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Start up Issue

This is a discussion on Start up Issue within the Computer & Tuning forums, part of the LSx Technical Help Section category; I got a 98 with an a4. On start up, especially cold, I have to give it a little gas ...

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    Simpsons Did it!! 98formy's Avatar
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    Start up Issue

    I got a 98 with an a4. On start up, especially cold, I have to give it a little gas and hold it open just a bit for like 10-20 secs to get it started and keep it idling on its own. I had a small 224 cam in it before upgrading to ported heads, fast 90/90 and a tsp torquer cam. With the old cam I had the same issues, but at least when the motor was warm it would start by itself. After the upgrades, the starting issue got worse. Two different tuners are scratching their heads at this because it just does not make sense. They have now taken fuel out of startup and added air, that helps like it did before, but its not enough. My question is, has anyone had similar probs like mine and how were they resolved, if they were. Thanks guys.

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    TunedbyFrost.com Tuner Frost's Avatar
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    I have tuned that cam 3 times.... 2 of them were a royal PITA. Nothing specific to add, but if they are tuning via altering your known-good injector flow rate table rather than tuning the VE and then the MAF (as many pro tuners do... its a half-way shortcut), it ALWAYS exasberates (sp?) this issue. Makes hot restarts after a stall out difficult too.

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    Senior Member mrr23's Avatar
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    two places i messed with to fix initial start up issues i had.

    Engine < Fuel Control < Cranking Fuel

    FA Mult Stage 1 vs. Time set to .99 in the 86 - 284 temp columns

    this helped with my initial start up. if it didn't catch right away, it would flood. it was partially flooding on initial start up.

    Engine < Idle < Idle Airflow < Startup

    Friction Airflow Delay - basically, this is a timer to delay the IAC from closing on startup. on startup, the PCM uses Base Running Airflow and Friction Airflow Initial. the IAC starts closing and reducing the Friction Airflow Initial after initial startup. by delaying this, it gives the motor a 'high' idle for the amount of camshaft revolutions you set it for. i have mine set at 200 in the -40 to 68*F with 74 in the 104 to 140*F columns.

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    Simpsons Did it!! 98formy's Avatar
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    Thanks for the info, much appreciated. I decided to take the plunge and buy efilive. After I do my homework on how it exactly works, I will give your suggfestions a try. I also need to fix my "cruise control" issue (I think thats what its called when moving, the rpm's dont want to drop until I stop for a short time) that I have occasionally.

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    Veteran 0rion's Avatar
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    this is the very reason I didn't go to a bigger cam in my a4. It's not that it can't be tuned, just a bigger pain in the ass compared to a 228 on a 114. Has it been shops trying to tune it so far or individuals? Those idle air tables are key I think and that's where I would start at. Make sure your idle air is correct.

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    Simpsons Did it!! 98formy's Avatar
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    Its been in a couple times and he just cant figure it out for some reason. I love this cam so far for power, but the start up issue drives me crazy.

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    Simpsons Did it!! 98formy's Avatar
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    If I post the tune somewhere, could one of you guys take a quick look at it to make sure that I didnt miss anything?

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    Veteran 0rion's Avatar
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    I think most people here use hptuners......there was someone that used efilive but I forget right off the top of my head who it was.

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    Simpsons Did it!! 98formy's Avatar
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    I might sound dumb asking this, but the values in the tables should be the same roughly, right, just a different program to make changes. I am pretty new to this so far.

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    Simpsons Did it!! 98formy's Avatar
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    Hey Orion or Frost, I now have efilive and have been trying to fix my problem for a while now. Heres what I have been doing, I have tried adding start up airflow, and a lot of it, making the ve table in the 400-1200 rpm range a little richer and leaner, adding a delay in start up decay, even raising and lowering the initial injector prime numbers and nothing seems to fix it exactly. I can get it close, but it refuses to start on its own. When its cold, it always acts like its loading up. When its warm, it might start on its own, if it doesnt, it will fire for a half second and die, then try to start it again, and it starts perfectly. The kicker is that when it idles after I give it gas to start, it idles perfectly, no surging or anything. Is there somewhere I can post my current tune for you guys to take a look at and see if there is something I am missing.

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    Veteran 0rion's Avatar
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    I PM'd you my email. I'll look at it tonight for you.

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    TunedbyFrost.com Tuner Frost's Avatar
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    Get the car started and warm, log IAC counts and get the counts (at full operating temp) into the 40s with no defrost/AC, etc running before doing all of the airflow tuning. Use the TB adjustment screw and make sure when you reset the TPS that it is reading 0% You have to get the TB adjusted before doing the tuning.

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