94 Z28 6 speed Vs 01 Z28 6 speed

[Cayenne97]

The LT4 cam is not THAT big. He didnt change intakes, heads or anything else, just the cam. The gears do help though I will give him that.

I'm guessing you don't have much knowledge on LT1's do you? You don't have to have heads to run 12's in an HOT-cammed LT1. The HOT-cam actually serves the stock 170cc heads just fine. It's not a serious cam, but even with a 218/228 .525/.525 lift a typical 6-speed hot-cammed car with just headers and a good tune will make around 330-340rwhp, which should definitely be more than enough to take a stock LS1 GTO. I mean in all honesty your car is basically a high 13-second car stock. Nothing special.

The GTO is a heavy car at around 3700-3800lbs. The camaro is around what 250lbs lighter? My car is heavier but does make more power than the LT1 with just the cam. Even if just 300rwhp which is easily doable for an M6GTO. He has 3.73 gears, I have 3.46, the tranny ratio's in the GTO are better than the Camaro as well.

All i'm going to say is your #'s on a hot-cam are way off. If that's all your buddy is putting down then he needs to come and see me!

The last BONE stock SS cars (LT1's) I saw at the track were running in the low 14s. One auto and one 6-speed.

That sure says a lot. I saw a stock A4 2004 GTO run low 14's all night long, which is...right about on par with a stock LT1 Z28 A4.

[Cayenne97]

So what is the LS1 times then? Because stock for stock LS1 is faster without a doubt. And being that the LT1 has barely more HP than the 99 Mustang GT then that car is a lot quicker than we think. It has what...20 less HP?

There has been a lot of speculation about the LT1 ram-air cars, and how effective the ram-air systems are and how much more power they make over a standard version. You truely can't measure the increase on a dynomometer. The real proof is in the track times, which were on average 2-4 tenths quicker and about 3 mph faster. I owned a '97 so I can speak from experience. The quickest time ever ran in a stock LT1 was by Car Craft in a '96 SS that wen't 13.4/106. Now if you wan't to compare that to an LS1 ofcourse we all know about MM&FF's edition going high 12's. When I had my '97 I raced an LS1 SS which was believed to be stock by the placard on the back. I got him by a car length. He was an A4 while I was a 6-speed. So yes i'll be honest that if he was an M6 he would have gotten me, but what i'm saying is it doesn't take much to get the LT1 there.

As for a '99 GT vs. LT1, typical numbers for a stock 2-valve are around 227-230rwhp, while an LT1 M6 will hit 260 & above rwhp for a Z28/Formy/TA. But like I said, you can't truly know how much power a ram-air system has given you by putting it on a dyno. Track times are the only way to test that.

[Eric1987]

I dont get it. There isnt 30 horsepower difference between the GT and LT1. How is it that much more in the dyno? Some of the stuff you're saying is really hard to believe...

[Cayenne97]

I dont get it. There isnt 30 horsepower difference between the GT and LT1. How is it that much more in the dyno? Some of the stuff you're saying is really hard to believe...

I'll simplify it for you. Read this article. 13.6/106.

http://stangbangers.com/96_CobraVsCa...rd_Article.htm

[Eric1987]

Do they have one of those tests for the LS1?

[Cayenne97]

Do they have one of those tests for the LS1?

Pretty sure they do.

[richard head]

yeah, it's the 99 version of a bunch of cars. formy's quickest of the f-bods, pulling a 13.2 to the SS's 13.7. I'm stupefied that the formy wasn't quicker than the SS for the LT1 versions.

[Cayenne97]

yeah, it's the 99 version of a bunch of cars. formy's quickest of the f-bods, pulling a 13.2 to the SS's 13.7. I'm stupefied that the formy wasn't quicker than the SS for the LT1 versions.

Remember guys that these are different times ran with different variables in mind. If you were to take the quickest times of each car over the years, the LS1 is in fact the quicker car - no doubt. I have plenty experience with both, and the '98-02 F-bodies are quicker and faster. It just gets me sometimes how some treat the LT1 as if it were a 5.0 TBI or something LOL.

[karpetcm]

a while back i think it was feb of 98 car and driver did a test of the new mustang vs Z28 LS1 and i tried ordering the video when they had that option and never got it, does anyone know where i can find the magazine just like the link above and thanks Cayenne97 that was a good link.

[karpetcm]

Id have to agree my 93Z 6speed was at 289rwhp N/A with all the bolt ons and 392rwhp with 125 shot of nitrous wet, later bumped to 150 shot. My best E.T on motor without the aluminum flywheel and a failed clutch after my 3rd pass was a 13.5 at 104 mph, weather was over 100 easy. I was suprised at the E.T and mph because at the time when both tracks were open i would run at LACR and id run 13.9-14.1 there. Mustang Gt's with bolt ons meaning headers, intake and tune would run 14.4-14.6 at LACR.

[JwMonE99]

LT1 capable of mid 13's? How the hell is that possible? Than the 99 Mustang GT is capable of 13's? So LS1's are capable of 13 flat?

Yes 99 mustangs can make 13s stock. My car bone stock before any mods was running 13.5s all day...

[Cayenne97]

a while back i think it was feb of 98 car and driver did a test of the new mustang vs Z28 LS1 and i tried ordering the video when they had that option and never got it, does anyone know where i can find the magazine just like the link above and thanks Cayenne97 that was a good link.

No problem man. And here is the article you are talking about. I actually still have this issue sitting in my archives.

http://stangbangers.com/99GT_vs_CamaroZ28_Article1.htm

[Eric1987]

They didnt do all the tests on the LS1 like they did the LT1 I was looking for that...

[big hammer]

Yes 99 mustangs can make 13s stock. My car bone stock before any mods was running 13.5s all day...

well i'll be dipped in shit... miracles do happen!

[TLS_Addict]

I'm guessing you don't have much knowledge on LT1's do you? You don't have to have heads to run 12's in an HOT-cammed LT1. The HOT-cam actually serves the stock 170cc heads just fine. It's not a serious cam, but even with a 218/228 .525/.525 lift a typical 6-speed hot-cammed car with just headers and a good tune will make around 330-340rwhp, which should definitely be more than enough to take a stock LS1 GTO. I mean in all honesty your car is basically a high 13-second car stock. Nothing special.

Is it not "a" hot cam? An comes before a word starting witha vowel....just jackin ya man.......lol But I can see you know a lot about these cars. I wont claim to know it all because I dont. So anything you can tell me is just extra knowledge for me and I appreciate it. Thats why I am here, to learn more and more about these cars.

We dissagree, I think they are mid - high 13s with a good driver. I havent seen any LT1 SS cars dyno anything really higher than the Z28 cars. Even the guys I know with them claim the extra HP to be a gimic with these cars. They are nice cars dont get me wrong, I love them to death but having driven both cars the LS1 is my GTO is stronger stock for stock than both of my friends SS cars (both 96's).

All i'm going to say is your #'s on a hot-cam are way off. If that's all your buddy is putting down then he needs to come and see me!

My friends cam is just a stock LT4 cam which he says is UNDER .480 lift. Also isnt the stock cam around .45X'ish lift? I have seen the "Hot" cams listed but his is just a regular cam. Maybe he is wrong on the lift of it (or perhaps the Grand Sport registry is wrong) but I doubt it.

That sure says a lot. I saw a stock A4 2004 GTO run low 14's all night long, which is...right about on par with a stock LT1 Z28 A4.

Check out there figures. This is what the GTO is capable of in stock form. Granted most people granny shift, spin, and are just retarded with a 6-speed....lol
http://www.ls1gto.com/forums/showthread.php?t=200157


Also, how does "ram-air" give so much extra power under 130 mph? Its funny that motorcycles with RAM AIR (Such as my suzuki) dont benefit from it unless the speeds are well over 100mph. Again though, if an LT1 Camaro runs mid 13s than the Corvette with an LT1 should hit low 13s because its lighter and has better weight distribution. But we all know that isnt the case. And the LS1 Vette's would be mid 12s without issue.

[hutch1999]

well i'll be dipped in shit... miracles do happen!

lol nice line

[karpetcm]

im printing the pages out and saving them on both links, lol.

[Cayenne97]

We dissagree, I think they are mid - high 13s with a good driver. I havent seen any LT1 SS cars dyno anything really higher than the Z28 cars. Even the guys I know with them claim the extra HP to be a gimic with these cars. They are nice cars dont get me wrong, I love them to death but having driven both cars the LS1 is my GTO is stronger stock for stock than both of my friends SS cars (both 96's)..

Darnit I wish I still had my old timeslips, but then you would probably say I had a cam and some bolt-ons to run that. j/k. Vintage road test #'s are the best I can do. I already posted a link above to the C&D 13.6/106 run in the '96 SS. Here's a few more vintage numbers of the '96-97.

# 11 on this list, 13.46/106.48 tested by Muscle Car Review Feb. of '96, I have this issue as well.

Here's the link: http://www.musclecarclub.com/musclec...s-50fast.shtml


And then you have this link with multiple road test numbers from different articles. Scroll to the right and it list the magazine that ran that time as well as the date.

GM High Tech 5/96 1996 SS 13.31/107
Hot Rod 2/96 1996 SS 13.55/104.86
Motor Trend 11/95 1996 SS 13.8/101.4
Car Craft 1/97 1997 SS 13.7/102.3

Link to the times above: http://webpages.charter.net/dragomni/musclecarstats.htm

Check out there figures. This is what the GTO is capable of in stock form. Granted most people granny shift, spin, and are just retarded with a 6-speed....lol
http://www.ls1gto.com/forums/showthread.php?t=200157.

Very impressive #'s. Honestly 100% of the stock 2004 Goats i've seen run haven't gotten within .5 tenths of that listed best of 13-flat, and I frequent the track A LOT! 13.60's and above seem to be the norm. But there is always that one freak time.

Again though, if an LT1 Camaro runs mid 13s than the Corvette with an LT1 should hit low 13s because its lighter and has better weight distribution. But we all know that isnt the case. And the LS1 Vette's would be mid 12s without issue.

You just sort of answered your own question. Vette magazine wen't 13.3 in a '92 C4 6-speed. Hopefully I can find the article on the net somewhere and post it.

[Raptor285]

I think I might be the only person on this site who does not have an F-body and still subscribes to GM High Tech Performance...if ANY of you were subscribed to it you would know that last year they were reprinting old articles for their 10 year anniversary. They reprinted one that was a '96 SS 6 speed vs a '96 Cobra 5 speed. FYI, this was from a while back when they were just "High Tech Performance." The Cobra did a best of 14.0 and the SS did a best of 13.3...yes you read that correctly, 13.3, what a good running 6 speed LS1 should run. Anyone who doesn't believe this can feel free to go look it up or pull out an old GM High Tech, I have every one of them from the last 4 or 5 years...oh and as for the trap I don't really remember but I want to say 103 ish...

Soooo, I think this will be a good race when it happens! Can't LT1 and LS1 owners just get along?


btw I think the Camaro had t-tops and leather as well...

[Cayenne97]

...oh and as for the trap I don't really remember but I want to say 103 ish...

The trap speed was actually 107mph, respectively.