Question about Bosch 13111's

**jb3golf** · 02-11-2010, 02:47 PM

What up LS1's. Here's my question. Do I need to get a tune BEFORE I install the Bosch 13111's??? After the cam/LT/LS6 install my front O2's aren't warming up fast enough. I don't want to burn out these new pieces based on NOT having a tune. Suggestions???? Thanks in advance.

**jb3golf** · 02-11-2010, 02:48 PM

ORION where you at my brother????? I KNOW you have an applicable answer to my proposed question!!

**thearborbarber** · 02-11-2010, 03:33 PM

No tune is necessary. They are a direct replacement. The only difference is they have a substantially long wiring harness.

**0rion** · 02-11-2010, 04:22 PM

how far off is your tune? You actually should have them in prior to the tune so your fueling is accurate but I wouldn't drive around 6 months on a really rich tune before you had the car tuned.

**pajeff02** · 02-11-2010, 04:29 PM

I don't understand the "not warming up fast enough" as the O2 sensors have a heating element built into them. In addition, the engine does not kick over to closed loop and accept feedback from the sensors to control fueling until a certain coolant temperature is attained. Please explain...

**0rion** · 02-11-2010, 04:36 PM

Originally Posted by pajeff02

I don't understand the "not warming up fast enough" as the O2 sensors have a heating element built into them. In addition, the engine does not kick over to closed loop and accept feedback from the sensors to control fueling until a certain coolant temperature is attained. Please explain...

when you do longtubes you move the sensor further down the exhaust stream and they run cooler.....you'll start getting those heater codes usually. The internet rumor is that the 13111 sensors (which are the vette rears) have a better heater in them but I don't believe that and read years ago where someone contacted bosch and bosch said there was no difference. What I do believe is the harness is longer so you don't have to run extensions and that they do help with the heater/switching codes because I've experienced that first hand. True that the ect determines when you switch to closed loop but the sensors still have to operate in a certain heat range to be acccurate.

**pajeff02** · 02-11-2010, 04:38 PM

Originally Posted by 0rion

when you do longtubes you move the sensor further down the exhaust stream and they run cooler.....you'll start getting those heater codes usually. The internet rumor is that the 13111 sensors (which are the vette rears) have a better heater in them but I don't believe that and read years ago where someone contacted bosch and bosch said there was no difference. What I do believe is the harness is longer so you don't have to run extensions and that they do help with the heater/switching codes because I've experienced that first hand. True that the ect determines when you switch to closed loop but the sensors still have to operate in a certain heat range to be acccurate.

I learn something every day on this site.

**0rion** · 02-11-2010, 04:43 PM

the best thing we can do as a group is try these and other sensors and keep a good account of everyone's experiences with them. Me and firebirdjones both had the same heater codes and both switched to the 13111 sensors at the same time and neither has had any problems with them yet. We did that on purpose so we could keep track and see how they worked. I know some people haven't had as good a luck with them as we have but I see that with just about every brand of sensor. You have some guys that swear by denso's and some that have problems with them. We just have to keep a running tab of them.

**pajeff02** · 02-11-2010, 04:47 PM

If mine throw any codes I'll be sure to let you guys know.

**jb3golf** · 02-11-2010, 05:59 PM

Originally Posted by 0rion

how far off is your tune? You actually should have them in prior to the tune so your fueling is accurate but I wouldn't drive around 6 months on a really rich tune before you had the car tuned.

Thanks for the reply ORION! My tune is about 2-3 weeks away so not THAT long. So you think putting them in this weekend will be fine???

**jb3golf** · 02-11-2010, 06:00 PM

Originally Posted by 0rion

the best thing we can do as a group is try these and other sensors and keep a good account of everyone's experiences with them. Me and firebirdjones both had the same heater codes and both switched to the 13111 sensors at the same time and neither has had any problems with them yet. We did that on purpose so we could keep track and see how they worked. I know some people haven't had as good a luck with them as we have but I see that with just about every brand of sensor. You have some guys that swear by denso's and some that have problems with them. We just have to keep a running tab of them.

+1.....

**jb3golf** · 02-11-2010, 06:01 PM

Originally Posted by pajeff02

If mine throw any codes I'll be sure to let you guys know.

So.....I'm assuming you just put in 13111's??

**pajeff02** · 02-11-2010, 06:02 PM

Originally Posted by jb3golf

So.....I'm assuming you just put in 13111's??

**jb3golf** · 02-11-2010, 06:05 PM

Originally Posted by pajeff02

Did you get a tune BEFORE or AFTER you installed these? AND......How long have they been in??

**pajeff02** · 02-11-2010, 06:09 PM

Originally Posted by jb3golf

Did you get a tune BEFORE or AFTER you installed these? AND......How long have they been in??

I sent my PCM to Frost for a mail order tune and it came back yesterday. The O2's were installed a few days ago and have not yet been run. They were recommended to me by Frost and others in this thread: http://www.ls1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=130418

-----------------------------------------------------------

I misspoke -- I discussed them with Frost via a PM.

**JoshuaGrooms83** · 02-13-2010, 05:09 PM

Originally Posted by 0rion

the best thing we can do as a group is try these and other sensors and keep a good account of everyone's experiences with them. Me and firebirdjones both had the same heater codes and both switched to the 13111 sensors at the same time and neither has had any problems with them yet. We did that on purpose so we could keep track and see how they worked. I know some people haven't had as good a luck with them as we have but I see that with just about every brand of sensor. You have some guys that swear by denso's and some that have problems with them. We just have to keep a running tab of them.

Ill definatly put my 2 cents in on this one. I just got the bosch 13111's. About to do an install with mine. Doing a LT and ORY install soon.

**jb3golf** · 02-13-2010, 05:20 PM

Yeah, I just installed my Bosch 13111's yesterday, cleared my DTC's and haven't had the O2 sensor codes come back on yet after about 3 cycles of driving. I also have recently done Ory, Cam, LS6 Intake & LT's so I'll let you know how this works out.

**jb3golf** · 02-13-2010, 06:20 PM

Additionally LS1's; HOW BIG of a DIFFERENCE does a TUNE make after installing cam, heads, LT's, Intake etc..?????? In terms of driveability???

**0rion** · 02-13-2010, 06:23 PM

after heads/cam??? All the difference in the world. Will your car even run? What size was your cam again....I forget.

**jb3golf** · 02-13-2010, 06:54 PM

Originally Posted by 0rion

after heads/cam??? All the difference in the world. Will your car even run? What size was your cam again....I forget.

I had my stock heads cleaned up w/new 918 springs, chromoly retainers & 224R TSP cam on 114LSA. My car runs fairly well now after this install BUT it isn't smooth and has rough spots throughout the RPM.......thoughts??