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Rear end questions???

This is a discussion on Rear end questions??? within the Drivetrain forums, part of the LSx Technical Help Section category; Not about yours or mine-the stock camaros. I am shooting for just 500-550 crank ponies and wondering if the stock ...

  1. #1
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    now-atomic orange
    2002 SLP M6 SS

    Rear end questions???

    Not about yours or mine-the stock camaros.

    I am shooting for just 500-550 crank ponies and wondering if the stock rear end can handle it, or be made to handle it without spending a fortune. I have an 02 with the 6spd and questioning changing the gears to 4.10's or 3.73's and short of swapping in a 12 bolt if there are a few things that can be done to get this to live with the stock setup? Thx! Will run dr's at dragstrip, nt01 at road course.

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    Junior Member kibz28's Avatar
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    black
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    stock rear wont last , you'll just be wasting your money. my car makes 340rwhp on MT radials and first time at teh track snapped an axle second time broke teeth off the ring gear and carrier in half. now i'm deciding what to do with my car

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    now-atomic orange
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    Not good-but good to know. Thx!

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    Usually if youíre going to run slicks, it just a matter of time when you break a 10 bolt. 10 bolts no matter what you do to them, just canít handle the loads put on them when you run higher torque numbers and slicks. Your chooses for rear ends are a built 12 bolt, a Ford 9 inch, or a Dana 60. The 12 bolt is the weakest of the group and the Dana being the strongest. With that said its takes a lot to break a built 12 bolt, personally I have a good friend that is running a 502 with a 250hp dual stage Nos system in his 70 Chevelle SS. Estimated hp is in the 800-900 hp range and his is running a the Moser engineering 12 bolt for years now with slicks and has not had any problems.
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    Actually-I had a 12 bolt in my 67 with just hardened axles and not much else, running 9.8 @ 140mph which equated to 950+hp and 6-8 road course sessions a year to boot. The only problem I had with it was some leaking after a few years on the seals and trying to tear the spring perches off the axle. It hooked very well with 12 inch slicks at 1.4 short times. At the power level this 02 would go to, I would not expect to need any more.

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    SOM
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    9" IMO. Stronger than a 12 bolt, lighter than a D60 and just as strong.........

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    Quote Originally Posted by SOMbitch View Post
    9" IMO. Stronger than a 12 bolt, lighter than a D60 and just as strong.........
    But its a Ford part lol

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    Quote Originally Posted by vetteemt View Post
    But its a Ford part lol
    Well I know it is a f*rd design but I hate to admit it is a good part. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut every now and then.......

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    A strange 12 bolt is just as stronge as a ford 9".. There's cars out there with 1000hp with 12 bolt still lasting..

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    Quote Originally Posted by WARP211 View Post
    A strange 12 bolt is just as stronge as a ford 9".. There's cars out there with 1000hp with 12 bolt still lasting..
    Explain to me how a 8.875" ring gear is stronger than a 9" ring gear

    Why do ALMOST ALL the M6 guys who do a swap run a 9"

    You have to build up a 12 to make it even close to a stock 9" and it will cost a lot more.....

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    Senior Member Zboner's Avatar
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    the rearend its self is not the issue its the TQ arm mounting bracket that is the weak link the 9" has a much better bracket.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zboner View Post
    the rearend its self is not the issue its the TQ arm mounting bracket that is the weak link the 9" has a much better bracket.
    True the 9" has a much better bracket. More like OEM style which is a good design.

    The biggest differences are not obvious because they are inside the housing:

    The 9-inch has an internal rear-pinion support that also supports the gear end of the pinion to limit gear deflection under high torque loads. The 12bolt does not. Prolly why the 9" won't start whining after a few high rpm clutch dumps or with a high stall. Search the 12bolt guys and nearly all the high HP guys complain about gear whine..... The 9" pinion also contacts the ring gear lower on the gear for better tooth contact. And as stated before a 9" ring gear is slightly stronger than the 12bolt 8.875" gear. The fact that the center section is a breeze to swap out is only a bonus. The only downside I see is a 9" is a little heavier but not enough to consider IMO.....

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    Quote Originally Posted by SOMbitch View Post
    9" IMO. Stronger than a 12 bolt, lighter than a D60 and just as strong.........
    Quote Originally Posted by WARP211 View Post
    A strange 12 bolt is just as stronge as a ford 9".. There's cars out there with 1000hp with 12 bolt still lasting..
    Quote Originally Posted by SOMbitch View Post
    Explain to me how a 8.875" ring gear is stronger than a 9" ring gear

    Why do ALMOST ALL the M6 guys who do a swap run a 9"

    You have to build up a 12 to make it even close to a stock 9" and it will cost a lot more.....
    how are you going to point that out when the dana S60's are 9.75" ring gear

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    Quote Originally Posted by shady milkman View Post
    how are you going to point that out when the dana S60's are 9.75" ring gear

    I believe a 9" is just as strong as a Dana because though it has smaller gears it has more pinion offset giving MORE TOOTH CONTACT SURFACE and the pinion is supprted on BOTH ends unlike the Dana that just kinda hangs out there.....

    And anybody who thinks a 12bolt is anywhere near as strong as these two is too f*****g stupid for me to waste my time with.......

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    King 0f n00bz shady milkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SOMbitch View Post
    I believe a 9" is just as strong as a Dana because though it has smaller gears it has more pinion offset giving MORE TOOTH CONTACT SURFACE and the pinion is supprted on BOTH ends unlike the Dana that just kinda hangs out there.....

    And anybody who thinks a 12bolt is anywhere near as strong as these two is too f*****g stupid for me to waste my time with.......


    i do agree about 12 bolt vs a 9.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SOMbitch View Post
    I believe a 9" is just as strong as a Dana because though it has smaller gears it has more pinion offset giving MORE TOOTH CONTACT SURFACE and the pinion is supprted on BOTH ends unlike the Dana that just kinda hangs out there.....

    And anybody who thinks a 12bolt is anywhere near as strong as these two is too f*****g stupid for me to waste my time with.......
    Pick up some GMHTP and you will see plenty of guys running 12 bolts... I never said that the 12 bolt was stronger.. you need to read my post. I said they are just as strong.. All the ford 9" is just hype.!! Like I said there are plenty of guys running a 12 bolt with no issues at all with about 1000hp still lasting. 12bolt will last just as long as the ford 9".. And who the is gonna have 2 to 3 center sections to swap out?? unless you are road racing or in NHRA racing class no one is gonna have that many center sections. you need to be more realstic about what peeps do here.. Many of us just put a aftermarket rearend and drive it till the wheels fall off.!!

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    Prolly why the 9" won't start whining after a few high rpm clutch dumps or with a high stall. Search the 12bolt guys and nearly all the high HP guys complain about gear whine.....


    All aftermarket rearends are gonna wine at some point that is normal... you are talking about high end rearends that good up to plenty of HP.. The sad part is most of us will prob never exceed 500-700HP..
    Last edited by WARP211; 09-21-2009 at 09:20 AM.

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    I guess we need to agree to disagree but there is simply NO WAY a 12 bolt is "just as strong as a 12 bolt" Just ask Bob at Exotic Performance or Madman or the guys at Midwest Fab. This is thier business!!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by SOMbitch View Post
    I guess we need to agree to disagree but there is simply NO WAY a 12 bolt is "just as strong as a 12 bolt" Just ask Bob at Exotic Performance or Madman or the guys at Midwest Fab. This is thier business!!!!
    midwest fab..their fabbed 9 is orgasmic..if i have the money..that would be the rear i would get

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    Quote Originally Posted by shady milkman View Post
    midwest fab..their fabbed 9 is orgasmic..if i have the money..that would be the rear i would get
    HAHA!!!! I agree with that!!! 9" strength with weight of a 10bolt........best of both worlds!!

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