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Koni? which set?

This is a discussion on Koni? which set? within the Suspension and Handling forums, part of the General Help category; So, with all this talk about koni's being awesome, I've been looking at them: which set is the one being ...

  1. #1
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    Koni? which set?

    So, with all this talk about koni's being awesome, I've been looking at them:

    which set is the one being discussed? the 4/3 and 4/4 or the Sport? for the price, I'm inclined to go with the 8241-1139 Sport front, and 8241-1140 Sport rear.

    my car is a DD, in San Antonio's never ending roads under contruction, with stock springs.

    If the Koni SA aren't recommended on stock springs, which springs to go with (i'm not looking to lower the car more the 3/4")

    or what shocks should i be looking at with stock springs?

  2. #2
    Mike The Guz's Avatar
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    The 4/4 rears can be adjusted from inside the car. The 4/3 rears have to be adjusted off the car. As far as springs, you can run the koni's and do the heater hose mod. That gives a 3/4" drop. BMR and Hotchkis springs lower the car 1".
    2002 Artic White SS 35th Wheels|Full Hotchkis Suspension|Koni SA|Magnaflow CME|SLP lid|www.fquick.com/The_Guz

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    Jesus died to save you! Killer_bluebird's Avatar
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    Konis work great with stock spring like it was mentioned you can get a 1/2-3/4" drop doing the heater mod and setting the spring perch in the lower position. I would not recommend the BMR springs though, If you want about 1" drop Hotchkis are pretty good if you want around 1.25" then Stranos are your ticket. Since you are not going to be adjusting them do the 4/3 set up get the recommendations for settings from Sam and set them and forget them. I have the 4/3 and I compete and have not had any problems setting the car up. I actually like them just as much as my previous setup which where Dual adjustable. My .02
    2000 NBM Camaro Z28
    Mods:
    SLP Lid & K&N, AHR Headers + 3" catted Y and Mangaflow, !EGR, !AIR, BMR CM STB, ST Front 35mm and Hellwig Adj. Rear 22mm Swaybar, Adj. Rod/Rod PHB, Koni SA's, Ground Control Springs & Adj. Ride height, and HPTuners.

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    old timer blue02Z's Avatar
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    well, hit up Sam Strano he is to suspension as Sarge is to oil. in other words he knows his shit. i am currently saving to get new stock springs and a set of konis as well. you might look into doing the heater hose mod as mentioned above. i have done it and really like the way it looks but still have a decent ride height. i live in dfw and understand road contruction

  5. #5
    Member JAGUAR5822's Avatar
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    I would go with the 4/4s just because of the ease of adjustability. I think hotpart.com currently stocks them for cheapest. There are a lot of threads about settings if you search around. A lot of people recommend the 1LE springs if you don't want to lower it much, if I remeber correctly. As already stated, you can do the heater hose mod if you find the rear sits up too high. I don't remember if 1LE springs lower the car, but if they don't, you can just set up the front koni on the lower perch, and that will lower it 3/4" I believe.

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    TURBO AWD....YESSSSSSSSSS 317Born's Avatar
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    whats the heater hose mod?

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    Jesus died to save you! Killer_bluebird's Avatar
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    You remove the rear spring rubber isolator and then take a section of heater hose and slip it over the first coil of the top of the spring. That lower the back around 3/4" or so.

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    TURBO AWD....YESSSSSSSSSS 317Born's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killer_bluebird View Post
    You remove the rear spring rubber isolator and then take a section of heater hose and slip it over the first coil of the top of the spring. That lower the back around 3/4" or so.
    oh ok....i wanna lift my rear end...so that would do me no good....whats a good spring and shock combo to drag race with

  9. #9
    Member JAGUAR5822's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 317Born View Post
    oh ok....i wanna lift my rear end...so that would do me no good....whats a good spring and shock combo to drag race with
    Drag radials........ Seriously depending on your mods, just a good set of tires for the track will make all the difference in the world.

  10. #10
    TURBO AWD....YESSSSSSSSSS 317Born's Avatar
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    08 Mazda CX-7 2.3l Turbo

    Quote Originally Posted by JAGUAR5822 View Post
    Drag radials........ Seriously depending on your mods, just a good set of tires for the track will make all the difference in the world.
    i just bought some nitto555r's....i kno imma need more than that 2 put all my power to the ground...im stock with 3 inch exhaust all the way back into a flowmaster super 40 muffler 3inch inlet and outlets...im thinking about ordering some pacesetter lt's....and a fast 90/90 intake

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    ^^


    To the OP
    I debated for months on getting Koni's and whether to get new stock springs or just get the Strano Springs. My car is also a DD and was on 125K mile stock suspension, so it was in need of attention.
    I can tell you without hesitation that the Koni's and Strano Springs/Swaybars was the best mod I've done to this car in the 10 years I've owned it.
    It totally transformed the ride and the handling. The ride is firm without being harsh and it corners flatter then an Aircraft Carrier, It is simply amazing.
    I went with the 4/4's for ease of adjustability and a UMI Adj. Panhard bar to recenter the rearend. Obviuosly it's not cheap (but the best seldom is) and somewhat of a PITA to install but it's well worth it.
    I always loved driving my car, but now I love driving it even more.
    Craig
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    Gone but not forgoten
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  12. #12
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    currently, i've done non-adjustable LCA and Panhard Bar. so, i'm not looking to going too drastic on the lowering. I'm still thinking that the SA/Sport are the shocks i'm going for.

  13. #13
    Member JAGUAR5822's Avatar
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    Navy Blue Metallic
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    You should try just changing to the konis, and lower it using your stock springs using the methods discussed above. Even if you don't like it, it only takes an afternoon to install different springs, impact wrench helps a lot. The back is super easy, the front is easy, but takes longer.

    Here is a quick guide, as always, I may have forgotten something, so don't take this as written in stone, but I have done 2 cars in the last 2 or 3 weeks as well as swapping out a rear end =)

    Basic how to for the front:
    side note-Once the wheels are off the ground, the shock assembly is fully extended, there is no pressure at this point, you will compress the springs once the assembly is off the car

    -Jack up car so wheels are off the ground, no more
    -remove wheel on whatever side you're doing first
    -unbolt brake master cylinder, pull it up over the cowl
    -take off shock tower bolts and nuts, leaving one nut on the bolt a little bit
    -remove lower shock bolts
    -loosen (a lot) or remove sway bar end link
    -loosen the upper ball joint nut about .5" down, then bang on it a bit to separate the upper a-arm and ball joint
    -get something to support the a-arm and brake caliper so all the weight isn't hanging by the brake line, then remove the upper ball joint nut completely
    -the lower a-arm, spindle, caliper, and rotor will now lower easily, the shock/spring combo is still hanging by one nut, make sure the wheel sensor line is out of the way, support the shock with one hand, and take off the nut, now manuever it out, I think I got the bottom toward the back of the car to the side of the a-arm, then took the top angled toward the front/side
    -at this point, get a spring compressor and compress the spring, a little bit on one side at a time, the impact wrench is essential to save time at this point, once compressed, see if you can undo the shock mount bolt, it may be rusted on, if so, you need to cut the shock rod to get your springs off, you will also need a new shock mount now
    -move the koni to the lower perch to lower the front, then assemble the shock and spring, making sure the lower shock mount is aligned properly with the upper just how it came off the car, otherwise it will be a real bitch when putting it back on
    -Install is opposite of removal, make sure you have the torque specs for everything, and you may want to use some blue loctite to make sure nothing backs off.

    Rear-
    side note- I don't remember if you have to remove both shocks at the same time when replacing the springs, try doing just one, and if the rear won't come down enough to get the spring out, do the other, the rear will still be held in place by the torque arm , lca's, panhard, and sway bar, so don't worry about it going anywhere

    -jack up the car so the wheels are 4-5 inches off the ground
    -support the car using jack stands, then support the rear with a floor jack in the center
    -there are 2 pre-perforated flaps right behind the back seat when you fold it down, cut 3 side of the flaps, then remove the shock foam
    -use the impact to remove the upper shock bolt
    -loosen the lower shock bolt
    -use the floor jack to move the rear up a bit to remove pressure from the shock, it may fall out at this point, if not, you'll see when the rear is no longer pulling down on the shock, and you can easily slide it out
    -lower rear using jack to relieve pressure from springs and give you room to move them out of there, remove the big rubber at the top and do the hose mod if you're keeping stock springs, re-use the rubber if you buy lowering springs
    -put the new shock in place, bolt the bottom mount first
    -replace the spring, making sure to keep the same orientation it had when removed
    jack up the rear until the shock compresses a bit
    -replace upper shock nut, adjust shock using knob
    -repeat on other side
    Last edited by JAGUAR5822; 08-25-2008 at 09:20 AM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by JAGUAR5822 View Post
    I would go with the 4/4s just because of the ease of adjustability. I think hotpart.com currently stocks them for cheapest. There are a lot of threads about settings if you search around. A lot of people recommend the 1LE springs if you don't want to lower it much, if I remeber correctly. As already stated, you can do the heater hose mod if you find the rear sits up too high. I don't remember if 1LE springs lower the car, but if they don't, you can just set up the front koni on the lower perch, and that will lower it 3/4" I believe.
    I feel that I have to address this statement.

    Strano Performance Parts is a site sponsor and also the this particular forum sponsor. Further, we sell for the MAP (minimum advertised pricing) Koni dictates to it's vendors. I'm not willing to punch them in the fact an risk pissing them off because they have always offered me good support. And I know for a fact, having seen other companies play games that it's not received well by the manufacturer.

    The pricing shown by hotpart.com is old. They might choose to honor that price, but it's out of date. In fact I sold for that price as well once upon a time (about 2 years ago) when that was the MAP pricing. It is not any longer.

    Strano Performance is who came up with the "4/3" setup as an option to the standard issue and cataloged "4/4's" that anyone else sells. The shocks are not the same. Some find it easy to copy the basic premise, but cannot copy the information I have in my head and offer to my customers.

    And finally.... Koni's are great shocks. But their instructions are not great. They are in fact quite poor. I spend time with each and every customer of Koni's to explain both setup and adjustment of the shock to them on an individual basis. I also explain how changing rebound damping effects the car's behavior. That's part of the sale.
    Sam Strano
    SCCA National Champion (x6)
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    2009 SCCA ProSolo Overall Champion
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    814-849-3450

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    Member JAGUAR5822's Avatar
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    Sorry, didn't mean to step on anyones toes, I know that you're pretty much known as the suspension god when it comes to Fbods and probably other cars as well lol. I didn't know the prices on there were out of date, just saw them when browsing for stuff at different sites.

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    A trained professional volleybill's Avatar
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    what use is a good price without good support- who you going to call and ask your questions to? There is more to a major purchase than just a cheaper price-

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    Member JAGUAR5822's Avatar
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    I don't race my car, so I don't really need the support as much as some of you guys do. If I ever race anything, it will be my bike because it's much cheaper to do so. Plus I'm a poor college student, so the cheaper the better.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JAGUAR5822 View Post
    I don't race my car, so I don't really need the support as much as some of you guys do. If I ever race anything, it will be my bike because it's much cheaper to do so. Plus I'm a poor college student, so the cheaper the better.
    setting your suspension up properly and ease of install are still very important even if your not racing......sam walked me thru over the phone step by step then i went to town on the car.........had no issues mostly because of all the lil things he told me to do and not to do........A+ customer service

  19. #19
    Member JAGUAR5822's Avatar
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    I'm not, and have not bad-mouthed him or his business in any way. I was simply sharing what worked for me. Because of my limited cash flow, I research the shit out of whatever I am buying before I buy itm and it's worked out well so far.

    On a side note: my suspension mods did save me from a wreck this afternoon, idiot making a left turn decides to just go as soon as the light I was approaching on a 50mph road turns yellow. I tapped the brakes a bit and decided to swerve around him since there were no cars in the curb lane next to me, car performed beautifully
    Last edited by JAGUAR5822; 08-25-2008 at 09:27 PM.

  20. #20
    A trained professional volleybill's Avatar
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    I think research is a great thing, and don't like to spend any more than I have to- I am as cheap, er, efficient, as I can be- but- do you want to do business with a company that doesn't care about your results, just wants you to send the money and rush on to the next sale, or, do want someone who is knowledable about these cars, who knows what it takes to make them perform at a national level, and knows what combinations work together?

    Can you ask the cheaper places whether you should lower your springs, or what aftermarket springs, sway bars and panhard bars play nice together? Have you ever driven a car with mis-matched components? Not too much fun if it too stiff to flex and pogos all over, or if it wallows and rolls- you get what I am trying to say, I presume-

    Sam has spent the time racing and winning, and knows what parts you need, whether you want to be 'better than stock' or full-on race prepped- He isn't there just to make a sale- He wants to know what you expect your car to do, what you are willing to spend, and what parts you need to do the job right the first time. So I guess I am talking about customer support BEFORE the sale, not after- there are a million different parts out there- Bilsteins, Heavy-duty Bilsteins, re-valved custom Bilsteins- Koni single adjustable, double adustable- stock springs, lowering springs, Eibachs, global west, - hollow sway bars, bigger bars- lower control arms, watts linkages- how far do you want to go? How big or little is your budget? After you do this mod, will you be changing other parts? What wheels and tires? The car is a system, not a bunch of isolated pieces, and they need to be tuned to work together- where else are you going to get the years of expertise? Unless you want to try buying parts trial and error, just buying whatever is available-

    Do yo have a stock torque arm? Planning on changing it in the future? I could go on all night, but you know what I am trying to say- anybody will take your money and sell you parts, but how many of them can give you qualified advice? How much is THAT worth?

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