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Ls6 intake to FAST 102

This is a discussion on Ls6 intake to FAST 102 within the External Engine forums, part of the LSx Technical Help Section category; How much can be gained by swapping the factory LS6 intake and throttle body to the FAST 102 set-up. Is ...

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    Member importhater81's Avatar
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    Ls6 intake to FAST 102

    How much can be gained by swapping the factory LS6 intake and throttle body to the FAST 102 set-up. Is it worth it? My mods are in my sig
    02 SS Camaro, Stock 346ci,Ms4 cam,Stage 1 Ls6 ported PRC heads,OBX LT's with ORY,SLP loudmouth exhaust,4000 stalled a4 with a 4.10 gear.
    Dyno tuned..406.7 rwhp 393.53 rwtq.
    11.85e.t. at 116mph in the 1/4 mi.

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    why dont you go fast 102 intake and a nick williams 102 throttle body

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    Member importhater81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by t5munoz View Post
    why dont you go fast 102 intake and a nick williams 102 throttle body
    O.K....That doesn't answer my questions,but thanks for the advice.

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    To be honest I dont know the gains that you willl gain are you going to port the intake??

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    Member importhater81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by t5munoz View Post
    To be honest I dont know the gains that you willl gain are you going to port the intake??
    If I decide to go the fast 102 route, maybe.

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    Member headpecker's Avatar
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    I'd be surprised if you gained much at all,especially given the cost of those intakes! From my understanding,unless you're making well over 550hp,an LS-6 is just fine. Just my 2 cents,based on hanging out at my buddies dyno shop and seeing alot of wasted money,and disappointed faces!!

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    Member importhater81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by headpecker View Post
    I'd be surprised if you gained much at all,especially given the cost of those intakes! From my understanding,unless you're making well over 550hp,an LS-6 is just fine. Just my 2 cents,based on hanging out at my buddies dyno shop and seeing alot of wasted money,and disappointed faces!!
    That's the kind of input I'm looking for...first hand experience with the two intakes. More so going with the FAST over the Ls6,and justifying the price of the FAST.

    Thanks.

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    Member headpecker's Avatar
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    Its cool hanging out in a dyno shop and seeing all these Monkey-see Monkey-do guys come in and see how they wasted alot of money on stuff that either doesnt work,or is all wrong for their performance goals.Its fairly often the case! All I'm saying is do your homework,and consider where you get your info before you lay out the cabbage!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by headpecker View Post
    Its cool hanging out in a dyno shop and seeing all these Monkey-see Monkey-do guys come in and see how they wasted alot of money on stuff that either doesnt work,or is all wrong for their performance goals.Its fairly often the case! All I'm saying is do your homework,and consider where you get your info before you lay out the cabbage!!
    Well thats cool and all but if the heads are flowed and your intake is flowed then your not wasting money!!!

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    Member importhater81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by headpecker View Post
    Its cool hanging out in a dyno shop and seeing all these Monkey-see Monkey-do guys come in and see how they wasted alot of money on stuff that either doesnt work,or is all wrong for their performance goals.Its fairly often the case! All I'm saying is do your homework,and consider where you get your info before you lay out the cabbage!!
    Been doing the homework. From what I've gathered, a fast 102 is a complete waste of money on a bolt on car...which mine is not....It's a H/C car with bolt ons. Just trying to figure out if a better flowing intake and throttle body would bring out the full potential of my current set-up.

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    Telling you if you want to see results and see if your going to gain anything shoot Tony Mamo a email and listen to what he has to say...

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    Join the PHK @ thephk.org Sommer86@6LE's Avatar
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    I just sold my other 102 (i had 2 of them) to a guy who's putting it on his 346 (we'll call him Tom). Tom also contacted Tony Mamo about porting it. The result was that you dont need a ported 102 on a 346, as you dont need anymore flow, but the design is so much better that you only benefit from it. Tom, The guy who bought the intake is going to lose some bottom end (maybe 10hp) but gain about 20 in the top end.

    On a stock cubed motor, you wont need a ported 102 unless you're doing a radical build and have great flowing heads. (ex: AFR 215/230's or TF 225's). "Tom" is planning on doing some AFR's so he might be able to justify it, but in the end the a 102 is fine, beside the low end loss.

    I'm running a "Mamofied" 102/102 combo on my new 402 build. with AFR 230v.2'2
    Last edited by Sommer86@6LE; 02-27-2011 at 01:12 AM.

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    most people hating on the 102 are people that 1. are running them with 90mm tbs..and going from a fast 92 to a 102..and they gain maybe 6 unported..but you notice a much better curve and a good deal of gain under the curve

    there is no questions you should do it. but you will need to make sure your air tract is up to the task..pushing air to a 102 through a 72mm tract isnt ideal

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    Yea Tony is building me some 205s and im getting a fast 102 mamofied from him also!!!

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    Join the PHK @ thephk.org Sommer86@6LE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shady milkman View Post
    most people hating on the 102 are people that 1. Are running them with 90mm tbs..and going from a fast 92 to a 102..and they gain maybe 6 unported..but you notice a much better curve and a good deal of gain under the curve

    there is no questions you should do it. But you will need to make sure your air tract is up to the task..pushing air to a 102 through a 72mm tract isnt ideal
    ^^ this!

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    Join the PHK @ thephk.org Sommer86@6LE's Avatar
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    From another site:


    Quote Originally Posted by Tony Mamo @ AFR View Post
    OK...this thread is pretty funny talking about nothing....LOL

    Guys...

    When we are discussing fuel injected applications.....the size of the plenum and the opening or the TB (size) will have zero effect on "low end" power.

    This is old school thinking stemming from the very real and often practiced applications where too large a carb might have been bolted on a particular engine combination.

    The problem stemming from the fact the large carb slowed the airspeed down enough in the venturi's of the main body to negatively effect the carb atomization and therefore hurt power, torque, fuel economy, and responsiveness until enough RPM was generated to allow the carb to become more effective again (guys older than 45 will be nodding their heads up and down right now while reading this!).

    We aren't atomizing fuel here folks....thats handled by the injectors and the real meat and potatoes of manifold design (runner length, shape, and taper) hasn't changed much from the 90, 92 or 102.....its very similar but the 102 does have a superior shaped runner (although the length is very similar), is slightly taller, and ultimately flows more, especially when properly ported.

    Yes....a FAST 102 can flow more than a 280 CFM head but thats always the case with a really good intake....ideally you want ALOT of headroom when selecting a manifold so when you bolt it in front of your heads it flows more net to the cylinder with the ultimate situation to not hurt the port any more than placing a radius plate in front of it. Thats pure theory unless we are discussing extremely optimized straight shot tunnel ram style manifolds.

    I can port a Gen I single plane intake and make it flow 400 CFM.....when you place it in front of a 300 CFM intake port that port still loses 20 CFM which is very good all thing considered. Take the same intake unported by me that still flows way more out of the box than the 300 CFM intake port in question (say the intake flows 360 CFM out of the box) and now you may only see 265 CFM when placed in front of the head because it hurt the net flow more.

    INTERNET MYTH #1 .....My 102 Fast is too big for my 346

    Wrong....its a better designed intake thats going to allow more air to pass thru the intake ports and be mixed with more precisely atomized fuel from your injectors.

    INTERNET MYTH #2....Its already big....you dont need to port it (or it might hurt the bottom end).

    Also wrong....at least when ported properly. Once again it simply makes a good piece even better but I would be the first to admit that on a marginal set of head the gains from the work would be less as well. The better the heads, the more aggressive the RPM, displacement, etc. the more that ported 102 is going to pay you in spades.

    The larger the restriction the intake manifold becomes....the better your results will be when you swap to the better intake.

    If your still questioning anything lets get it handled now and please refer other people back to the answers when we see the same questions and bad information in other threads....I wish I had a nickel for the guys convinced their inaccurate theories are accurate....LOL

    The ONLY potential negative to the 102 design...well besides the cost of admission with the rails etc.....is the TB (airblade) is so large it can create drivability challanges with the tune but its a much easier deal on a cable operated 102 with an IAC motor. ALso, it tends to be extremely responsive which I personally like, however some have complained its too responsive (on/off) and they have to get used to driving it. No big deal in my book....

    Hope this helps!

    -Tony

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    King 0f n00bz shady milkman's Avatar
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    tony is the man ...what is funny..is i bet in that thread there are some old school or even new school noobs still arguing against him

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    Quote Originally Posted by shady milkman View Post
    tony is the man ...what is funny..is i bet in that thread there are some old school or even new school noobs still arguing against him
    Lol yea he is the man lol and your right i see alot of threads were they still argue with the man lol.. Thats why what ever he suggests on my build i listen and buy what ever it takes to get me to where i want to be!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sommer86@6LE View Post
    From another site:
    The problem stemming from the fact the large carb slowed the airspeed down enough in the venturi's of the main body to negatively effect the carb atomization and therefore hurt power, torque, fuel economy, and responsiveness until enough RPM was generated to allow the carb to become more effective again (guys older than 45 will be nodding their heads up and down right now while reading this!).


    Damn, guilty as charged in the bold!

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    Member importhater81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shady milkman View Post
    most people hating on the 102 are people that 1. are running them with 90mm tbs..and going from a fast 92 to a 102..and they gain maybe 6 unported..but you notice a much better curve and a good deal of gain under the curve

    there is no questions you should do it. but you will need to make sure your air tract is up to the task..pushing air to a 102 through a 72mm tract isnt ideal
    Wouldn't even think of running a 72 tb.....wouldn't that be defeating the purpose of upgrading the intake to a 102?

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