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Drill Mod...Does it actually work??

This is a discussion on Drill Mod...Does it actually work?? within the Manual Transmission forums, part of the Drivetrain category; Ya all the T56 cars we have had are a little sticky when cold. Just nature,,,even with thin auto tranny ...

  1. #21
    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Ya all the T56 cars we have had are a little sticky when cold. Just nature,,,even with thin auto tranny fluid. And these hydraulic clutch systems really make pedal effort minimal as if there isn't much there.
    Try an old muncie with 90 weight I have to go 15-20 miles before that thing loosens up in the cold weather. But when it's warm they are one of the best shifting tranny's made, smooth as silk,,,if I could just get a T56 to feel that good I'd be set.

  2. #22
    The Bandit Wesman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firebirdjones View Post
    Ya all the T56 cars we have had are a little sticky when cold. Just nature,,,even with thin auto tranny fluid. And these hydraulic clutch systems really make pedal effort minimal as if there isn't much there.
    Try an old muncie with 90 weight I have to go 15-20 miles before that thing loosens up in the cold weather. But when it's warm they are one of the best shifting tranny's made, smooth as silk,,,if I could just get a T56 to feel that good I'd be set.
    What shifter are you using??

    My Pro 5.0 on my T56 the shifts are very positive, you really feel it snick-snick from gear to gear. Its almost too much with the short stick sometimes, under WOT you really have to pound it to fully engage the next gear

  3. #23
    Member Rob00Taws6's Avatar
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    i have the B&M short throw on my car, forgot to mention that. But, despite that, muncie is a completely different animal. I've never had joy of driving one. one of these days i will!

  4. #24
    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wesman View Post
    What shifter are you using??

    My Pro 5.0 on my T56 the shifts are very positive, you really feel it snick-snick from gear to gear. Its almost too much with the short stick sometimes, under WOT you really have to pound it to fully engage the next gear
    It has the factory Hurst shifter in it. I've also used the aftermarket Hurst in the past etc....Ya that snick snick you describe is my way of saying these transmission are very "NOTCHY" Just not a smooth action that I would prefer.
    All the T56's have been that way that we have owned. Not that it has a problem,,,I'm just used to the butter smooth action of an old Muncie...So I'm not that comfortable slamming gears in a T56.

  5. #25
    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob00Taws6 View Post
    i have the B&M short throw on my car, forgot to mention that. But, despite that, muncie is a completely different animal. I've never had joy of driving one. one of these days i will!
    I grew up on Muncie's so I have gotten a taste for them. Just a butter smooth tranny that is the easiest tranny to hang gears in,,,,once nudged in the direction you want to go the gear practically falls in,,,that is provided you have a nice shifter that is adjusted properly.
    Unlike a T56 that is notchy as hell, and you have to get real forcefull with it.

  6. #26
    The Bandit Wesman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firebirdjones View Post
    It has the factory Hurst shifter in it. I've also used the aftermarket Hurst in the past etc....Ya that snick snick you describe is my way of saying these transmission are very "NOTCHY" Just not a smooth action that I would prefer.
    All the T56's have been that way that we have owned. Not that it has a problem,,,I'm just used to the butter smooth action of an old Muncie...So I'm not that comfortable slamming gears in a T56.
    Never drove a Muncie, but I see what you mean. The T56 is very notchy by design, being an internally shifted transmission with 6 speeds to control.

    My friend has a Saginaw 4 speed in his Nova, I wouldn't say thats smooth that all though, you really have to shove it into gear. Muncie is much smoother for some reason?? Different internal design perhaps??

  7. #27
    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wesman View Post
    Never drove a Muncie, but I see what you mean. The T56 is very notchy by design, being an internally shifted transmission with 6 speeds to control.

    My friend has a Saginaw 4 speed in his Nova, I wouldn't say thats smooth that all though, you really have to shove it into gear. Muncie is much smoother for some reason?? Different internal design perhaps??
    Much different. The saginaw is a cast iron case and the gear set is very small compared to a muncie. The Saginaw 4-speeds won't take much abuse.
    Setting one next to a muncie you can immediately see the case size difference.
    Ya the Muncie's are smoother, could be the size of the gears,,,once in motion they are hard to stop,,,lol.

    Actually they are designed a bit different other than the obvious size, material and strength difference. The saginaw has it's reverse lever up with the forward gears, where as the muncie has reverse in the rear of the case,,,the side cover carries the forward gears only. Nothing interchangable at all except the rear driveshaft seal and bushing,,,provided we are talking about a small output shaft muncie since thats the only way the saginaws were made. They also made a large output shaft muncie (400 turbo yoke)

  8. #28
    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wesman View Post
    Never drove a Muncie, but I see what you mean. The T56 is very notchy by design, being an internally shifted transmission with 6 speeds to control.

    My friend has a Saginaw 4 speed in his Nova, I wouldn't say thats smooth that all though, you really have to shove it into gear. Muncie is much smoother for some reason?? Different internal design perhaps??
    Got an email,,,I'll send ya a side by side pic. I keep several spares around of both.

  9. #29
    2 SS's are better than 1 Jays00ss's Avatar
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    yes absolutely. Well worth time and money to do. My clutch is instantaneous now absolutely love the mod!!!!! Daily drive my car in the summer and love it.
    2000 SS Camaro Heads, Large cam, Fast 90, 9"w/430's and locker, yada yada yada... you get the picture

    1971 SS ElCamino 402 Big Block 550HP

    2006 Silverado 2500HD 496 cubic inches of pure muscle

  10. #30
    2 SS's are better than 1 Jays00ss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firebirdjones View Post
    Much different. The saginaw is a cast iron case and the gear set is very small compared to a muncie. The Saginaw 4-speeds won't take much abuse.
    Setting one next to a muncie you can immediately see the case size difference.
    Ya the Muncie's are smoother, could be the size of the gears,,,once in motion they are hard to stop,,,lol.

    Actually they are designed a bit different other than the obvious size, material and strength difference. The saginaw has it's reverse lever up with the forward gears, where as the muncie has reverse in the rear of the case,,,the side cover carries the forward gears only. Nothing interchangable at all except the rear driveshaft seal and bushing,,,provided we are talking about a small output shaft muncie since thats the only way the saginaws were made. They also made a large output shaft muncie (400 turbo yoke)
    My muncie 4 speed in my 67 SS 427 chevelle was industructable. Loved that thing. Syncros were flawless and never missed a shift. took the abuse of a built 500 hp big block 427.

  11. #31
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    On the orifice drilling.

    This is a favorite subject in engineering, fluid mechanics, and differential equations.

    The orifice has one job...it changes the rate by which a fluid can pass through it. (The speed of pushing the clutch in and its return, and by that how fast you can get that fluid energy to engage and disengage the clutch.)

    So WHY is the problem noted at serious business launches and going up through the gears. MOI - Moment of Inertia, the faster a mass spins the more effective mass it has. (The faster the rpm the 'heavier' it is.)

    I said the orifice has one job, slow the rate of fluid. It is a dampener. But then you have to look at momentum. Momentum is mass times speed (and mass times speed square gets you into talking about energy...it takes energy to do work.) So you have plenty of leg at low launches, at hard launches you can't get enough energy to the clutch. The fingers of the clutch have the same problem!

    It should always help to open it up or remove it! If the problem in shifting is in the Rate of RPM increase!
    Last edited by BowTied; 12-23-2008 at 07:33 PM. Reason: phrasing error

  12. #32
    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Hey Wes, did you send me a PM or something???

  13. #33
    The Bandit Wesman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firebirdjones View Post
    Hey Wes, did you send me a PM or something???
    Yep...I sent you a PM with my email address.

    Why, it didn't go through??

  14. #34
    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wesman View Post
    Yep...I sent you a PM with my email address.

    Why, it didn't go through??
    Oooops, ya it's there. Sorry I never got an email message thingy to tell me. I was out of town over the weekend. I am home now. Pics coming to you shortly. Sorry for the delay.

  15. #35
    The Bandit Wesman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firebirdjones View Post
    Oooops, ya it's there. Sorry I never got an email message thingy to tell me. I was out of town over the weekend. I am home now. Pics coming to you shortly. Sorry for the delay.
    Haha no prob don't worry about it

  16. #36
    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wesman View Post
    Haha no prob don't worry about it
    sending them now with some extra eye candy.

    Edit: Sorry for the big pics,,,they take a while.
    Last edited by Firebirdjones; 12-24-2008 at 01:56 PM.

  17. #37
    The Bandit Wesman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firebirdjones View Post
    sending them now with some extra eye candy.

    Edit: Sorry for the big pics,,,they take a while.
    Just got them, nice pics. I can see why people prefer the Muncie over the Saginaw - lighter, stronger, and better design is always good.

    BTW is that your garage?? If so, very nice.

  18. #38
    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Thanks, Ya thats the garage out back. Sorry for the mess, boxes are everywhere right now. I have the cars all packed in the corner for the time being trying to make some room.

  19. #39
    The Bandit Wesman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firebirdjones View Post
    Thanks, Ya thats the garage out back. Sorry for the mess, boxes are everywhere right now. I have the cars all packed in the corner for the time being trying to make some room.
    Haha yea I hear ya. I have a lift in my garage at the house, but in order to use it everything has to be pulled out and moved around lol, so you can't be in a hurry.

  20. #40
    2004 HEAD/CAM CTS-V 9t8z28's Avatar
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    It's funny, I do all of my own work on my car, and I have never attempted this mod, and I have not even looked at it and my clutch does stick to the floor. I guess all of the times that my car is on the lift is to clean it or do exhaust mods.

    Can I access this line without yanking the tranny?

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