Ratchet Shifting a 4l60e

**MudStainKILLA** · 02-06-2010, 03:46 PM

Alright so i made this same post a couple days ago under trans am/ws6 and really didnt get much back. Most likely wrong place to post. Since then i have researched this idea all over via this website and many others. Ive got some ideas but my research has raised even more questions. I am some what lost when it comes to automatic trannys and even more lost when they are shifted electronicly. If anymone has anything to offer or know of someone who has done this already lay it down please. I am open to all ideas and opinions.

**Cutlass** · 02-06-2010, 06:26 PM

So what exactly is your question? You wanna know how to put a rachet shifter in your TA? Which ratchet shifter do you wanna use?
I had a B&M Quicksilver in my old street/strip car ('88 Cutlass Supreme rwd). It was awesome and easy to install/adjust. Biggest problem I could see for you is how well it will fit and match up with your center console.

**MudStainKILLA** · 02-06-2010, 09:08 PM

i am really not that worried about looks i am more looking into the aspect of ratchet shifting if you catch my drift. My old man I.E. father used to have an old dart that had a ratchet shirter in it and i absolutley fell in love with driving it. I want to be able to have the same feel with my ws6. With the 4l60e i have heard alot on the side that this is not posibble. on the other hand i have heard talk about manual valve bodies/reverse valbodies and i am left at a loss. If it is a simple fix such as bracketing i have no problem with figureing that part out. I infact welcome it because it gives me more face time with my car. I guess what i am really asking is if this is even possible on a 4l60e or would it be more likely to swap out with a 700r4(if that is even possible) Again i am soory im i am coming off like i have no clue what i am talking about. i am just trying to cover all my basis with this build.

**MudStainKILLA** · 02-06-2010, 09:17 PM

soory if that was vague, i am looking to equip what ever ratchet shifter is applicable to an 02 ws6 as possible and have it be able to handle about 500 to 550rwhp. if that is still to vague please let me know and i will try to explain even further in depth if i can

**Cutlass** · 02-07-2010, 05:02 AM

yah the B&M rachet shifters work with 4l60E, I believe. Maybe even the Hurst shifter also. I mean the factory shifter has D1, D2, D3, and OD so its as simple as replacing that shifter with one that ratchets. You just have to pick one that says it works with the 4l60E

**Benner** · 02-07-2010, 05:14 AM

Originally Posted by Cutlass

yah the B&M rachet shifters work with 4l60E, I believe. Maybe even the Hurst shifter also. I mean the factory shifter has D1, D2, D3, and OD so its as simple as replacing that shifter with one that ratchets. You just have to pick one that says it works with the 4l60E

Pretty much covers it. Remember though if your wanting to have the full ratchet shifter experience you'll need a manual valvebody installed since it'll still shift automatically even with a ratchet shifter in the car.

**MudStainKILLA** · 02-07-2010, 07:11 AM

i contacted B&M and they stated that they do not make a ratchet shifter for a 4l60e. the guy didnt seem like he knew much that i was on the phone with. long pauses and short answers.

**Skippy** · 02-07-2010, 07:56 AM

one of our site sponsors that deals with transmissions (i dont remember which one) sells a part they call the black box that allows you to shift our trannys manually. Its a box that taps into the trans control wires and fools the computer so it wont try to over ride what you are doing with the shifter

**Benner** · 02-07-2010, 08:44 AM

Originally Posted by Skippy

one of our site sponsors that deals with transmissions (i dont remember which one) sells a part they call the black box that allows you to shift our trannys manually. Its a box that taps into the trans control wires and fools the computer so it wont try to over ride what you are doing with the shifter

Still the shifting is gonna be very slow compared to a tranny with a manual valve body and proper springs

**Frost** · 02-07-2010, 09:33 AM

They aren't much made or used because they aren't needed. If you have a old school th350/400 with an MVB you would use one. The 60's shift kind of retarded when you try and manually shift them unless they have an MVB, but you lose auto operation all together. The computer can shift much better, much more reliably and with much better repeatability. It's kind of backwards thinking here. The point of the ratchet shifter was to make the things work easier and better. The PCM does this for your now.

**MudStainKILLA** · 02-07-2010, 11:12 AM

im not really looking to do this for a performance gain. More just to add to the aspect of driving. I just like the feel of driving a car with a ratchet shifter.

**Cutlass** · 02-07-2010, 01:36 PM

Hmmm...right on B&M's website it states:

fits 4L60E when used with custom installation where an aftermarket controller is used to command the transmission. 4L60E factory neutral safety switch may interfere with B&M shift lever on '97 and later transmissions

I'm definitely confused here. My ratchet shifter in my old car (TH350) worked like this. I'd put it in D and it would shift automaticly. If the trans was in third and i wanted 2nd, I would yank the lever down and it ratcheted into 2nd. Same with 1st. If I was at the strip, I'd ratchet down to 1st @ the line, wait for the green light and go. I'd ratchet up once into 2nd when i hit 5500rpm and it would bang into 2nd like I wanted.
If I let it shift automatically at the track it would shift at 4600rpm or something. So that why I shifted manually.
Why would that be the same way with a 4L60E? I can manually shift my Blazer 1...2...3...4 with the column shifter. It should be the same (and easier) with a ratchet shifter, right?
MudStainKILLA, is that what you're looking to do?
What am I missing here?

**Firebirdjones** · 02-07-2010, 01:51 PM

Your turbo 350 shifted at 4,600 rpm because that is where the governor in the trans was set to shift. You could have changed the governor with any of the kits available from TCI or B&M that would taylor your full throttle shift points anywhere you would have liked, then you could have left it in drive and not worry about it.

**Cutlass** · 02-07-2010, 01:54 PM

Originally Posted by Firebirdjones

Your turbo 350 shifted at 4,600 rpm because that is where the governor in the trans was set to shift. You could have changed the governor with any of the kits available from TCI or B&M that would taylor your full throttle shift points anywhere you would have liked, then you could have left it in drive and not worry about it.

Yah, I know. But I liked it that way so I could chose/vary my shift points. Couldn't you do the same with a 4L60E if you lowered the shift points in the computer?

**Firebirdjones** · 02-07-2010, 01:57 PM

To explain further. It doesn't work with the 4L60E because,,,for one thing, it's electronically controlled to shift at a predetermined rpm (say 6,000) just like a governor would do in a 350 or 400 turbo.

To override that function on a 4L60E would require that reprogram thingamajig that was mentioned. But why do it??

What frost is saying is that,,,it's really not necessary. Once the auto is setup to shift at the rpm needed, there is no reason to shift them manually, whether it's a 350/400 turbo or a 4l60e. You get better consistency letting the trans take over.

**Firebirdjones** · 02-07-2010, 02:00 PM

Originally Posted by Cutlass

Yah, I know. But I liked it that way so I could chose/vary my shift points. Couldn't you do the same with a 4L60E if you lowered the shift points in the computer?

Yes you probably could.

I can tell you on a 400 turbo that doesn't work unless you plug the bleed hole in the valve body with a small 1/8 brass plug.
On that trans if you have a governor that shifts at 4500 and you want to hold that gear to 5,000,,,,you can't do it. The governor takes over and shifts the trans to second at 4500 even if you still have the shifter in first,,,,to protect against engine damage of course. A little safety feature that GM put in the 400 turbos.

Not sure if the 4L60E would react this way or not. I would say more than likely though,,,to keep those warranty claims down

**Cutlass** · 02-07-2010, 02:05 PM

Yes no need to...unless you want...because its fun

. You can cruise around and hold a gear a little longer then the computer thinks you need to. You can slam down a gear in preparation for a rolling race or a showoff blast away from another car you're toying with.
Thats what the OP is looking for I believe.

**Firebirdjones** · 02-07-2010, 02:10 PM

Originally Posted by Cutlass

Yes no need to...unless you want...because its fun

. You can cruise around and hold a gear a little longer then the computer thinks you need to. You can slam down a gear in preparation for a rolling race or a showoff blast away from another car you're toying with.
Thats what the OP is looking for I believe.

Haha, ya.. guess I'm getting old. I just prefer to setup the tranny to do everything and leave it in drive.
I've got manual trans cars that I have to shift. After a while I get tired of it, then it's nice to slip into an auto for a change.

**MudStainKILLA** · 02-07-2010, 03:02 PM

Originally Posted by Cutlass

Hmmm...right on B&M's website it states:

I'm definitely confused here. My ratchet shifter in my old car (TH350) worked like this. I'd put it in D and it would shift automaticly. If the trans was in third and i wanted 2nd, I would yank the lever down and it ratcheted into 2nd. Same with 1st. If I was at the strip, I'd ratchet down to 1st @ the line, wait for the green light and go. I'd ratchet up once into 2nd when i hit 5500rpm and it would bang into 2nd like I wanted.
If I let it shift automatically at the track it would shift at 4600rpm or something. So that why I shifted manually.
Why would that be the same way with a 4L60E? I can manually shift my Blazer 1...2...3...4 with the column shifter. It should be the same (and easier) with a ratchet shifter, right?
MudStainKILLA, is that what you're looking to do?
What am I missing here?

this is exactly what i am looking to do with it. as for B&M i had seen that on thier website and called for verification on using it on a 4l60e. the man that i talked to was completely losted as to bein g able to provide me with an actual answer

**ICRAZY6** · 02-09-2010, 08:58 AM

I talked to a few of the tranny builders and they say that with a built unit that you can manually shift the tranny if you want without hurting it. With a stock tranny though I'm going to say the clutches and bands are to weak and result in your tranny failing.