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Next Project - 1970 Oldsmobile W-31

This is a discussion on Next Project - 1970 Oldsmobile W-31 within the Classic Muscle forums, part of the Vehicle Specific category; Yeah, somethin' quirky goin on. Lost all my AAG subscriptions the other night when AAG disappeared....

  1. #181
    Giant Dicks Car Club Zapper2003's Avatar
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    Yeah, somethin' quirky goin on. Lost all my AAG subscriptions the other night when AAG disappeared.

  2. #182
    2004 HEAD/CAM CTS-V 9t8z28's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pajeff02 View Post
    Whatever Brandon recommended. I haven't even opened the box yet.
    It's been a while but I am pretty sure it was the Street Pro muffs.

  3. #183
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    '02 WS.6 / '07 Suburban

    Heading to Summit in the morning to pick up an MSD 6AL and a clutch for the Olds. Any recommendations on clutch brands or models? I know I asked before somewhere, have to page back through the thread to see if it was in here.

  4. #184
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    Went with the Hays Street/Strip clutch as it looked very similar to the clutch that I removed from the car. I managed to drag the transmission around from the basement to the garage but have not yet started the tear down.

  5. #185
    Giant Dicks Car Club Zapper2003's Avatar
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    If you need any help with anything Jeff, you've got my numbers. Give me a call I'll be glad to help out.

  6. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zapper2003 View Post
    If you need any help with anything Jeff, you've got my numbers. Give me a call I'll be glad to help out.

    Appreciate that. I need to eye up the trans swap too and see how much trouble that is going to be.

  7. #187
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    '02 WS.6 / '07 Suburban

    Finally started on the transmission rebuild this evening. Spending two days at Fall Carlisle is a real motivator so I decided to just tear into it shortly after arriving home this afternoon. This is a Muncie M-21 close ratio transmission and I believe it is the original for the car. Other than leaking lots of fluid, it worked fine after adjusting the shift rods shortly after we acquired the car. Before the adjustment, it had a nasty habit of locking into two gears at the same time rendering the car immobile until you crawled under it and tapped on the shift levers with a hammer.




    I began by removing the shift arms, clutch fork and throw out bearing. In order to separate the bell housing from the transmission, the side cover has to be removed to access the bolts. The shift forks are also removed and looking into the transmission for the very first time it appears that everything is in fairly good shape. There is a little rust on the slides, but since the car sat in a somewhat damp garage for 13 years and was essentially never driven, that is really no surprise. I hate to do it on aluminum parts, but the only way the bell housing bolts were coming out was to use a little persuasion with the air impact.














    After pulling the bell, I removed the pivot for the clutch fork and then pulled the speedometer driven gear from the tailstock. The reverse fork has to be pulled out of the tailstock to release from the gear and there is a small pin that must be driven out to accomplish this. After the fork is released, and the bolts removed, the tailstock slides off the transmission. The speedometer drive gear is retained by a small clip and this is depressed to slide the gear off the shaft and then the reverse gear is removed. The reverse idler gear is also pulled out at this time from the main case. Up front, the bearing cap is removed and pulled off the input shaft. The front nut is staked in place so I'll need to use my die grinder to get the nut off before continuing the teardown later this week.















  8. #188
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    Finished the teardown this evening with the exception of removing the components from the mainshaft. I'll start the cleanup this weekend and if all goes well should have a complete transmission in a few days. Tonight I started with removing the nut on the input shaft. The nut requires a special wrench that I purchased from Year One when I rebuilt the transmission in the Corvette. It is staked in place, so it has to be notched very carefully with a die grinder before it can be removed. It's also left hand thread just to keep you on your toes. After the nut has been removed, the bearing and shim can be slid off the input shaft.








    The rear cover is then removed by tapping it loose and then prying it off the dowel pin in the case. After the cover is off, the mainshaft and input shaft can be removed from the rear of the case and then separated. These will be cleaned, inspected and refurbished with new parts before reassembly. Also, the reverse countergear and its shims can be pulled from the case once the mainshaft has been extracted.











    This leaves the countershaft and gears in the case which are the only parts that have to be removed by force. The countershaft is essentially a large pin that has to be driven out from the front with a suitable punch and hammer. I soaked both ends in WD40 and warmed up the front with my propane torch simply to help it break free. Once it clears the front wall of the case, the countershaft is then easily slid out of the gears at which point the needle bearings, spacers and shims will all come tumbling out. There are quite a few needle bearings and these will all be replaced with new ones from the rebuild kit. Although seemingly impossible when you look at it, a little grease will hold the new pins in place on the shaft during reassembly.














    With the exception of the case, this is what the transmission is comprised of. All pretty simple when compared to what goes into an automatic transmission.



  9. #189
    Giant Dicks Car Club Zapper2003's Avatar
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    Pops is considering a 5 speed Tremec for the 68. Not sure yet if the muncie is going to find a new home when thats done or not.

  10. #190
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    I have two friends that would definitely be interested in it if they want to sell it. I thought about a 5 speed as it would be nice to have "overdrive" for the highway, but the desire to keep it original prevailed.

  11. #191
    Senior Member cpop98ws6's Avatar
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    My dad thought about putting a 5 speed in his 73 z28, I talked him out of it. Nothing like the sound of a muncie m22 coming down the road.

  12. #192
    Giant Dicks Car Club Zapper2003's Avatar
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    His reasoning behind the 5spd is for cruising. He wants this car to be able to go the distance and still be comfortable at highway speeds. The 4.10's are killer out of the hole, but close to 3k rpms at 55 becomes a little unbearable. The 5spd should retain the awesomeness of the 4.10's, yet the drivability of a lot lower gear.

  13. #193
    Senior Member cpop98ws6's Avatar
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    You are right, my dad also has 4.10s in his. The car only get a few hundred miles on it a year and never sees the highway so it would have been pointless to give up the stone crusher. He has the grand national and his 70 olds 442 w-30 for going on the highway.

  14. #194
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    Corvette also has a close ratio Muncie with 3.55's out back and it's not too bad. This car will be running 3.42's.

  15. #195
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    '02 WS.6 / '07 Suburban

    Spent the evening in the driveway with a couple of cans of oven cleaner, the hose hooked up to the hot water spigot and a scrub brush in hand. Was able to get the first layer of grime scraped off the transmission parts.






  16. #196
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    Worked on the transmission yesterday morning and a bit more this evening and made some good progress. I had to finish the tear down and disassembled the mainshaft which carries 1st, 2nd and 3rd gear (from left to right in the first pic), together with the synchros, clutches and slides. The input shaft carries 4th gear which rides adjacent to 3rd gear. The shift fork moves the slide to the right over the clutch assembly and engages 4th which is 1:1, so it simply locks the input and mainshaft together. The rear bearing is retained by a snap ring and a special pair of pliers are utilized to expand the ring while the bearing is tapped out of the cover plate.








    A snap ring on the front of the mainshaft is removed before the 3rd gear is then pulled off together with the synchros, clutch and slide. The 2nd gear and clutch are pressed onto the mainshaft and are also retained by a press fit spacer. This easily presses off and once it was been removed the mainshaft, clutches and all the gears went into the parts washer before reassembly was commenced. The rebuild kit includes new synchros, retainer springs, clutch plates, and I also purchased new slides. In the second pic, the clutch is setting on top of the 3rd gear and I am holding a clutch plate. There are three clutch plates around the perimeter of each clutch.





    I started reassembly by pressing 2nd gear, the clutch and slide back onto the mainshaft with the spacer on top. Once this is pressed, everything else simply slides onto the shaft and is retained at the front by a snap ring. The clutches are splined to the mainshaft and the slides moving back and forth between the gears and clutches are really what makes the transmission work.








    All the aluminum has now been through the parts washer and blast cabinet. The glass beads have really cleaned things up nice. First pic is after being washed first with oven cleaner and then a trip into the parts washer. Last pic is after bead blasting.






  17. #197
    None Shall Pass Knight's Avatar
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    As usual Jeff, things look exceptional! Which of your meals will you be eating off of this car? Can't wait to see this thing when it's all done!

  18. #198
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    Thanks! No one had better get within 10 feet of the car with food in hand when it is done.

  19. #199
    None Shall Pass Knight's Avatar
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    Won't matter....they'll be too busy drooling....you may wan't to invest in a paper towel holder to take with you

  20. #200
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    '02 WS.6 / '07 Suburban

    Made good progress this evening after a late start getting to the garage. I began by cleaning up the countergear and installing it in the case. The gear rides on a shaft that is pressed through from the back side. There are four (4) sets of needle bearings with twenty-eight (28) bearings in each set that have to be carefully installed. Two (2) sets support the front and two (2) sets support the rear with a spacer inserted between them. The inside of the countergear is coated with grease to hold the needle bearings as they are inserted. Once a set is in place, a divider ring is installed and used to push the first set deeper into the countergear to make room for the next set. After all the needle bearings are in place, there are two (2) tanged thrust washers that must be inserted on each end before the shaft is inserted. Again, grease is utilized to hold the washers in place.











    After the countergear is installed, and the shaft pressed through until it is flush with the front of the case, the end play is checked with a dial indicator. The maximum allowable endplay is .025" and mine was good at right around .012".





    I then cleaned up the input shaft which rides on the snout of the mainshaft. There are larger needle bearings that are installed with a cage that go into the open end of the input shaft. Again, grease is used to retain the needles in the cage while it is carefully set into place. The final synchro is then installed onto the input shaft and then it is slid onto the nose of the mainshaft as an assembly. The 3-4 slide is then moved forward to engage 4th gear so as to hold the input shaft securely in place when it is finally reinstalled in the case -- which should be tomorrow evening if all goes well. I also cleaned up the reverse idler gear and hardware so that it is all ready for install.





    Last edited by pajeff02; 10-10-2011 at 07:55 PM.

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