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160 Thermostat CONTROVERSY!!

This is a discussion on 160 Thermostat CONTROVERSY!! within the External Engine forums, part of the LSx Technical Help Section category; Originally Posted by starbuck My roommate is swapping his 160 for a 180 right now for exactly that reason. It ...

  1. #21
    Grand Imperial Wizard Sarge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by starbuck View Post
    My roommate is swapping his 160 for a 180 right now for exactly that reason. It is preventing his 98 Z28 from going into closed loop, and we're in Florida.
    OK....I didnt read all the post after this....but allow me please
    Bullshit. I have dropped 160 stats in every LSX I have worked on for many years.....allow a few facts with no internet bullshit....
    1. Car goes into closed loop at around 115f-125f....
    2. 160 Stat opens around 170ish....
    3. Allowing your Stat to open up at 170ish allows for more consistent tuning/temps than a stock stat as it has a few less degrees to cool the block to optimum operating temps.
    What that last statement means is when you have a stock stat the block temps get up to 190-200 and then your cooling system ( coolant/water pump/fans) have to bust that ass to get them back down to 180-190. All a 160 Stat does is allows this cooling process to kick in earlier thus allowing for a less dramatic cooling requirement. Keeping you in the optimum temps ( 180-190) with much less stress on your cooling system. If I repeated something I apologize.....

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    Member Z28collection's Avatar
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    ive had a 160 and hypertech programmer for the fans in my 99 z28 for 3 years now and never had any problems. i live in the hot steamy southeast.

  3. #23
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    you should actually be able to take the thermostat out and look at it, it should have a reading in Celsius. of course convert it to F then there you go! mine was a 71 C which is 160 in F.

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    Moderator Firebirdjones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sarge View Post
    OK....I didnt read all the post after this....but allow me please
    Bullshit. I have dropped 160 stats in every LSX I have worked on for many years.....allow a few facts with no internet bullshit....
    1. Car goes into closed loop at around 115f-125f....
    2. 160 Stat opens around 170ish....
    3. Allowing your Stat to open up at 170ish allows for more consistent tuning/temps than a stock stat as it has a few less degrees to cool the block to optimum operating temps.
    What that last statement means is when you have a stock stat the block temps get up to 190-200 and then your cooling system ( coolant/water pump/fans) have to bust that ass to get them back down to 180-190. All a 160 Stat does is allows this cooling process to kick in earlier thus allowing for a less dramatic cooling requirement. Keeping you in the optimum temps ( 180-190) with much less stress on your cooling system. If I repeated something I apologize.....

    Thats pretty much what I explained in an earlier post....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark8fish View Post
    I know that if you remove the thermostat completely it is real bad because the coolant doesn't have time to sit in the radiator and cool down.
    As I mentioned in another thread, this is a myth that is completely false. The thermostat acts as a restriction that RAISES PRESSURE in the coolant jackets. This increases the coolant's boiling point and greatly decreases the amount of coolant boiling off into steam all over the combustion chamber surfaces, thus insulating them from further heat transfer and causing hot spots. It has nothing to do the rate of coolant flow. The coolant can flow at a million gallons per second and it will only help, not hurt, heat transfer.

    That having been said, 160* thermostats are a bad idea for a number of other reasons, not the least of which is causing the computer to stay in open loop, along with increased engine wear. I would recommend at least an 180* thermostat.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shiftless View Post
    ............. 160* thermostats are a bad idea for a number of other reasons, not the least of which is causing the computer to stay in open loop, along with increased engine wear. I would recommend at least an 180* thermostat.

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    Grand Imperial Wizard Sarge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shiftless View Post
    As I mentioned in another thread, this is a myth that is completely false. The thermostat acts as a restriction that RAISES PRESSURE in the coolant jackets. This increases the coolant's boiling point and greatly decreases the amount of coolant boiling off into steam all over the combustion chamber surfaces, thus insulating them from further heat transfer and causing hot spots. It has nothing to do the rate of coolant flow. The coolant can flow at a million gallons per second and it will only help, not hurt, heat transfer.

    That having been said, 160* thermostats are a bad idea for a number of other reasons, not the least of which is causing the computer to stay in open loop, along with increased engine wear. I would recommend at least an 180* thermostat.
    I dont know what LSX motors you work on but I have never, EVER, seen one not go into closed loop after 120f....

  8. #28
    TunedbyFrost.com Tuner Frost's Avatar
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    Hey guys, just to clear this up for you all.... unless the outside temperature is BELOW ZERO, your car can settle into closed loop anywhere above 92degF so long as some other conditions are met. Yep, that's 92degF is the lower limit, though it's more common to see them actually switch over at 100-120 depending on the current conditions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sarge View Post
    OK....I didnt read all the post after this....but allow me please
    Bullshit.
    You can bullshit all you want, but that's the fact of the matter. Seems most people have decent luck with 160's, but also seems some don't have such good luck with them. His car was not entering closed loop with the 160, this was confirmed with a scanner.
    I ran one in both of my old thirdgens, and other than having a lukewarm at best heater in the winter, mine did fine. I eventually ditched the 160 for a 180 though, as I got tired of freezing my ass off in the winter.
    I'm glad you're happy with your 160. Mine's running great with a 180

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by starbuck View Post
    You can bullshit all you want, but that's the fact of the matter. Seems most people have decent luck with 160's, but also seems some don't have such good luck with them. His car was not entering closed loop with the 160, this was confirmed with a scanner.
    I ran one in both of my old thirdgens, and other than having a lukewarm at best heater in the winter, mine did fine. I eventually ditched the 160 for a 180 though, as I got tired of freezing my ass off in the winter.
    I'm glad you're happy with your 160. Mine's running great with a 180
    Tired of freezing in winter living in Florida???? You should have had plenty of heat unless you're a reptile,,,lol. It gets below zero in the winter up here, and we have ran 160's in everything we own for the last 30 years, even my wife and son have never complained about heat

    As far as closed loop, as Sarge and Frost have already mentioned,,,a 160 won't affect it. I had one in my L98 3rd gen, currently have one in my wifes LT1 and in my LS1,,,,they all go closed loop no problem, even in winter time... I can't speak for other products other than GM of course,,,But that goes without saying..this is after all an LSx site.

    But common be honest,,,,are you really cold down there in Florida???

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sarge View Post
    I dont know what LSX motors you work on but I have never, EVER, seen one not go into closed loop after 120f....
    I agree with you 100%. I have no idea where these guys are getting this information from?

    Quote Originally Posted by starbuck View Post
    You can bullshit all you want, but that's the fact of the matter. Seems most people have decent luck with 160's, but also seems some don't have such good luck with them. His car was not entering closed loop with the 160, this was confirmed with a scanner.
    I ran one in both of my old thirdgens, and other than having a lukewarm at best heater in the winter, mine did fine. I eventually ditched the 160 for a 180 though, as I got tired of freezing my ass off in the winter.
    I'm glad you're happy with your 160. Mine's running great with a 180
    Okay, time to put your $$$ where your mouth is. Show some proof of what you claim. My proof is i've ran 160's in all 8 4th gen's ive owned, with nothing implicating what you claim in your statement. I would like to see proof from anyone who claim's 160 stats are harmful. I think it's nothing more than speculation - Period.

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    TunedbyFrost.com Tuner Frost's Avatar
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    I can post screen shots of butt-loads of logs that show CL WELL BELOW 140degF.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wesman View Post
    Go with a 180. They are best for our cars. The stock 195 is a little too hot, and 160 is way too cool. On a cold day, a 160 t-stat will prevent the engine from going into closed loop operation, since it enters closed loop at 165 degrees. That negatively impacts fuel economy, emissions, and it can set a code.
    have you ever looked at a PCM file? you aren't even close. closed loop is determined by IAT and coolant temp.


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    Senior Member mrr23's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by starbuck View Post
    You can bullshit all you want, but that's the fact of the matter. Seems most people have decent luck with 160's, but also seems some don't have such good luck with them. His car was not entering closed loop with the 160, this was confirmed with a scanner.
    the tstat is not the reason why it's not going into closed loop.

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    What does it mean when it is in closed or open loop? And what is opperating in open or closed loop?

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    Quote Originally Posted by 9t8z28 View Post
    What does it mean when it is in closed or open loop? And what is opperating in open or closed loop?
    open loop - PCM is not using the o2s to make fuel adjustments while running. it only goes by the VE table.

    closed loop - uses the o2s to make fuel adjustments while running.

    that's the basics of it.

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    any other controversy??

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    Between Sarge and N20LT4 and MRR23 and last but not least Frost, I would take their advice, they know more then you and I put together. I have ran a 160 since the day I bought mine back in 01. I have been to GA, Florida, New Jersey, and my good old crap state WI and never had a problem. It's not the thermo, its something else wrong.
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    Question for the OP, with the 160 installed what is the temp you are running?

    You should be able to re-program the fans to keep the motor in the 185-195 area quite easily.

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    Quote Originally Posted by vettenuts View Post
    Question for the OP, with the 160 installed what is the temp you are running?

    You should be able to re-program the fans to keep the motor in the 185-195 area quite easily.
    My car runs at about a 170-175* continuously.

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