrous.

**jimmybling31** · 04-20-2008, 08:18 PM

Originally Posted by RealLiveMD

I have one of the weaker HC combo making about 400rwhp 375tq. All the mechanic say that my cheatr cam 214/230 .601/.575 117 LSA would love nitrous. They're figuring a 125 shot should easily put me over 525rwhp, 500tq. I mostly just like to punch it from time to time on the street. Would you spray? I've read the sticky and I know that most people around here run 125 shots on stock motors with no problems, but I'm not sure if it's somehow more stress on the motor since I already have 400rwhp. Yes, I'm a noob to nitrous.

it's more stress, and considering you have so much power already, I would worry about the bottom end, but I don't know the ls1 too well. someone else should be able to answer this better.

**allbaugh_04** · 04-21-2008, 05:21 AM

I've seen many go with 100 or 150 even. Personally I'd start small, 75 shot. That would be pretty safe.

**mrr23** · 04-21-2008, 05:28 AM

it is more stress on the motor. not so much the total hp as it is the sudden increase in torque that makes bad things happen. i've been 200 successfully on my stock motor. so long as your fuel supply is good, you'll be fine. go one step colder heat range on the plugs. have your tune checked to see how much they raised the timing. may need to lower it back down to near stock.

**RealLiveMD** · 04-21-2008, 09:17 AM

Would it be more of a problem with the head gasket blowing or something more major. If it's just a question of damaging the heads, I don't care, I'll pull off my pats and replace with AFR's.

**jimmybling31** · 04-21-2008, 09:23 AM

Originally Posted by mrr23

it is more stress on the motor. not so much the total hp as it is the sudden increase in torque that makes bad things happen. i've been 200 successfully on my stock motor. so long as your fuel supply is good, you'll be fine. go one step colder heat range on the plugs. have your tune checked to see how much they raised the timing. may need to lower it back down to near stock.

so even if your bottom end is not built for having 450hp you can run nitrous and bring it up that high as long as you aren't stressing your fuel system? or creating too much stress with the sudden jolt? if so couldn't you run a 2 stage system with a 75 shot then a 150shot to make it not hit it so hard?

**98camaro** · 04-21-2008, 01:29 PM

I'm pushing a 125 shot..only thing I have done is colder plugs. Its a dry kit, but it really gives you a damn boost. Probably been spraying for 6 months now, no problems at all.

**dpinson** · 04-21-2008, 03:51 PM

as long as your fuel can keep up a small shot would probably be ok but make sure the timing isnt to far advanced as was stated

**dpinson** · 04-21-2008, 03:52 PM

as long as your fuel can keep up a small shot would probably be ok but make sure the timing isnt too far advanced as was stated

**RealLiveMD** · 04-21-2008, 06:09 PM

I was planning on a new fuel pump and big injectors, I trust Dynospeed Racing for tuners even though most of their work is on mustangs (I hope that doesn't matter). I finally got the car to hook, So I'd hate to blow it up on the dyno.

**Zboner** · 04-21-2008, 06:11 PM

Do it, dont look back

**mrr23** · 04-21-2008, 06:24 PM

Originally Posted by jimmybling31

so even if your bottom end is not built for having 450hp you can run nitrous and bring it up that high as long as you aren't stressing your fuel system? or creating too much stress with the sudden jolt? if so couldn't you run a 2 stage system with a 75 shot then a 150shot to make it not hit it so hard?

again, it's not the horsepower that does a motor in. it's the sudden increase in torque and the amount of rpms you turn it. you have to remember, when you turn on nitrous, it isn't a progressive deal. it's all at once. let's say you are using a 150 shot. when you turn it on, it's 150 additional at all rpms. so, at 2000 rpms, the amount of stress would be double versus 4000 rpms.

also remember, horsepower is a product of torque. torque is created by increasing cylinder pressure by adding more fuel and oxygen.

to combat this, manufacturers have made progressive controllers. these allow you to set the amount of nitrous to start off with and how long until you go 100%. for instance, you put in pills for a 150 shot. you set the controller for 25% initial and 2 seconds to full 100%. 150 x .25 = 37.5 hp initial and then go full 150 after 2 seconds time. there are different kinds of controllers.

cliff notes = control the amount of torque at low rpms and you'll have less stress on the motor.

**RealLiveMD** · 04-21-2008, 06:45 PM

Originally Posted by mrr23

again, it's not the horsepower that does a motor in. it's the sudden increase in torque and the amount of rpms you turn it. you have to remember, when you turn on nitrous, it isn't a progressive deal. it's all at once. let's say you are using a 150 shot. when you turn it on, it's 150 additional at all rpms. so, at 2000 rpms, the amount of stress would be double versus 4000 rpms.

also remember, horsepower is a product of torque. torque is created by increasing cylinder pressure by adding more fuel and oxygen.

to combat this, manufacturers have made progressive controllers. these allow you to set the amount of nitrous to start off with and how long until you go 100%. for instance, you put in pills for a 150 shot. you set the controller for 25% initial and 2 seconds to full 100%. 150 x .25 = 37.5 hp initial and then go full 150 after 2 seconds time. there are different kinds of controllers.

cliff notes = control the amount of torque at low rpms and you'll have less stress on the motor.

Can a timing tuner do this or is there another management system that I'm missing?

**jimmybling31** · 04-22-2008, 12:17 AM

Originally Posted by mrr23

again, it's not the horsepower that does a motor in. it's the sudden increase in torque and the amount of rpms you turn it. you have to remember, when you turn on nitrous, it isn't a progressive deal. it's all at once. let's say you are using a 150 shot. when you turn it on, it's 150 additional at all rpms. so, at 2000 rpms, the amount of stress would be double versus 4000 rpms.

also remember, horsepower is a product of torque. torque is created by increasing cylinder pressure by adding more fuel and oxygen.

to combat this, manufacturers have made progressive controllers. these allow you to set the amount of nitrous to start off with and how long until you go 100%. for instance, you put in pills for a 150 shot. you set the controller for 25% initial and 2 seconds to full 100%. 150 x .25 = 37.5 hp initial and then go full 150 after 2 seconds time. there are different kinds of controllers.

cliff notes = control the amount of torque at low rpms and you'll have less stress on the motor.

I get it. that makes alot more sense. so if I set it up with a window switch at 4000rpms (good for when it goes after shifts at wot)-6200 (rev limiter) then it would be safer than running from low rpms. hmm. I know I am not getting all the technical parts of it but I get what you just said about the stress and all. I kinda suspected it but wasn't sure, so what is the bottom end of an lt1 good for then if you only spray over 4000?

**greenTA** · 04-23-2008, 04:06 PM

so this may be a stupid question but something i was just thinking about....but aren't you only supposed to use nitrous under WOT applications? And doing it without wot can cause detonation....well what happens in an M6 and you lift your foot off the gas to shift? or do you only spray through one gear...

**N20LT4** · 04-23-2008, 04:40 PM

Originally Posted by greenTA

so this may be a stupid question but something i was just thinking about....but aren't you only supposed to use nitrous under WOT applications? And doing it without wot can cause detonation....well what happens in an M6 and you lift your foot off the gas to shift? or do you only spray through one gear...

On a WOT system, nitrous is activated only when your peddle to the metal, so to speak. When you lift in an M6 application, or even an A4 for that matter, nitrous is no longer flowing until your foot reaches the floor again. You can, however, flow nitrous into your engine at part throttle with a push-button system.

**mrr23** · 04-23-2008, 06:12 PM

Originally Posted by RealLiveMD

Can a timing tuner do this or is there another management system that I'm missing?

a timing tuner only retards timing. what i'm talking about controls the solenoids themselves. here's one i used to have

http://holley.com/15835BNOS.asp

**mrr23** · 04-23-2008, 06:14 PM

Originally Posted by greenTA

so this may be a stupid question but something i was just thinking about....but aren't you only supposed to use nitrous under WOT applications? And doing it without wot can cause detonation....well what happens in an M6 and you lift your foot off the gas to shift? or do you only spray through one gear...

with all nitrous systems these days, they utilize a WOT throttle switch of some design.

back in the older days, the systems came with a handheld button and no WOT switch. you can use both at the same time, like ls2tuner does.

**N20LT4** · 04-23-2008, 07:11 PM

I use NOS's Progressive Programmable Controller that controls both timing and solenoids. It can also control a second stage of nitrous. Great product.

**RealLiveMD** · 04-23-2008, 07:19 PM

I guess I should have asked the following: "Would spraying a 125 shot on a car with 400RWHP produce the same amount of stress on the stock bottom end as spraying a car with roughly 325 hp with a 200 shot? It produces roughly the same hp and torque, but I'd be more afraid of the second scenario.