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How much RWHP will I make..

This is a discussion on How much RWHP will I make.. within the Corvette forums, part of the Vehicle Specific category; Originally Posted by tom bogdanich hi I have basically the same cam too except I am at .561/.561 but at ...

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by tom bogdanich View Post
    hi I have basically the same cam too except I am at .561/.561 but at 114 LSA---I have Stock mildly "Cleaned up " LS6 heads---I changed only the cam (from stock 98 vette) and gained 27 RWHP on an A4--I was rather disappointed and if I had to do it over--I would go BIGGER---Chose this cam to pass the smog police in Calif--It passed fairly easy--so I am thinking something like a 228 to 229 around 113LSA if they make it woud pass smog--and maybe net me 35 to 40 RWHP instead of 27---The Head work you are having done is the unknown here--If you gain some compression you will gain some HP---unsure about angle milling results on a LS1--
    I'm leaning toward a set of Patroit heads that will pass Cali smog test.
    This is what Patroit advised me to get.
    This a couple of hundred dollars more than it would be to have the heads ported and reworked.

    "They will pass smog because they will be a factory casting with oem casting numbers. These heads will have 2.02"/1.57" Ferrea Stainless valves, 66cc chambers, Patriot Gold dual springs, ti retainers, all the good stuff. These are available for $995.00 per pair."

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    I think those are a great choice--i am a fan of the patriot hds--My LS6 heads are in the same price range have a bit more compression--but the pats have better flow #'s--- I refuse to pay $2500 for hds that flow the same but only have better parts in them---the cam will flow so much better with good flowing heads- did the same--went with the LS6 to make the smog police happy---

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    Quote Originally Posted by tom bogdanich View Post
    I think those are a great choice--i am a fan of the patriot hds--My LS6 heads are in the same price range have a bit more compression--but the pats have better flow #'s--- I refuse to pay $2500 for hds that flow the same but only have better parts in them---the cam will flow so much better with good flowing heads- did the same--went with the LS6 to make the smog police happy---
    Thanks for that valuble information and letting me know I'm making the right choices the SECOND time around. Glad to know the cam will work very well with that flow of the Patriots, waiting to hear from the installer/tuner should I have them milled. Not only does HP cost money, but mistakes cost more. I think this time with the right parts, I'll be happy and content with 400+ RWHP.
    Correct on the comment of spending the big $$ for other heads when the Patriots are just as good.
    BTW this site LS1.com has better input on some matters than CF. IMHO
    Last edited by Deneau Valteau; 12-26-2006 at 09:54 PM.

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    Yes I agree I like this site too--About the only forum where i met some really rude know-it all people who I just loved to hate was on LS1Tech.com---every opinion is hammered--there are some regulars that are so full of themselves they need to get a life--so I quit visiting over there---You'll find that when it comes to tuning there are several ways to do the same thing---so there in lies the controversy-hovever some stuff is just common sense--they try to make this rocket science when i'ts not----I don't claim to be an expert but I am a retired racer with over 1000 passes under my belt -and have tuned over 200 of these computer cars---I adhere to the KISS system--keep it simple stupid !!!! and it really makes life easier---
    Glad to help out in any way---I'm sure you 'll be helping me someday--Tom

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    Quote Originally Posted by tom bogdanich View Post
    Yes I agree I like this site too--About the only forum where i met some really rude know-it all people who I just loved to hate was on LS1Tech.com---every opinion is hammered--there are some regulars that are so full of themselves they need to get a life--so I quit visiting over there---You'll find that when it comes to tuning there are several ways to do the same thing---so there in lies the controversy-hovever some stuff is just common sense--they try to make this rocket science when i'ts not----I don't claim to be an expert but I am a retired racer with over 1000 passes under my belt -and have tuned over 200 of these computer cars---I adhere to the KISS system--keep it simple stupid !!!! and it really makes life easier---
    Glad to help out in any way---I'm sure you 'll be helping me someday--Tom
    Damn..you hit the nail on the head. Some people over there have been a great help and I have a lot of threads and post on it. It's great to get advice from an expert like you.. with that many passes under your belt.
    You are an asset to us all.
    Thanks Tom,
    Deno
    Last edited by Deneau Valteau; 12-27-2006 at 05:30 PM.

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    Senior Member Z06-Goose's Avatar
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    I'd say 390ish. You already have the LS6 heads. I don't think that porting them, and going with that cam -albeit mild, and good power- that you're going to get over 41-50hp to put you over the 400hp mark. It'll be close, and perhaps with a great tuner you could be over 400 at the wheels. Tough call. I'm with your mechanic. I wouldn't want to make a call on this one here either
    Best of luck, and let us know how it comes out
    Goose
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    Quote Originally Posted by Z06-Goose View Post
    I'd say 390ish. You already have the LS6 heads. I don't think that porting them, and going with that cam -albeit mild, and good power- that you're going to get over 41-50hp to put you over the 400hp mark. It'll be close, and perhaps with a great tuner you could be over 400 at the wheels. Tough call. I'm with your mechanic. I wouldn't want to make a call on this one here either
    Best of luck, and let us know how it comes out
    Goose
    I'm leaning towards getting a set of Patriot heads with a slight mill. Waiting for the word from the installer if this would be a good move or just have the LS6 heads worked up. There are "great" tuners in my area one has inflated dyno numbers and the other two are pretty much close in their tunes. My goal is 400 rwhp.

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    I have pretty much the same set up as you will end up with--I am in Calif so i chose a .221 cam @ 114 lsa--My opinion is that if you are not in Calif or a state with Smog police then i would deff. go bigger on the cam--especially if you are trying to reach the holy grail of 400 RWHP---I didn't quite make it-and ended up at 388 RWHP. It made it thru smog OK so it was as big as i could have gone--maybe a bit bigger 224 would have passed also--If I was not in a smog controlled state--I would go with about a 226-229 @114 or 112 to reach 400 RWHP--I would guess you will be around 380-390.

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    I feel sorry for you CA guys. Here in GA they hook up to the data link connector and test the gas cap and that's about it. I only had one year when I had a dying battery that I had problems and had to go back about four times before I had the driving cycle completed and ready for testing. About the heads, my tuner
    Vengeance Racing, tell me that they are getting the best performance out of TrickFlow and if I change my heads (again) that's what I should go with. I was thinking about AFR's, but they're not as good. I should point out that TrickFlows are almost twice the price of Patriots and about the same as Edelbrock and AFR, BUT if you're paying somebody to do the work it's cheaper in the long run to do the best you can from the start and try to combine things that will save you money. (ie. I recently replaced my tranny AND torque converter).

    As to your cam choice, you're basically increasing your lift by .013(.555-.568)
    and changing from a dual pattern to a single pattern. Cams have been referred to as "a give and take component", because aggressive cams make more power, but move the power peak higher in the rpm range. There is a point where all top-end gains are made at the expense of low-end output, resulting in a loss of driveability and fuel economy. In order for a larger cam to make more power, the heads have to be able to support the added airflow. Basically it doesn't matter how long the valves stay open if the heads can't supply enough air. Think of your engine as an air pump! To get a 'Second Opinion', you should go to Comp Cams http://compcams.com/ and fill out their 'Recommendation Form'.
    Michael
    In GA waving from '02 C5 LS1, Z51, D1SC, 60lb injectors,RPM level 5-4L60E, 3:42, Yank 3600, QA1-12 ways, MTI long headers, high flow cats, Borlas, Wilwood, 603rwhp, 542rwtq.(DynoJet 248-C) 10.89@127.57 on street tires, Race Weight 3,640 lbs

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    The 224/224 567/567 lift on a LSA 114 is installed and the car feels great. It pulls hard.
    Waiting for the Patriot heads milled 62cc chamber and Cadillac Race lifters to come in to have them installed. After the install I'll have a dyno re-tune and hope the numbers are in the 400 RWHP range.
    Here is a sound chip of the cam.
    Last edited by Deneau Valteau; 01-28-2007 at 09:46 PM.

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    Junior Member MRWHOOPPEE's Avatar
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    don't use a low temp t-stat

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    just curious as to why you don't like a low-temp t-stat--

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    Quote Originally Posted by tblu92 View Post
    just curious as to why you don't like a low-temp t-stat--
    I believe he is recommending not so low a t-stat is because the LS1 puts down more HP with a hotter running engine I've been told.
    The 170* stat still lets my engine oil reach 190* + oil temp.

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    I have a 160* t-stat as well and my oil temps are between 190 and 220 all the time and I have my fans set to come on later at 180 and thr 2nd one at 201---so it runs about 180-190 average---from what i've read the only reason to have it way up there at 220 is because of emmisions--GM seems to think that it runs cleaner when it is in that 220 range.---as far as performance goes-i would think the ideal temp would be around 180-190---which can be done better with a 160* t-stat and fan re-setting

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    Thanks for the update. Keep us posted on the new dyno numbers!

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    Quote Originally Posted by tblu92 View Post
    I have pretty much the same set up as you will end up with--I am in Calif so i chose a .221 cam @ 114 lsa--My opinion is that if you are not in Calif or a state with Smog police then i would deff. go bigger on the cam--especially if you are trying to reach the holy grail of 400 RWHP---I didn't quite make it-and ended up at 388 RWHP. It made it thru smog OK so it was as big as i could have gone--maybe a bit bigger 224 would have passed also--If I was not in a smog controlled state--I would go with about a 226-229 @114 or 112 to reach 400 RWHP--I would guess you will be around 380-390.
    Was told that the 224/224 would pass the sniffer, anything larger is taking a chance.

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    Was told that the 224/224 would pass the sniffer, anything larger is taking a chance.
    that is pretty true.

    i passed with my 222/224 .566/.568 114, made 400rwhp 375rwtq, and my smog guy said i could have gone a little bigger!
    that was with home ported LS1 heads , 10.6:1 CR, LS6 intake, LT's.
    Last edited by M6HUGGERSS; 10-23-2007 at 05:59 AM.
    315rwhp 98 SILVER Z28 (3500lbs)- SOLD
    400rwhp 99 HUGGER SS (3375lbs)- SOLD
    340rwhp 02 YELLOW Z06 (3040lbs)

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    Quote Originally Posted by M6HUGGERSS View Post
    that is pretty true.

    i passed with my 222/224 .566/.568 114, made 400rwhp 375rwtq, and my smog guy said i could have gone a little bigger!
    that was with home ported LS1 heads , 10.6:1 CR, LS6 intake, LT's.
    Well there is a chance I'll put down 400+ RWHP. I'm running the A4.
    I got my heads yesterday and now waiting for the Caddy Race lifters to come in so we can swap the heads. Take it down for the tune and numbers.
    Thanks for your input.
    Deno

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