New Mobil 1 Extended VS German Castrol

[Z ROADSTER]

Not sure if this is the right forum but , what does the resident oil guru say about the comparison between the long standing champion GC when compared to the new Mobil One Extended synthetic motor oil ? Do all the experts still agree that GC is still the best ?

[Mr. Luos]

what does the resident oil guru say

Pennzoil Platinum 10w-30.

[vettenuts]

I haven't been able to buy the German Castrol, I have since gone back to Amsoil 5W-30 since my supply of Castrol is gone.

[INMY01TA]

There is no all around "best" motor oil. Of those two, for an LS1 I'd go with the German Castrol if you can find it.

[VTR99]

Mobil One Extended is for people who want more miles between oil changes. This is not a good idea for high performance engines in my opinion. Frequent oil changes are the difference between engines that seem to last forever, and ones that don't regardless of what oil you use. Mobil 1 synthetic is used by more factory race teams and high performance car manufacturers than any other oil. I have seen Mobil's documentation on high temperature and extreme condition performance, and am convinced you can't buy better protection for your engine. GM says Mobil 1 is best.

http://www.kappamotorsport.com/forum...read.php?p=767

http://home.businesswire.com/portal/...Lang=en&vnsId=

[Sarge]

Well I just sat here and typed out almost 2 pages of a response to this and something “flashed” and I ended up back at the main LS1.COM page and it was all gone. But after kicking my dog and getting another cup of coffee I find I cannot walk away from this and have a decent day here in South Texas without thinking about anybody actually believing all this marketing bullshit. So with a really good Starbucks Columbian espresso sitting here in the study and a fresh pack of Marlboro’s I’ll try again………………I must ad Sirius Satt Radio on the PC kicks ass! There Sirius some free marketing from me to you J

DISCLAIMER: I am not attacking the fella who posted above! I applaud him for a well written post and for providing those links. Most just jump on a internet forum and say silly shit like “ Mobil1 is the best!” and jump off….so I applaud this guy for a mature post and providing at least something to back up his claims. Good job.

The links you provided are pure marketing. I know it is easy to read them once and conclude Mobil1 must be the greatest shit on the planet. But let’s ask ourselves some basic questions and discuss those marketing statements firstly…

I think we need to develop, for discussion purposes, a differentiator between “marketing statements” and “scientific facts”…..I’ll use your posted links
Marketing Hype: “We get 3-5% more horsepower with Mobil1”…Facts: Compared to what? Aunt Jemimah Pancake Syrup? Wolfs Head Conventional 30 weight? What? Care to share any comparison with say RedLine or Royal Purple because they all make the exact same claims against Mobil1. So who is full of shit? Well they all are J Simply put it is damn near impossible to make that claim when comparing top tier GroupIII or GroupIV based oils in damn near any engine as they all share almost identical characteristics’ that would impact any measurable RWHP changes. So to make that claim and back it up you must compare your top tier synthetic with conventional oil. These “dyno test” will never stand up to informed scrutiny as no dyno will ever record the same numbers with the same number and the same lubrication when given 3-4 straight runs. The variables are too great to even compare…and gain any definitive delta data. Now when you utilize a dyno to compare amongst various oil manufacturers it gets even worse as the variables are never greater/less than the variables produced by the exact same test on the exact same dyno with the exact same oil…..it always comes out +/- 2-3% and the “claims of more horsepower” melt away when put under the spotlight of that dyno variable. Just a fact. That is why the Tornado is a marketing success and will never be able to back up any “gains” claims with a dyno. So statements like the Mobil1 paid guy makes has as much credibility as the Tornado guy.

Marketing Hype: GM recommends Mobil1.
Fact: Mobil1 pays GM millions of dollars a year. Well shit man! Think about that fact for a second. If I paid you millions of dollars a year you would be telling the world I am the greatest thing since the LSX engine wouldn’t you? It is called paid endorsement. Doesn’t have anything to do with what GM engineers think is the best oil. It has everything to do with Mobil1 buying that endorsement from GM. Ask yourself….seriously….if GM engineers could have any off the shelf oil out there in their engines…what would it be? Well we won’t know because GM sold their endorsement to the highest bidder…..and that was Mobil1. Sure Mobil1 satisfies the GM engineer’s basic specs and paid big bucks…so GM endorses Mobil1. Sure as hell doesn’t make Mobil1 the best by any means and GM never says Mobil1 must be used does it? Hell no…..GM says the oil must API SM approved when it comes right down to the nuts and bolts of the legal world as it relates to warranty. Think about that for just a second. If I am to believe the Mobil1 marketing material a rational thinking person would believe GM doesn’t just recommend but requires Mobil1 wouldn’t I? But that isn’t the case is it! Hell Ferrari endorses Quaker State because they get more horsepower…….gee Wally….Ferrari is a high end automobile….high tech…..no disputing that is there? The how is it possible to believe Mobnil1/GM “claims” and Ferrari “claims”……easy…you “peel the onion” of marketing bullshit and recognize it for what it is. Let’s keep going…..

Marketing Bullshit: Let’s plaster Mobil1 stickers all over NASCAR/LeMans/F1 cars and folks will think they can use the same oil in their street cars with A/C/Emissions Bullshit etc. and their cars will perform better. Just like the race cars they see.
Fact: Wow….where do I start….sorta like seeing some of today’s dog food commercials….If I give my dog this food he will drag me all over hell and back by his leash cause he is now “ Super Dog”….and people go out and buy that particular brand of dog food so they can have super dog. Lets put on our real world pants and think about this for a second. Guys and Gals….the oil that goes in those cars are not the same oil you can buy at WalMart or AutoZone. Same bottle and shit….. But not the same oil. We can get into a “link posting war” over this if you want to… but be real….secondly….why do I give a rats ass what works for a F1/LeMans 11,000 RPM revving short stroke motor? My 408 Stroker motor or my LS1/LS2 motor doesn’t even come close to having the same requirements from its lube as those motors require. But folks read that shit and just blow right by the fact those highly modified super race motors and the motors in the car sitting in your garage with emissions crap and A/C are not even from the same world and have totally different set of requirements…..but yet those same folks some how make the connection that I’ll go out and buy some of that $6 per quart shit ( that isn’t even the same oil) and slap that shit in my car and my motor will somehow appreciate me…..I love my car. What in the hell kind of rational is that? But yet I see folks posting those links all the time as “proof” Mobil1 are the “best” oil for our LS1 based engines in our street cars. Fucking absolutely mind boggling incredible.

Shit…..I’m out of my espresso…..I need a new espresso machine…..sum bitch is spewing all over everywhere….I digress…..

To summarize where I’m at here…..GM does not require you use Mobil1…it has been paid a shitload of money to recommend it. See the difference between require and recommend? And money has changed hands for that endorsement…so let’s put that into the proper perspective once and for all. Horsepower gains claims are made by everybody so that in itself provides us with a clue there is no fucking way for any of them to back it up. I mean they all can’t make the same claim if there was a definitive way to discredit or substantiate any or all of these bullshit claims. Lastly…..marketing peckerheads have been dragging out good looking women with tig ol bitties for years to sell you after shave….and you go buy it thinking your wife is going to turn into Rachel Welch and fuck your brains out if you buy that $10 bottle of Polo Black versus that $3 bottle of Aqua Velva……same shit with Mobil1….Hey look guys….we have a sticker on the side of this $2 million dollar LeMans car…so buy our oil and you can have the same experience!!! Come on guys…….

I’m gonna stop there. I have posted so much data on oil some folks I have it running through my veins…..so I’ll allow anybody to do some searching around here for many post with data gleaned from lab work I have had done…..visit bobistheoilguy.com and read all the data…..start putting together the facts of Used Oil Analysis….Virgin Oil Analysis….and understanding the real world requirements’ of your Chevy short block versus race car engines…..and you’ll start seeing the difference between marketing statements and facts pretty damn quick……..

Now if this doesn’t post right I’m gonna hunt down the LS1.COM ISP owner and kill him. Dead as hell. Slowly and with much pain. Or at least break his legs.

[Speedy_Gonzales]

good write up and u really crack me up lol


Attachment 14184 ftw !

[Z ROADSTER]

Way to go Sarge. So , which oil should we go with ? Anything with a SM on the bottle or just GC ?
Oh , and a GREAT write up man.Thanks for taking the time.

[Mr. Luos]

Pennzoil Platinum 10w-30.

[Sarge]

Way to go Sarge. So , which oil should we go with ? Anything with a SM on the bottle or just GC ?
Oh , and a GREAT write up man.Thanks for taking the time.

Your welcome.
Pennzoil Platinum 10-30. No Fram oil filters.

[Heartbreak1]

Your welcome.
Pennzoil Platinum 10-30. No Fram oil filters.

So anything but fram oil filters eh? Good thing I read this because I need to change the oil soon.

[VTR99]

The bottom line here as Sarge says is scientific fact, and whether Mobil 1 really offers superior protection to oil. There is clear scientific evidence that Mobil 1, and other synthetics offer lubrication that is superior to oil for a number of reasons. The first being that they are far more resistant to heat breakdown, and do not degrade as easily under high temperature and pressure. Synthetics offer superior protection at startup, and in cold weather. Synthetics keep contaminants in suspension longer that conventional oil, and allow the filter to do it's job better. Synthetics do not contain contaminants that ALL conventional oils have when you pour them into your engine. Anyone with long term turbocharger experience will tell you that conventional oils actually burn leaving abrasive deposits in turbo bearings ( I know this from first hand experience). While I admit that conventional oils are adequate for most users, they are simply not in the same league as synthetics. The old saying "You get what you pay for" applies to oil, just as it does with most other things.

I will even go as far as saying that anyone who claims synthetics are not clearly better is either uneducated about the facts, or trying to avoid the extra expense with simple minded thinking.

Since about 75% of all the wear on your engine happens in the first five minutes after you start it up, synthetics offer an advantage in significantly reducing engine wear.

http://www.calsci.com/motorcycleinfo/Oils1.html

http://www.performanceoiltechnology....bochargers.htm

http://www.carbibles.com/engineoil_bible.html

http://www.practicingoilanalysis.com...p?articleid=59

[Mr. Luos]

Not saying Mobil 1 is a bad oil.
Just isn't worth the price tag.

Pennzoil Platinum 10w-30 and Delco filters for all three cars here.

[Speedy_Gonzales]

Not saying Mobil 1 is a bad oil.
Just isn't worth the price tag.

Pennzoil Platinum 10w-30 and Delco filters for all three cars here.

how much is PP a quart ?

[lonewolf37]

Look for specials and rebates at Kragens. Last year they had a deal that brought the price down to $.99 a quart. Never seen that price since. I bought 60 quarts.

[VTR99]

And I'm not saying conventional oils are bad, but they don't offer as much protection as Mobil 1. This isn't hype, it's documented fact. As I said in my first post on the subject the most important thing is changing your oil, regardless of what you use. Mobil used to claim that you could go 25,000 miles between oil changes with Mobil 1. They no longer say this, because no matter how good your oil resists breakdown, combustion leaves abrasive deposits that contaminate oil. It is pretty well accepted that if you go more than 3,000 miles between oil changes you are much safer with a synthetic. For me the extra price is well worth the peace of mind at times like this summer when temps stayed over 100 degrees for weeks at a time, or in winter when cold starts can be at 20 below or colder. I suggest anyone skeptical of Mobil 1 try the frying pan test against their favorite conventional, or put one bottle of each in the freezer and see which pours better. Simply no contest....

[Mr. Luos]

Mobil 1 against a conventional??
Make it fair at least.

Either way, if you change your oil every 3,000 miles, use whatever you want.

I have seen all kinds of specials on PP, but I normally pay $4 a quart for it.
If Mobil 1 was that price, it would be worth it.
But I would still rather trust UOA's and go with Pennzoil Platinum.

[JonB]

The bottom line here as Sarge says is scientific fact, and whether Mobil 1 really offers superior protection to oil. There is clear scientific evidence that Mobil 1, and other synthetics offer lubrication that is superior to oil for a number of reasons. The first being that they are far more resistant to heat breakdown, and do not degrade as easily under high temperature and pressure. Synthetics offer superior protection at startup, and in cold weather. Synthetics keep contaminants in suspension longer that conventional oil, and allow the filter to do it's job better. Synthetics do not contain contaminants that ALL conventional oils have when you pour them into your engine. Anyone with long term turbocharger experience will tell you that conventional oils actually burn leaving abrasive deposits in turbo bearings ( I know this from first hand experience). While I admit that conventional oils are adequate for most users, they are simply not in the same league as synthetics. The old saying "You get what you pay for" applies to oil, just as it does with most other things.

I will even go as far as saying that anyone who claims synthetics are not clearly better is either uneducated about the facts, or trying to avoid the extra expense with simple minded thinking.



http://www.calsci.com/motorcycleinfo/Oils1.html

http://www.performanceoiltechnology....bochargers.htm

http://www.carbibles.com/engineoil_bible.html

http://www.practicingoilanalysis.com...p?articleid=59

And I'm not saying conventional oils are bad, but they don't offer as much protection as Mobil 1. This isn't hype, it's documented fact. As I said in my first post on the subject the most important thing is changing your oil, regardless of what you use. Mobil used to claim that you could go 25,000 miles between oil changes with Mobil 1. They no longer say this, because no matter how good your oil resists breakdown, combustion leaves abrasive deposits that contaminate oil. It is pretty well accepted that if you go more than 3,000 miles between oil changes you are much safer with a synthetic. For me the extra price is well worth the peace of mind at times like this summer when temps stayed over 100 degrees for weeks at a time, or in winter when cold starts can be at 20 below or colder. I suggest anyone skeptical of Mobil 1 try the frying pan test against their favorite conventional, or put one bottle of each in the freezer and see which pours better. Simply no contest....

I'm not sure you really understood what Sarge was saying. He never said conventional was better than syntetic and he did not recomend it nor have I ever heard him recomend it. As to your frying pan and freezer testing I would really recomend that you try getting and oil analysis test done. I would really like you to do an analysis on your M1 then try geraman castrol or pennzoil platinum then come back and tell us which one you recomend. Is M1 going to destroy your engine NO but there are better options out there for the price.

[Eddie 70]

I use Mobil 1 and Wix oil filters on all of my vehicles. I change the oil every 5000 miles. I have always had good luck with all of my vehicles. With my experience, I have no reason to change what has been working for me. I am sure there are other cheaper options.

[sreve]

i agree with you sarge
me i like to wait for some parts store to run a half price sale on synthetic (anybodys) and buy at least $80 worth.
when that fails its off to NAPA for their store brand synthetic (valvoline) and a NAPA gold filter (WIX)