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Cam and stall...

This is a discussion on Cam and stall... within the Internal Engine forums, part of the LSx Technical Help Section category; Originally Posted by Coydawg6 nothing its bone stock I would suggest getting a lid, full exhaust, a torque converter and ...

  1. #21
    Member qwk93ta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coydawg6 View Post
    nothing its bone stock

    I would suggest getting a lid, full exhaust, a torque converter and do the free mods before you think about getting a cam. I'd also get SFCs and maybe a torque arm and LCAs, they will help you hook at the track.

  2. #22
    LSX whore allbaugh_04's Avatar
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    I think these mods are a bit more than you are thinking.

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    Senior Member rajiv1998's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coydawg6 View Post
    nothing its bone stock
    LOL you have a LONG way to go before you cam it.
    "Life is to short to drive a slow car"

    Gone but not forgoten: 1998 Pontiac Trans Am M6 "The Black Bandit"
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    If you really want to make a differnece its probably best to start saving. I don't think bolt ons are going to give you what you want. They are important to have, basically as a foundation for the later mods, but alone they won't do much. I personally gained less than 25rwhp/tq with full bolt ons, and I really couldn't feel much of a difference.

    This is where the savings part comes in...once you have the bolt ons you are ready for a cam which can give a decent power boost, and paired with a set of heads you can be roughly in the range of 400-450rwhp as you were asking about. Weather you are at the low or high end of that range depends on how wild your cam is, the quality of heads you go with, and a little luck. A good tune is also imporant both for making power and for ensuring your engine lives a longer happier life.

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    Senior Member rajiv1998's Avatar
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    You will need bolt ons before h/c.

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    Member qwk93ta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Intrepidman View Post
    If you really want to make a differnece its probably best to start saving. I don't think bolt ons are going to give you what you want. They are important to have, basically as a foundation for the later mods, but alone they won't do much. I personally gained less than 25rwhp/tq with full bolt ons, and I really couldn't feel much of a difference.

    This is where the savings part comes in...once you have the bolt ons you are ready for a cam which can give a decent power boost, and paired with a set of heads you can be roughly in the range of 400-450rwhp as you were asking about. Weather you are at the low or high end of that range depends on how wild your cam is, the quality of heads you go with, and a little luck. A good tune is also imporant both for making power and for ensuring your engine lives a longer happier life.


    I don't agree with what you said.....LS1s respond well to basic bolt-ons. With the following mods I went 13.03 @ 108 with a 2.02 60':


    used lid $ 60
    used LM1 $200
    tune $200
    ported TB $ 60
    SFCs $160
    free mods

    total $680 (2000 T/A WS6 A4)

    That's with a LS1 intake too. Going from stock to these mods was a huge diffierence, my car was a lot more fun to drive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by qwk93ta View Post
    I don't agree with what you said.....LS1s respond well to basic bolt-ons. With the following mods I went 13.03 @ 108 with a 2.02 60':
    Going from stock to these mods was a huge diffierence
    I guess it depends on what you call a huge difference....I agree its a difference, but I would describe it as small.....I guess it depends on perspective.

    I have before and after dyno runs (bone stock right down to a paper filter) then again with LTs, cat-back, lid, bellows, K&N, free mods, and a tune.
    The graphs show a slight increase all the way from 3000-6200rpm but as I said, less than 25hp/tq

    As for the track (actually two different tracks, and of course two different days).
    Bone stock - I can't remember the 60' but time was 13.01-13.09
    Full bolt ons, plus stc, stb, sway bars - a poor 2.165 60' gave me my best run at 12.9

    I'm not saying bolt ons aren't worth it. I'd say roughly 0.2 in quarter mile et (maybe 0.3 if I hadn't increased my car's weight), PLUS just the sound of LTs and a cat back alone is Worth it. But I don't think anyone who is really wanting to kick up the performance of thier car (to the order of 400-450rwhp) is going to be happy with bolt ons alone. Its just not that much of an increase.
    Going to a H/C set up is a much larger hp/tq increase, and can make the kind of serious power that the OP is talking about.
    Last edited by Intrepidman; 08-06-2010 at 06:13 AM.

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    Senior Member rajiv1998's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by qwk93ta View Post
    I don't agree with what you said.....LS1s respond well to basic bolt-ons. With the following mods I went 13.03 @ 108 with a 2.02 60':


    used lid $ 60
    used LM1 $200
    tune $200
    ported TB $ 60
    SFCs $160
    free mods

    total $680 (2000 T/A WS6 A4)

    That's with a LS1 intake too. Going from stock to these mods was a huge diffierence, my car was a lot more fun to drive.
    Agree. Full bolt ons will net you around 40-50 rwhp after tune. That's how much a cam will give you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rajiv1998 View Post
    Agree. Full bolt ons will net you around 40-50 rwhp after tune. That's how much a cam will give you.
    Not to start an argument, but have you seen many before and after dyno graphs to prove that? I did everything except underdrive pullies and porting work, and barely managed half that increase....being an 02 I started with the LS6 intake so I could see the earlier year cars picking up a slightly bigger increase than I did if they also swapped intakes....but 40-50 rwhp seems like its pushing it unless my car is a very atypical example.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Intrepidman View Post
    Not to start an argument, but have you seen many before and after dyno graphs to prove that? I did everything except underdrive pullies and porting work, and barely managed half that increase....being an 02 I started with the LS6 intake so I could see the earlier year cars picking up a slightly bigger increase than I did if they also swapped intakes....but 40-50 rwhp seems like its pushing it unless my car is a very atypical example.
    unless you did it at the same shop on the same day..the readings will fluctuate..weather and the calibration of the dyno all play a factor

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    My car is a 99 t/a convert, 2800 stall, 373 gears, cam, trans cooler, headers, ORY, tune,subframe connectors and ls2 intake with holley throttle body etc, Dynoed 390 at the wheels at 6100 rpm.. probably would have hit 400 or more if we wanted to pull it past 6400 rpm but I did not see the point. Anyway the money spent was worth it, it is not a daily driver tho, just a fun car. 450 hp at the wheels is gonna take quite a bit more. My cam is 575 lift, 230/240 duration, nothing real stout but you can hear it and it made a 35-40 hp difference. Just an example of what got me close to 400 hp.

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    Senior Member rajiv1998's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Intrepidman View Post
    Not to start an argument, but have you seen many before and after dyno graphs to prove that? I did everything except underdrive pullies and porting work, and barely managed half that increase....being an 02 I started with the LS6 intake so I could see the earlier year cars picking up a slightly bigger increase than I did if they also swapped intakes....but 40-50 rwhp seems like its pushing it unless my car is a very atypical example.
    All my friends with LS1's have made nothing short of 340 rwhp with full bolt ons. There are a very select few who make more and less.

    Your average LS1 will put down around 310ish to the wheels stock. A good set of long tubes matched with a catback/duals are good for around 20rwhp (realistically). Add an LS6 intake, ported tb, lid, re-tune it and its very possible to make those numbers.

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    Senior Member rajiv1998's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by allpontiac View Post
    My car is a 99 t/a convert, 2800 stall, 373 gears, cam, trans cooler, headers, ORY, tune,subframe connectors and ls2 intake with holley throttle body etc, Dynoed 390 at the wheels at 6100 rpm.. probably would have hit 400 or more if we wanted to pull it past 6400 rpm but I did not see the point. Anyway the money spent was worth it, it is not a daily driver tho, just a fun car. 450 hp at the wheels is gonna take quite a bit more. My cam is 575 lift, 230/240 duration, nothing real stout but you can hear it and it made a 35-40 hp difference. Just an example of what got me close to 400 hp.
    You also have an automatic with a stall and decent gears. Throw in a moser 12 bolt and watch those number go down even more.

    Horsepower doesnt mean shit unless you want a dyno queen. There are people with under 380rwhp running mid 11's.

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    Member qwk93ta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rajiv1998 View Post
    Horsepower doesnt mean shit unless you want a dyno queen. There are people with under 380rwhp running mid 11's.
    That is the truth.....All I care about is my 1/4 mile times!!

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    to jersey boy.. nobody said horsepower did mean SHIT.. the question was, could he get 400 horse with a cam and stall. I answered the question with what I got.. I never claimed any track record,any other bragging rights. I just gave the guy the mods.. keep your attitude to yourself..

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    how much are you willing to spend ? if you have a budget we could try to help you get the best bang for your buck.

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    If you want the biggest bang for your buck on this setup just call texas speed. You can get the magic stick 3 or 4 cam, and ls6 manifold, longtube headers and cam kit (springs, retainers, and pushrods) all for under 2000$ spend the money on a good stall between 3600 and 4000 with that cam and you will easily see over 400rwhp and be running solid 11 second times.. Your goals are relatively simple to achieve but you will need to find a really good tuner in the area then you will be able to keep your driveability.
    Alright... I'm starting it now. Try not to piss yourself.

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    Senior Member rajiv1998's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by allpontiac View Post
    to jersey boy.. nobody said horsepower did mean SHIT.. the question was, could he get 400 horse with a cam and stall. I answered the question with what I got.. I never claimed any track record,any other bragging rights. I just gave the guy the mods.. keep your attitude to yourself..
    WTF? Calm down. I never said you car was slow or anything. Im just saying your not a good example because you have a STALLED AND GEARED A4. Your car might have under 400 horsepower, but im sure it runs fast. I just said it because a lot of ppl go by "The more hp I have, the faster my car will be" LOL take it easy man, your only 22 posts old... you have a lot to learn

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    Senior Member rajiv1998's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by juiced99ws6 View Post
    If you want the biggest bang for your buck on this setup just call texas speed. You can get the magic stick 3 or 4 cam, and ls6 manifold, longtube headers and cam kit (springs, retainers, and pushrods) all for under 2000$ spend the money on a good stall between 3600 and 4000 with that cam and you will easily see over 400rwhp and be running solid 11 second times.. Your goals are relatively simple to achieve but you will need to find a really good tuner in the area then you will be able to keep your driveability.
    Im not trying to start a flame war because this subject has been brought up many times over the past, but avoid the ms4 if your gonna daily drive the car.

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    I'm new to the LS1s. What are the free mods?

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