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How much HP with the MS4 cam?

This is a discussion on How much HP with the MS4 cam? within the Internal Engine forums, part of the LSx Technical Help Section category; You should be able to attain your goal with a good set of heads, FAST intake/TB, UD pulley, EWP and ...

  1. #21
    Likes twisty roads bene's Avatar
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    You should be able to attain your goal with a good set of heads, FAST intake/TB, UD pulley, EWP and a great tune. If just dyno numbers your chasing, keep the ten bolt althought I doubt it'll last.

  2. #22
    Senior Member redbird555's Avatar
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    2002 Camaro Z/28 Pewter

    OP what afr heads are speaking of that flow 325 cfm? The 205,210,215, and 230 all flow under 320 cfm. The 245 does flow over 325cfm but that is a lot of airflow for a 346 inch motor your best bet would be the 205 or 210 which max out around 305cfm anything over that and you will probably lose power down low. I'd give Tony Mamo a call, he's the lead engineer at afr and builds some badass motors for many corvette clients, he even just finished building his own storker motor that made 750 on the dyno. He's also a really good guy and always has time for his customers tell him what your goals are and he'll help you out with a head and even cam choice. 550hp is attainable at the crank with the right parts and he's the guy who would be able to tell you what the best way is to go about that route.

  3. #23
    Junior Member Pontiaco's Avatar
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    you got his #?

  4. #24
    Senior Member redbird555's Avatar
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    2002 Camaro Z/28 Pewter

    you can pm him over on ls1tech as I think he is a member here or you can go right to afr's website and call and just ask for tony mamo

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pontiaco View Post
    I have building engines for ever and I'm aware of all those things, I just like the nasty idle of the ms4 and if you read my first post I'm getting the best heads I can and intake, my first uestion was if the ms4 can hit the 550 hp mark?
    550 flywheel horsepower? Sure I'm putting down 444.99 rwhp/394.56 #s torque thru a 4L60E tranny, Yank PT4000 Converter and a 12 bolt Moser. If you factor in the loss of an Auto tranny compared to a manual one or just get froggy and add the underdrive pullys or the electric water pump I'm sure I could squeeze 5.1 more rwhp out of her. I forget what the percentage difference is between a T56 and a 4L60E but was thinking 15%?
    TSP 347 SB, TSP Stage 2.5 PRC LS6, TSP MS4, Performabuilt Stage 2 4L60E, Yank PT4000, 4.11s, Fast 90/90, FTRA Cold air intake+all the free mods, Dynatech Supermaxx Exaust System, DMH Cutouts, Hooker Catback/FTRA Tips. Tuned by RPM/Garner NC. 11.28@119

  6. #26
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    I want to say you lose about 20% with a 4L60E and around 15% with a T56. You're also losing around 3% more with that 12 bolt.

  7. #27
    Spaz is My Mentor SMWS6TA's Avatar
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    not to mention gear ration in the rear too.

  8. #28
    Bullet Boy Same ol Situation's Avatar
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    I just recently had the MS3 cam put in my car along with 4.10s. It feels like a completely different car. My car put down 405 to the rear along with the help of an UD pully. The MS4 is probably around the 410-415 range but i cant stress how important it is to also do a gear swap when going cam only with bigger cams such as the magic sticks.

  9. #29
    Member RedSuperSport's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Same ol Situation View Post
    I just recently had the MS3 cam put in my car along with 4.10s. It feels like a completely different car. My car put down 405 to the rear along with the help of an UD pully. The MS4 is probably around the 410-415 range but i cant stress how important it is to also do a gear swap when going cam only with bigger cams such as the magic sticks.
    did you do it yourself orhave a shop do it i live right outside cincy and looking for a good shop

  10. #30
    Junior Member Pontiaco's Avatar
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    sos, did you change the heads also, or just the cam?

  11. #31
    Senior Member redbird555's Avatar
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    ^^with 405 he most likely just had the cam. the ms3 is usually just over 400 with a good tune. OP did you ever speak with tony at afr

  12. #32
    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    You can do 500+ rwhp with the LS1 without going the forced induction route.

    It's been done many times. It takes a very good set of heads, a custom ground camshaft, with a FAST intake.

    As a matter of fact, there was a fellow not too long ago that did it with his 03 Z06 vette using the stock bottom end, a set of aftermarket 11 degree heads, custom cam and fast intake, pushing it through a T56 and a HP robbing IRS no less

    He reported the car very streetable and even had idle and driving clips, chugging the engine way down to 1,000 rpms on the street without complaints. Ran good too.

    To pull this off you better have a deep pocket book. The heads aren't cheap, but this HP level is very doable.

    It's much easier (and cheaper) to reach that HP goal by just throwing on a power adder of your choice (procharger, turbo, maggie) and call it done.

    Or for a much tamer naturally aspirated combo you could build a 402-408 stroker and very easily make 500+ rwhp with a much smaller cam and a cheaper set of heads.

    Just pick your approach

    In the end though, all this HP chasing doesn't mean much unless it's a well thought out combo with a drivetrain and suspension to match. I personally wouldn't worry about the numbers too much and build a reliable combo that's proven to work, and let the numbers fall where ever they may.
    SMWS6TA likes this.

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