Will a tune benefit me.

**Sweet Chops** · 02-26-2008, 07:31 AM

I was thinking about getting a mail order tune. I just don't know if I would benefit from one. My mods are K&N FLPK, Ported, Polished TB, GMMG exhaust. What kind of gains would I see with a MOT? Would it be worth the money or do I need mods like LS6 intake, headers and ORY to benefit from a tune?

Thank you,
Ryan

**Firebirdjones** · 02-26-2008, 07:50 AM

I tuned my 02 SS myself with HPtuner, on a bone stock car I went from 13.70's at 101 mph to 13.40's at 104 mph.

Mine is probably an extreme case on a stock vehicle.

My stock tune (on a stock car) sucked at best. Fuel trims were all over the place with one bank at times locking out and not moving.

Wouldn't know by driving it though.

Since you have other bolt ons in mind, I would wait until some of that is done before tuning if you're going to pay someone else to tune it.

**Sweet Chops** · 02-26-2008, 09:45 AM

I don't have the other bolt-ons in mind(LS6 intake, headers and ORY). I was just saying would a tune even help me unless I had the other bolt ons.
Good info Firebirdjones.

Ryan

**Firebirdjones** · 02-26-2008, 10:02 AM

Well without boltons in mind, if the car is staying stockish, then I would more than likely still go for a good tune.

There are guys around my area that swear by a local tuner, both stock and modified stuff.

I have been thinking of doing the same thing to my wifes 97 Z28 since HPtuner doesn't support it. It's a stocker but thinking of having a local tuner play with it anyway. Just because I can't leave anything alone

I want to see what his tune is worth on a stocker, and compare ET's on that car as well. I'm weird that way.

**Sweet Chops** · 02-26-2008, 10:27 AM

If you do tune you wifes Z let me know what you find out. I am also interested to see what a tune would do for a stocker.

Ryan

**Firebirdjones** · 02-26-2008, 12:21 PM

Okay. Well my 02 SS that I tuned might give you a better idea of differences for your car,,,,LS1 to LS1. My wifes car is an LT1. I have ran the car a few times playing with it, so it will be interesting to see if his tune is worth something. Everyone around here tells me it's well worth it. Guess I'll see what the dragstrip says.

I have to do some things to the car before the tune. I am going to seafoam the engine this weekend, change the oil. Plugs have about 3,000 miles on them but the wires are original, so new plug wires are going on too. Fuel filter is fairly new etc...... Check over a few other little things and then take it on over. Probably be a couple weeks, plus drag strips opening depends on weather.

**HB of CJ** · 02-26-2008, 01:13 PM

Ryan99, I'm sorry to say that I don't know exactly what you mean as to what exact mods has been done to your vehicle. If you are stock, then an expensive tuneup may be a waste of $money$. Depends on the $cost$.

However, if you have headers, good cats, good exhaust, opened up air filtration, are running very good fuel, etc., then an aftermarket rewrite/tune-up will really help and can be worth every penny with great results.

**Sweet Chops** · 02-26-2008, 08:13 PM

My mods are as follows.
K&N FLPK
Port and Polished TB
Cat Back GMMG Exhaust
Not realy thinking about any other mods.

Firebirdjones I realize your wifes Z is a LT1 but it is interesting to me to see if a tune on a good running stocker will do anything for you.

**kwade** · 02-27-2008, 12:33 AM

A tune would be a waste of money at this point,your talking about around 10 hp for what you are going to pay .Save the cash for when you add headers or a cam,that way it would be money well spent. But if your stuck on getting the tune,get it,just don't expect any huge gains.

**Firebirdjones** · 02-27-2008, 03:48 AM

Originally Posted by kwade

A tune would be a waste of money at this point,your talking about around 10 hp for what you are going to pay .Save the cash for when you add headers or a cam,that way it would be money well spent. But if your stuck on getting the tune,get it,just don't expect any huge gains.

I don't find this the case. Check out my first post here. I tuned my 02 SS camaro myself with HPtuner,,,,a bone stock car still used the paper filter at the time,,,,and picked up a solid 3 tenths and 3 mph,,,nothing but playing with the tune,,,,,,that gain is more than a measly 10 HP.

A stock car CAN benefit from a tune, some more than others for sure, but I found it more than worthwhile. There is hardly a single bolt on that will give those kinds of gains in my instance.

Not to mention there is much more to a tune than just HP,,,,there are many other things to be gained from tuning, even on a stock vehicle.

**Firebirdjones** · 02-27-2008, 03:51 AM

Originally Posted by Ryan99

My mods are as follows.
K&N FLPK
Port and Polished TB
Cat Back GMMG Exhaust
Not realy thinking about any other mods.

Firebirdjones I realize your wifes Z is a LT1 but it is interesting to me to see if a tune on a good running stocker will do anything for you.

Ryan,,,my first post here I mentioned my 02 SS which I tuned with HPtuner,,,this was indeed a bone stocker at the time and I picked up 3 tenths and 3 mph with that car,,,,Just playing with the tune.
I just don't know how my wifes LT1 will respond to tuning yet, we'll find out. I don't have my hopes up, and not sure it will respond as well as my 02 camaro, every car is a little different.

I can tell you though on my wifes LT1, I have ran the car stock, and ran the car with a handheld Hypertech programmer installed,,,,and the car ran the same, no ET or MPH improvement at all with it. But I can program the fans and such so it has it's uses. I will install the stock tune back in right before I go for a custom tune.

**Sweet Chops** · 02-27-2008, 06:52 AM

I agree with firebird, not just because that is what i wanted to hear but he has solid facts that a tune helps. I dont have a labtop so I was thinking of getting the mail order tune from Frost. But i will have to wait untill the snow goes away to get at the car.

**Firebirdjones** · 02-27-2008, 07:07 AM

Those are just my experiences though. Every change I have ever made to my car it made a trip to the strip to see if any gains were made.
First thing I did with the 02 was tune on it with HPtuner,,,,every bolt on I did after that has not given me the gain that a tune alone did.......some bolt ons did absolutely nothing at all,,,lol.

Everyone may have a different story. I may have even talked to Frost about it before. I would give him a shout and see what he has to say about the cars he has tuned. I'm sure he can help you out.

**Frost** · 02-27-2008, 12:43 PM

It's hard to pin down what it's worth on a [relatively] stock car, though there is always something to gain just based on the fact that they are RICH at WOT from the factory, and any +LTFTs will further exaggerate it. They are also undersparked in many areas, the 01-02s less than the 98-00s, but still some, particularly in the middle. A mail order tune will also eliminate skip-shift from an M6 as well as a few other things.

**Sweet Chops** · 02-27-2008, 07:49 PM

I was hoping you would chime in frost. I have a ? about when I should send you my computer. I ported and polished my TB this winter and have not drove the car with this mod yet. Will I need to get some miles on the car with this mod done before I send the computer to you?

**Frost** · 02-27-2008, 08:17 PM

No you are fine with it. You can send the PCM whenever works best for you Ryan; I'll be around.

**kwade** · 02-28-2008, 12:35 AM

Originally Posted by Firebirdjones

I don't find this the case. Check out my first post here. I tuned my 02 SS camaro myself with HPtuner,,,,a bone stock car still used the paper filter at the time,,,,and picked up a solid 3 tenths and 3 mph,,,nothing but playing with the tune,,,,,,that gain is more than a measly 10 HP.

A stock car CAN benefit from a tune, some more than others for sure, but I found it more than worthwhile. There is hardly a single bolt on that will give those kinds of gains in my instance.

Not to mention there is much more to a tune than just HP,,,,there are many other things to be gained from tuning, even on a stock vehicle.

Think what you want to,but you didn't gain much from a tune off a handheld.You get alittle more from a real tune(ls1 edit,hp tuners,etc..),but for what you get,it isn't cost effective in my book.That's all up to you thou,your money.......

**Firebirdjones** · 02-28-2008, 03:50 AM

Originally Posted by kwade

Think what you want to,but you didn't gain much from a tune off a handheld.You get alittle more from a real tune(ls1 edit,hp tuners,etc..),but for what you get,it isn't cost effective in my book.That's all up to you thou,your money.......

I think you lost me,,,,,I didn't use a handheld on the 02 SS,,,,I in fact used HPtuner,,,,which is tuning software using a laptop,,,,,,I mentioned that in my post that you quoted,,,not sure how you missed that

I am not thinking anything. What I did was cold hard fact,,,,,I ran the car stock,,,tuned the car with HPtuner,,,,,and ran the car again,,,,and those are the gains I posted. Solid gains in anyones book,,,period.

Cost effective??? Probably more so than you think. There is so much more to be gained from a tune, not to mention all the diagnostic abilities I now have, checking and clearing codes, scanning and logging,,,,it's endless.
Very much worth the money. Gaining 3 tenths and 3 MPH in the process????? There isn't another single bolt on that can give me all these things listed in one shot. And most of them won't give you that kind of ET or MPH gain either. Hell I've spent $500 on other bolt ons that only gave me a tenth improvement,,,and other bolt ons costing $300 that didn't do a damn thing for the car, you make the call, but in my case buying and tuning with HPtuner sounds pretty logical to me,,,,,,

**Sweet Chops** · 02-28-2008, 07:32 AM

I wish I knew someone that has experience with HP tuner. I would buy one and have them teach me. I think that would be a great skill to learn.

Originally Posted by Frost

No you are fine with it. You can send the PCM whenever works best for you Ryan; I'll be around.

I will get a hold of you in the up coming weeks. How many days is that average that the PCM will be out of my hands. Travel time and the amount of time you put into it. I was guessing about a week.

**Firebirdjones** · 02-28-2008, 05:39 PM

Well Ryan,,,I still wish the same thing. I hate computers, technoligy peaked for me around 1976

But I figure if I'm going to own one of these cars then I need the tools to work on it,,,,so HPtuner is the first thing I bought, not knowing the first damn thing about it.

I'm green when it comes to computers, but I dove in and started tinkering. The nice thing is,,,once you save your stock tune,,,if you really screw something up you can always fall back on the stock tune and flash it into the car,,,,and just start over.

If you have a basic idea of how an engine works and have tuned carbed cars, mechanical distributors, etc......then this won't be too much different. The LS1 responds in much the same way,,,you just have to figure out which tables affect what function and how they affect each other. It can be tricky at times. I'll admit I don't have it all figured out, I still don't know how to "real time tune" and I haven't tried my wide band with it yet.
The things you can do are endless. Logging and scanning. If you have a code??? Take the car for a drive and start scanning, you can narrow the problem down in a few minutes,,,no more guessing which part to buy.

HPtuner has a great website, lots of technical advice. I still ask a ton of questions and probably drive some people nuts. But how else do you learn right???

Having Frost tune is a good idea. It would still be a good idea down the road to get yourself some tuning software anyway. Just my thoughts on it. Hope that helps.