Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 36

Cam Question

This is a discussion on Cam Question within the Internal Engine forums, part of the LSx Technical Help Section category; Well I'm looking at putting in a LS6 Oil Pump because: 1. I have a 98' LS1 2. Has 130k ...

  1. #1
    Spaz is My Mentor SMWS6TA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Ugy Lower Corner of AL
    Posts
    10,509

    Navy Blue Metallic
    98 T/A w/a little mods...

    Cam Question

    Well I'm looking at putting in a LS6 Oil Pump because:

    1. I have a 98' LS1
    2. Has 130k miles on it
    3. After reading about "Shaddy's" problems I'm worried mine will go out soon with all the stuff I've been doing.

    So since I'm down there and really hate doing the same work twice. If I was to get a Cam like TS&P MS4 could I still run it on stock LS1 heads?

    I know I won't get the full power gains until I get better heads and I can't afford to do H/C swap now (I already have a LS6 Intake). I just want to know if its better to just wait to put the CAM in with the heads or go ahead there's nothing to worry about.

    I also know I would need to change push rods. What else would I need to be looking at? Benefits of a beef up Single Timing chain vs a Double Roller Timing chain?

  2. #2
    Moderator 98TransAmWs-6's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Fairfax, VA
    Posts
    3,596

    Black/ Silver
    98 TA WS6/ 01 C5 Corvette

    Quote Originally Posted by SMWS6TA View Post
    Well I'm looking at putting in a LS6 Oil Pump because:

    1. I have a 98' LS1
    2. Has 130k miles on it
    3. After reading about "Shaddy's" problems I'm worried mine will go out soon with all the stuff I've been doing.

    So since I'm down there and really hate doing the same work twice. If I was to get a Cam like TS&P MS4 could I still run it on stock LS1 heads?

    I know I won't get the full power gains until I get better heads and I can't afford to do H/C swap now (I already have a LS6 Intake). I just want to know if its better to just wait to put the CAM in with the heads or go ahead there's nothing to worry about.

    I also know I would need to change push rods. What else would I need to be looking at? Benefits of a beef up Single Timing chain vs a Double Roller Timing chain?
    Are you an A4, if so you should get a stall if you don't have one. Also you will need better valve springs. I would get a ls2 timing set. The difference between single vs. Double is basically the double is two chains whereas the single is only one. Double rollers are stronger and last longer but also don't always clear the oil pump depending on the pump. They will clear the ls6 oil pump for sure though.

  3. #3
    Member youngrigo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Bay Area, CA
    Posts
    247

    Black
    2000 SS

    With a cam swap, I would do atleast a

    Ported LS6 oil pump
    Harden chromoly pushrods
    PRC dual valve springs
    1967 Camaro - LS1 T56 project
    2003 Z06 - Procharged and LTs
    2001 Honda Civic EX - DD
    2005 Kawaski KFX400
    2000 Camaro SS m6 - 523rwhp 468rwtq - (Sold)

  4. #4
    Junior Member BIG HOUSE's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Detoilet
    Age
    45
    Posts
    72

    NBM
    99 TransAm

    I was told not to invest alot of time/money into my 98 because of a casting flaw.just an fyi

  5. #5
    Spaz is My Mentor SMWS6TA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Ugy Lower Corner of AL
    Posts
    10,509

    Navy Blue Metallic
    98 T/A w/a little mods...

    Quote Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6 View Post
    Are you an A4, if so you should get a stall if you don't have one. Also you will need better valve springs. I would get a ls2 timing set. The difference between single vs. Double is basically the double is two chains whereas the single is only one. Double rollers are stronger and last longer but also don't always clear the oil pump depending on the pump. They will clear the ls6 oil pump for sure though.


    I'm have a M6 and my future plans are a LS6 with the MS4 cam and PRC LS6 Stage 3 Ported Heads from TS&P. (If I get the cam now I can use it later for the LS6.)

    Here's a list of current mods
    Last edited by SMWS6TA; 01-25-2011 at 11:17 AM.
    http://www.ls1.com/forums/f7/my-6-liter-build-174257/

    http://www.ls1.com/forums/f8/my-8-8-rear-build-165553/

    6.0L Block - Forged 403 built, breaking it in , Polluter Stg3 Cam, FAST 102mm Intake, NW102 TB, MSD wires, NGK TR6 plugs, Truck Coil Packs, LS3 Fuel Injectors, CC Pacesetter LT Headers, TS&P ORY, QTP e-Cutout, Magnaflow Muffler, 104mm Air Lid & Line Lock, Catch Can, Stage 2 T56 w/Viper shaft, PRO 5.0 Shifter, Tick MC, Monster Stg 4 Clutch, QT SFI BH, MWC DSL, UMI: SFC, PHB, LCA's, LCA Relocation Brackets & TA, Hotchkis Springs (1" Drop), YR1 Snowflake Wheels wrapped in NT555 tires & Custom Fab Ford 8.8 rear w/4.10 Yukon Gears, WSQ Hood, 3"CM Strange Eng Drive Shaft.

    Horsepower never lies, but is often lied about!

  6. #6
    Member youngrigo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Bay Area, CA
    Posts
    247

    Black
    2000 SS

    Quote Originally Posted by SMWS6TA View Post
    I'm have a M6 and my future plans are a LS6 with the MS4 cam and PRC LS6 Stage 3 Ported Heads from TS&P. (If I get the cam now I can use it later for the LS6.)

    Here's a list of current mods
    I think the stage 3 heads might be to big for a 346

  7. #7
    Veteran Hi-Po's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    10,461

    Black
    1999 TA WS.6

    Quote Originally Posted by SMWS6TA View Post
    Well I'm looking at putting in a LS6 Oil Pump because:

    1. I have a 98' LS1
    2. Has 130k miles on it
    3. After reading about "Shaddy's" problems I'm worried mine will go out soon with all the stuff I've been doing.

    So since I'm down there and really hate doing the same work twice. If I was to get a Cam like TS&P MS4 could I still run it on stock LS1 heads?

    I know I won't get the full power gains until I get better heads and I can't afford to do H/C swap now (I already have a LS6 Intake). I just want to know if its better to just wait to put the CAM in with the heads or go ahead there's nothing to worry about.

    I also know I would need to change push rods. What else would I need to be looking at? Benefits of a beef up Single Timing chain vs a Double Roller Timing chain?
    What are your goals with this car? Be honest with yourself, MS4 is a very large camshaft for the 346 LS1. It will be very good high RPM performer, but will not make the mid range power of a smaller, more suitable street camshaft. If its a track oriented car, go with it. If not, do some research before going with a MS series camshaft. Plenty of people do cam swaps and leave the heads untouched, will it leave power on the table? Yes. Do what you can afford though.

    You told me you read the Camshaft Sticky up top, that has a break down of what parts you need. I personally run the LS2 single chain, as does a large number of others. Single will be fine, there is also some timing chain comparisons in the sticky I believe.

    Furthermore, the MS4 is a top end performer no doubt. LS6 intake will work, but the FAST starts to shine up top, where the LS6 starts to fall. See where I'm going with this?
    Quote Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6 View Post
    Are you an A4, if so you should get a stall if you don't have one. Also you will need better valve springs. I would get a ls2 timing set. The difference between single vs. Double is basically the double is two chains whereas the single is only one. Double rollers are stronger and last longer but also don't always clear the oil pump depending on the pump. They will clear the ls6 oil pump for sure though.
    There are single chains that I would trust more then a double, I would still stick with a nice single chain.
    Quote Originally Posted by BIG HOUSE View Post
    I was told not to invest alot of time/money into my 98 because of a casting flaw.just an fyi
    Not sure who told you that, 98's have some flaws, mainly PCM limitations. OP won't be touching the limitations. Whoever said that, is wrong
    Quote Originally Posted by SMWS6TA View Post
    I'm have a M6 and my future plans are a LS6 with the MS4 cam and PRC LS6 Stage 3 Ported Heads from TS&P. (If I get the cam now I can use it later for the LS6.)

    Here's a list of current mods
    Quote Originally Posted by youngrigo View Post
    I think the stage 3 heads might be to big for a 346
    Stage III refers to the amount of port work performed. That's not how it works. Stage I heads are not stock runners , whereas Stage III is something crazy like a 225 head. OP, if heads are in your budget, look for a nice used set of AFR's. AFR 205's can be had for a nice price used, and are arguably, the best performing head for the LS1 street/strip car.

    The sticky will show what is needed for a cam swap, and LS1howto.com is a great website to get you up to speed for the swap.

    The sticky also touches on the little things that will add up in $$$ as you add power. Clutch would be the first that comes to mind. Factor in a chassis dyno tune also.

  8. #8
    Junior Member BIG HOUSE's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Detoilet
    Age
    45
    Posts
    72

    NBM
    99 TransAm

    Quote Originally Posted by Hi-Po View Post

    Not sure who told you that, 98's have some flaws, mainly PCM limitations. OP won't be touching the limitations. Whoever said that, is wrong




    .
    Something about oil flow restriction. They added windows in the 99 and later blocks to fix the problems. is what I was told

  9. #9
    Spaz is My Mentor SMWS6TA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Ugy Lower Corner of AL
    Posts
    10,509

    Navy Blue Metallic
    98 T/A w/a little mods...

    Quote Originally Posted by BIG HOUSE View Post
    Something about oil flow restriction. They added windows in the 99 and later blocks to fix the problems. is what I was told
    But that is also why the LS6 oil pump is highly recommend to take car of those issues for the 95-99 LS1's 99's I believe was when the LS1's got a new pump.

  10. #10
    Member youngrigo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Bay Area, CA
    Posts
    247

    Black
    2000 SS

    I thought stage 3 where ment for bigger bore motors? That motor is going to feel like a dawg down low with that cam and some stg 3 heads..... You will need gears to make up for the lack of low and mid range from this combo

  11. #11
    King 0f n00bz shady milkman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Shepherd, Michigan
    Age
    29
    Posts
    11,775

    blacker than wesleysnipes
    98' trans am

    Quote Originally Posted by BIG HOUSE View Post
    Something about oil flow restriction. They added windows in the 99 and later blocks to fix the problems. is what I was told
    oiling is not as good as the 99+s..but it is not a flaw..also the "problem" will only exist if you are pushing huge numbers and taking it on a road course...97-98 are fine

  12. #12
    King 0f n00bz shady milkman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Shepherd, Michigan
    Age
    29
    Posts
    11,775

    blacker than wesleysnipes
    98' trans am

    Quote Originally Posted by SMWS6TA View Post
    But that is also why the LS6 oil pump is highly recommend to take car of those issues for the 95-99 LS1's 99's I believe was when the LS1's got a new pump.
    95-99?

    the oil pump will not "fix" those issues..it is a casting issues...but dont worry about it...you will be fine..with that being said..swap the pump anyways

  13. #13
    Spaz is My Mentor SMWS6TA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Ugy Lower Corner of AL
    Posts
    10,509

    Navy Blue Metallic
    98 T/A w/a little mods...

    Shady what cam would you recommend? (for now)

    I would say 60/40 street/track plans. Plans are in the long run mid 400rwhp range. Planning on a LS6 in future to help get to that number.

  14. #14
    King 0f n00bz shady milkman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Shepherd, Michigan
    Age
    29
    Posts
    11,775

    blacker than wesleysnipes
    98' trans am

    Quote Originally Posted by SMWS6TA View Post
    Shady what cam would you recommend? (for now)

    I would say 60/40 street/track plans. Plans are in the long run mid 400rwhp range. Planning on a LS6 in future to help get to that number.
    224/228/112 lsa maybe even a 228/228..something in the .580/.580 range

    you know the only thing the ls6 gives you over your stock ls1 set up is the cam,ls6 heads.

    id personally get a custom grind.

  15. #15
    Moderator 98TransAmWs-6's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Fairfax, VA
    Posts
    3,596

    Black/ Silver
    98 TA WS6/ 01 C5 Corvette

    Quote Originally Posted by SMWS6TA View Post
    Shady what cam would you recommend? (for now)

    I would say 60/40 street/track plans. Plans are in the long run mid 400rwhp range. Planning on a LS6 in future to help get to that number.
    Why not a ls2 for your future plans? The ls2 would easily get you to where you want to be for power.

    Quote Originally Posted by hi-po View Post
    There are single chains that I would trust more then a double, I would still stick with a nice single chain.
    I wasn't saying double are better. Was just saying they are suppose to be stronger because of the double chains but I also personally would get a ls2 single timing chain.

  16. #16
    Spaz is My Mentor SMWS6TA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Ugy Lower Corner of AL
    Posts
    10,509

    Navy Blue Metallic
    98 T/A w/a little mods...

    Quote Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6 View Post
    Why not a ls2 for your future plans? The ls2 would easily get you to where you want to be for power.



    I wasn't saying double are better. Was just saying they are suppose to be stronger because of the double chains but I also personally would get a ls2 single timing chain.


    LS2 = much more $$$$. Would need a new pcm, and wire harness, etc....

    LS6 = plug & play with a tune.



    LS2 timing chain. I've found one for about $50 just the chain and the whole kit for $110. Do I need the whole kit or can I just swap out the chain?

  17. #17
    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    12,552
    Quote Originally Posted by 98TransAmWs-6 View Post
    Why not a ls2 for your future plans? The ls2 would easily get you to where you want to be for power.
    Actually we were just having a discussion about this in another thread with Basham. Interstingly we were talking about HP between the LS2 and the LS6 crate motors, when Frost mentioned he sees the LS6's put down 400+ RWHP on his dyno,,,while the LS2's with same mods make 370-380 RWHP.
    The LS6 crate is no slouch by any means.

    Quote Originally Posted by SMWS6TA View Post
    LS2 = much more $$$$. Would need a new pcm, and wire harness, etc....

    LS6 = plug & play with a tune.

    Exactly why the LS6 is a more popular swap as well, since the LS2 requires harness adapters, reluctor wheel adapter box, etc..

  18. #18
    Spaz is My Mentor SMWS6TA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Ugy Lower Corner of AL
    Posts
    10,509

    Navy Blue Metallic
    98 T/A w/a little mods...

    FBJ,


    Do you know the answer to the LS2 timing chain question from my post 16?

  19. #19
    Veteran 0rion's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    ohio
    Posts
    22,519

    98 Formula
    06 duramax

    just the chain.....check around....should be a few bucks cheaper than that unless they've gone way up since I did mine.
    At a minimum you'll want pushrods and springs. You can buy a "cam package" that will have everything in it.....$599 for 918 springs or $699 for prc double's.

  20. #20
    Veteran 0rion's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    ohio
    Posts
    22,519

    98 Formula
    06 duramax

    Quote Originally Posted by BIG HOUSE View Post
    I was told not to invest alot of time/money into my 98 because of a casting flaw.just an fyi
    I wish someone would've told me that before I put the money into mine, run 11's, and going on 100k miles.

    Don't look at the differences as "flaws".....there were "improvements" made to the 99+ cars. 98's are just fine to mod and race.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. speedometer question + top speed question
    By Krazy351w in forum General Help
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 06-21-2007, 06:51 PM
  2. HPIII question (not the same old question)
    By slims00ls1z28 in forum Computer & Tuning
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 06-01-2007, 05:55 PM
  3. 97 Bird Headlight question also engine noise question
    By Zapper2003 in forum General Help
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 12-13-2006, 04:03 AM
  4. Speedometer question, RPO question
    By acrylicophobia in forum Firebird / WS6
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 11-02-2006, 08:08 AM
  5. Sex Question spinoff- PORN QUESTION
    By egaian in forum Almost Anything Goes
    Replies: 77
    Last Post: 07-26-2006, 04:07 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •