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278mm circle d or ss3600?

This is a discussion on 278mm circle d or ss3600? within the Automatic Transmission forums, part of the Drivetrain category; Originally Posted by See Me In My GTP Sorry, Redbird, I just jumped on with an update and didn't notice ...

  1. #21
    Senior Member redbird555's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by See Me In My GTP View Post
    Sorry, Redbird, I just jumped on with an update and didn't notice the most recent discussion. With your investment into wheels, tires and a new motor I would say just wait until you have the $2-300 to get the better stall (whatever brand that may be). Unless installation is an issue down the road I think it would be worth it. You're obviously comparing two fairly different converters when you take into account stall, converter size and billet vs non, so it's not an issue of manufacturer since Circle D offers comparable stalls to the SS line.

    Any improvement in track times will depend on the 60' you were cutting to begin with. I guess it comes down to how badly you want those extra couple tenths/seat of the pants feel. I don't think there's much of an argument about which of those two will perform better, it's just a question of what you value most (i.e. performance, cost, reliability, mileage, etc.).

    I've probably typed too much already between these last two posts, so I'll shut up. Whatever you end up doing, I hope you enjoy it. That car should be fun with the LS6 in it!
    Lol not as much as a boosted ls6 would be though. Thats the thing I'm coming home for the summer and starting work tomorrow however I need to be back away at school in a few months so I dont have a whole lot of time to do it and doing it over the school year would pose a lot of issues with time. Plus if I can get it done with over the summer I'll be able to drive it around and make sure there arent any bugs in it. I think what I may end up doing ia accumulating the parts for the wheels and whatnot first and then see where I stand. Dont get me wrong i would like to do the bigger converter if I found a converter for a decent priced that didnt look to banged up I probably wouldnt have an issue with it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by redbird555 View Post
    ya I completely understand where your coming from if i was boosted or had a badass heads/cam upgrade a billet cover wouldnt even be a question. but as I stated above with all the other stuff I need to do a lot of things this summer plus school so I cant justify spending the 700 on a new yank or whatever the circle d 278 isnt a billet unit and should still net me some good gains im just hoping it will get rid of dead spots and take on m6's from a roll. I would go with a used 3600 but I'm just skeptical about them. do you need a lot of rpms to ove around with the 3600
    I'm already breaking my vow of silence from my previous post, haha. I can probably respond more accurately with a few more drives, but you definitely need more to get moving. To put it in perspective, the car won't move forward at idle off the brake on a slight incline. As far as acceleration, I would hazard a guess that it takes another 500rpms to get moving compared to the stock stall in pretty lethargic driving. The more throttle the snappier it gets. That's not to say it's terrible or 'a lot', but it's definitely 'more'.

    I'll try to get some daily driving videos up this weekend for you if that would be helpful and you're not in a rush to buy. If you had any specific throttle patterns you think would be enlightening let me know, otherwise I'll get some 'typical' lazy acceleration runs up.

  3. #23
    Senior Member redbird555's Avatar
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    ^^sounds great ya pretty much anything you can get accelerating normally with traffic, accelerating in lockup etc it would be much appreciated. Even though your boosted it shouldnt be that much different seeing as you wont be digging into boost with just normal driving what gears does the car have in case i missed it? I thought I had this thing licked but everyone keeps telling me to go right to the 3600 for a DD I hope theyre right hahah. If its as good as everyone says I may just go ahead and find a good used one and cross my fingers.

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    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Everyone is telling you to go right to a 3600 because these LS1's/LS6's like it. They really don't make much torque below that rpm, they zing better at 4,000 rpms and above.

    You probably wouldn't be happy with a 3200, especially behind a higher reving LS6 engine. I ran a 3400 stall, but it drove loose with a stock cam and 3.23 gears. Was about perfect for that car. No dead spots that I'm aware of. It would walk my wifes 6 speed car up to about 90 mph and my wifes car has a cam in it,,,,my auto was a bone stocker other than headers

    If I were running an LS6 like you are talking,,,,I'd go 3600 or possibly higher for that engine.

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    Senior Member redbird555's Avatar
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    damn I hate you all lol, I dont see too much of a drive ability difference between the ss3600 and a 3200 converter and even your fuddle was a 3400 and had a 2.1 str the ss3600 comes with a 2.5 str so that may help it a lot around town at least thats what I've heard. ONe other thing, if I do go with a 3600 is there anyway I can get it to hook from a roll other than with dr's lol idk that I feel comfortable driving around florida in the rain with a set of dr's on the back.
    Last edited by redbird555; 04-27-2011 at 05:07 AM.

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    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Mine hooked fine on stock rubber with a little practice.
    I ran a 1.90 60 foot time with it on stock tires and dipped into the 12's with just the converter and headers. Still on the bone stock suspension, I didn't even really try that hard. Sticky tires and a more aggressive launch would have gotten me 1.7x 60 foot times, but I was happy with the way the car was performing at that time.
    There are plenty of little suspension tricks that can be done however to make the car hook and transfer weight.
    I was running 1.8x 60 foot times in my 70 bird on stock F70-14 bias ply tires. Takes a little finess, some tweaks, and practice.

    Sure you can get out there and stab the throttle and go ditch hunting if you want to though

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    Quote Originally Posted by redbird555 View Post
    damn I hate you all lol, I dont see too much of a drive ability difference between the ss3600 and a 3200 converter and even your fuddle was a 3400 and had a 2.1 str the ss3600 comes with a 2.5 str so that may help it a lot around town at least thats what I've heard. ONe other thing, if I do go with a 3600 is there anyway I can get it to hook from a roll other than with dr's lol idk that I feel comfortable driving around florida in the rain with a set of dr's on the back.
    I'm running M/T ET Streets and there is virtually no tread on them. While it is only a nice weather car, I very recently got stuck in a pretty good downpour and as long as you don't drive like a maniac they actually work really well. If you were in a colder climate I would never encourage it, but don't let that be the reason you don't get them down in Florida. You may get some hydro-planing in standing water, but some rain is no problem.

    Actually, as I'm thinking about it, when I got the ET's put on last summer it rained as I was going to Firestone and the Nitto 555's on there were much scarier then the ET's on the way back home.

    Ultimately it's up to to you to decide if you NEED that kind of tire, and Firebird has some good points above. Suspension does go a long way towards getting better traction with the tire you have and making the car more predictable.

  8. #28
    Senior Member redbird555's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firebirdjones View Post
    Mine hooked fine on stock rubber with a little practice.
    I ran a 1.90 60 foot time with it on stock tires and dipped into the 12's with just the converter and headers. Still on the bone stock suspension, I didn't even really try that hard. Sticky tires and a more aggressive launch would have gotten me 1.7x 60 foot times, but I was happy with the way the car was performing at that time.
    There are plenty of little suspension tricks that can be done however to make the car hook and transfer weight.
    I was running 1.8x 60 foot times in my 70 bird on stock F70-14 bias ply tires. Takes a little finess, some tweaks, and practice.

    Sure you can get out there and stab the throttle and go ditch hunting if you want to though
    ^ Ya I'd rather not do that lol. Just a question but could you get traction nailing it from a roll or were the street tires useless from there. I realize you could baby it to get traction U 'm just wondering how it does from a roll. I do have relocation brackets however idk that they do much.
    Quote Originally Posted by See Me In My GTP View Post
    I'm running M/T ET Streets and there is virtually no tread on them. While it is only a nice weather car, I very recently got stuck in a pretty good downpour and as long as you don't drive like a maniac they actually work really well. If you were in a colder climate I would never encourage it, but don't let that be the reason you don't get them down in Florida. You may get some hydro-planing in standing water, but some rain is no problem.

    Actually, as I'm thinking about it, when I got the ET's put on last summer it rained as I was going to Firestone and the Nitto 555's on there were much scarier then the ET's on the way back home.

    Ultimately it's up to to you to decide if you NEED that kind of tire, and Firebird has some good points above. Suspension does go a long way towards getting better traction with the tire you have and making the car more predictable.
    The thing that turned me off or dr's is 1 they dont have a lot of mileage on them and I do a lot of driving so I dont have time or money to replace them every 8000 miles lol. The 22nd thing is that my buddy had a set of MT's on his car adn even though they were pretty bald you couldnt take the car over 40mph in the rain it would just hydroplane with no throttle at all. Btw still looking forward to the yank vids.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by redbird555 View Post
    ^ Ya I'd rather not do that lol. Just a question but could you get traction nailing it from a roll or were the street tires useless from there. I realize you could baby it to get traction U 'm just wondering how it does from a roll. I do have relocation brackets however idk that they do much.

    The thing that turned me off or dr's is 1 they dont have a lot of mileage on them and I do a lot of driving so I dont have time or money to replace them every 8000 miles lol. The 22nd thing is that my buddy had a set of MT's on his car adn even though they were pretty bald you couldnt take the car over 40mph in the rain it would just hydroplane with no throttle at all. Btw still looking forward to the yank vids.
    It was fine from a roll as long as I wasn't going slow enough for first gear. Say above 40 mph it would stay in second and go. 20-30 mph if I were to just stab it,,,then it would spin the tires, but first gear was so quick at that point that the tire spin was easily managable since I only had about another 10 mph of 1st gear left anyway.

    I run MT drag radials on my chevelle full time. It's a fair weather car only but I've been caught a couple of times in popup downpoors. I drove about 50 mph and took my time and never once did they ever give me the hint of hydroplane or any kind of trouble at all. It's not a tire that I would be interested in testing it's rain limits, so 50 was about it for me.

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    Senior Member redbird555's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firebirdjones View Post
    It was fine from a roll as long as I wasn't going slow enough for first gear. Say above 40 mph it would stay in second and go. 20-30 mph if I were to just stab it,,,then it would spin the tires, but first gear was so quick at that point that the tire spin was easily managable since I only had about another 10 mph of 1st gear left anyway.

    I run MT drag radials on my chevelle full time. It's a fair weather car only but I've been caught a couple of times in popup downpoors. I drove about 50 mph and took my time and never once did they ever give me the hint of hydroplane or any kind of trouble at all. It's not a tire that I would be interested in testing it's rain limits, so 50 was about it for me.
    Ya having drag radials is just not something I want to be concerned about considering its my dd. Originally I was going to do 18x10.5 deep dish c5 wheels in the back and 17x9.5 in front however if I'm going to do a stall I may shift to a 17x11 zr1 chrome wheel which is a little cheaper.... The tire options are better and cheaper which would help pay for the stall and the tires I'll need after the stall lol.

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    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by redbird555 View Post
    Ya having drag radials is just not something I want to be concerned about considering its my dd. Originally I was going to do 18x10.5 deep dish c5 wheels in the back and 17x9.5 in front however if I'm going to do a stall I may shift to a 17x11 zr1 chrome wheel which is a little cheaper.... The tire options are better and cheaper which would help pay for the stall and the tires I'll need after the stall lol.
    Don't blame ya, I wouldn't do drag radials on a daily car myself either. I don't like spending more money than I have to for tires either, with many cars in the fleet it gets rather pricey, so I prefer to stay with stock wheel sizes and more reasonably priced tires because of it. I still run 14" wheels on a couple of cars

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    Quote Originally Posted by redbird555 View Post
    ^ Ya I'd rather not do that lol. Just a question but could you get traction nailing it from a roll or were the street tires useless from there. I realize you could baby it to get traction U 'm just wondering how it does from a roll. I do have relocation brackets however idk that they do much.

    The thing that turned me off or dr's is 1 they dont have a lot of mileage on them and I do a lot of driving so I dont have time or money to replace them every 8000 miles lol. The 22nd thing is that my buddy had a set of MT's on his car adn even though they were pretty bald you couldnt take the car over 40mph in the rain it would just hydroplane with no throttle at all. Btw still looking forward to the yank vids.
    Alright, here you go. I apologize in advance, these are just some hand-held flip cam videos of the tach and speedo I took quickly yesterday before the weather turned. First time doing this kind of video so there were some lessons learned, but I think they'll still be helpful. Nice day today so if you wanted to see something else or some higher speed runs up to lockup I can do that as well - I just did a quick run through the neighborhood to get something up.

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5OXG7v7WuyI[/ame]

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJSacMqlfcc[/ame]

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=asYbykYJLwM[/ame]

    Not sure how to embed these just yet on here, so the links will have to do for now. If you're interested, I have a couple other startup videos for the blower under that same screen name (nyws6). I just use youtube to share larger files with friends out of state these days, but you're welcome to peruse if you'd like. I'll be getting some more exciting acceleration videos up once the transmission and TC are fully broken in. Shooting for 10.9's this summer, but realistically I think it will be very low 11's and I'm happy with that.

    On a random note, I replaced the rear sail panel speakers yesterday with some Bazookas from Kee Audio and they sound awesome for a direct factory replacement. Nothing ridiculous, just very tight, responsive bass back there now and the Monsoon EQ doesn't cause them to distort like the OEM units.
    Last edited by See Me In My GTP; 05-01-2011 at 07:41 AM.

  13. #33
    Senior Member redbird555's Avatar
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    vids look great it really looks like it drives well... are you making a lot of boost down low oh and btw in case i missed it what gears are you running

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    Quote Originally Posted by redbird555 View Post
    vids look great it really looks like it drives well... are you making a lot of boost down low oh and btw in case i missed it what gears are you running
    I'm running the factory 3.23 gears out back right now. The car is never in the boost at those RPMs - every bit of those videos the car was in vacuum. With the stall once you get on it the car will get right up into boost, but under normal driving conditions it behaves pretty much like normal.

    I hope that helps!

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