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give me knowledge about rear ends

This is a discussion on give me knowledge about rear ends within the Drivetrain forums, part of the LSx Technical Help Section category; i have no idea about rear ends at all. everyone says that stock rear ends are crap. i have a ...

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    give me knowledge about rear ends

    i have no idea about rear ends at all. everyone says that stock rear ends are crap. i have a 98 ss m6. why are they so crappy? how is a 12 bolt better? and what do different gears mean. ive hear of putting 3.73 and 4.10. is there a certain gear that is the best? it affects gas mileage but how much? how much power do you gain? isnt the idea that when you change the gears you either lose top speed but gain torque, or gain top speed and lose torque. mine is a daily driver so i would want gears that give me lots of torque. any info or explantion of rear ends and gears would be great bc im a NOOB. Thanks

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    Senior Member karpetcm's Avatar
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    Ill give it a shot not an expert so im sure someone will chime in and give a better explanation. Basically going to 4.10 gears or 3.73's will get you to your powerband quicker and youll stay there longer, its a torque multiplier. I think per every revolution of your rear tires your driveshaft spins about 4.10 times instead of the stock 3.42. The difference in gas mileage between 3.73 and 4.10's is very small maybe in the long run it will make a bigger difference going from 3.42's to 4.10's in gas mileage but even then its well worth it. Generally if you have a 6speed car most people pick 4.10 gears but ive seen several people run 3.73's. If your looking to up the power in the future it will be very hard for any type of tracting in 1st gear and depending on how much more power you add hardly any traction in second. As it is our diffs are pretty weak and going to 4.10's will increase the risk of breaking them not to mention the more teeth it has the weaker it becomes. There people who have had no issues with running 4.10's even on modded cars and to say the least i think they are blessed because in the past ive broken gears easily on stock LS1 just upgraded to 4.10's. If you do decide to go with gears make sure a professional shop installs them that are reputable and you break them in properly. Dont do too many hard accelerations from a stop or bang it all the time going from 1st to 2nd gear basically dont bash on it all the time even though its hard to hold back.
    Last edited by karpetcm; 02-20-2009 at 09:14 AM.
    1993 Z28 M6: K&N Intake, 52mm TB, TB Bypass, No Cats, Exhaust Cutout, Flowmaster Muffler, 3.90 Gears, 160 Thermo, Tune, BMR Springs, Bilstein Shocks, 3 Point SFC,s & MGW Shifter.

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    Member km346's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmatt07 View Post
    i have no idea about rear ends at all. everyone says that stock rear ends are crap. i have a 98 ss m6. why are they so crappy? how is a 12 bolt better? and what do different gears mean. ive hear of putting 3.73 and 4.10. is there a certain gear that is the best? it affects gas mileage but how much? how much power do you gain? isnt the idea that when you change the gears you either lose top speed but gain torque, or gain top speed and lose torque. mine is a daily driver so i would want gears that give me lots of torque. any info or explantion of rear ends and gears would be great bc im a NOOB. Thanks
    OK ill take a stab at this. Ten bolts get a bad wrap because they are small. plain and simple. the ring gear is only 7.5 inches, and is prone to breaking easily under heavy shock load. Also the torque arm design on our cars causes a lot of flex to the housing, which is also small and weak. A 12 Bolt or 9" are better because they are physically bigger, and stronger. a 12 bolt contains a ring gear that measures 8.875 inches, and a 9" is... well you figure it out. the housing on a 12 bolt is stronger also, which leads to much less flex. A 9" is an optimal design because the torque arm mounts right to the carrier, so there is virtually NO housing flex under load.

    As for the gears, think of riding a ten speed bicycle. rear end gears affect the final drive much like changing speeds on a bicycle. in first gear your pedaling very hard and not moving very fast. (call that 4:10's) in 4th gear you can pedal just as fast, but your moving faster (call that 3:73's) and in last gear its hard to pedal, but you can go the fastest (2:73's). there really is no BEST gear, it really depends what transmission is in your car and what kind of driving you plan on doing. Normally if people are going to upgrade most people would recommend 4:10's for a 6 speed car, and something like 3:42's (factory 6 speed gearing) or 3:73's for an auto. It will definitely affect gas mileage because when you lower your gearing, it forces the engine to spin higher (think of the bicycle). how much it is affected will depend on how much you've changed the final drive. Also you will not GAIN any power, But the car will accelerate much quicker, letting you optimize all the power your making.

    I tried to make that as simple and accurate as i could, i hope it helps.
    -KM
    Last edited by km346; 02-20-2009 at 08:59 AM.

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    Member km346's Avatar
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    HAHA Karpet, i guess we where both writing our essays at the same time.

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    Senior Member karpetcm's Avatar
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    lol ya, well your explanation is better and easy to understand so will go with that.

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    Thanks guys for the info. it really helps. just wanted to get a little understanding of it. Thanks

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    King 0f n00bz shady milkman's Avatar
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    the X.XXX is the ratio of teeth between the ring and the pinion gears. as stated before the 10 bolt is considered weak due to its ring size. For stock applications the 10 bolt is just fine..for modded setups the 10 bolt becomes a reliability due to flex on the housing causing the gear deflection (the contact patch between the gears gets changed) and cause failure. This is a real big problem for m6 over a4 due to the fact that a4's preload the driveline ..compared to the m6 that does not....(think of when you break torque it..how you feel the car "load"..or even better think of a rubber band...if you slowly pull back on the ruber band to a point the shock on the rubber band isnt as great if you where just to quickly pull the rubber band back) this is why alot of a4 higher output set-ups can survive with a 10..to a degree...
    Last edited by shady milkman; 02-20-2009 at 01:00 PM.

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    King 0f n00bz shady milkman's Avatar
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    the easiest way to tell the diff between a 10 and a 12 bolt is .well from counting the bolts on the housing ...10 for 10 bolt and 12 on 12 bolt....older 10 bolts (non 4th gen) are stronger due to their rings being larger then 7.5...8.5 is an example of a 10 bolt ring size...on to gears a lil more as said before about the bike speed is right...the lower the gearing the faster it accelerates ..so a 4.10 is actually a lower gear then 3.72...gears in general are designed to manage or convert the power(aka the rotation from the powerplant) and get it to the wheels in a usable way..since god could only imagine your tires spinning at the exact same speed as your engine...so a 4.10...4.10x the number of teeth on the ring then the pinon 's number of teeth lead to a faster revolution speed per 1 ring rotation compared to a 3.72..where the pinion spins at a slower revolution per ring rotation..that means (more revolution per ring revolution = more tire rotation per 1 ring rotation= faster acceleration) now i dont know exactly why lower gearing = less top speed..sorry

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