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When to change to Synthetic Oil?

This is a discussion on When to change to Synthetic Oil? within the General Help forums, part of the LSx Technical Help Section category; German Castrol Syntec 0w-30 owns all (if you can find it)....

  1. #21
    Member SSpdDmon's Avatar
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    German Castrol Syntec 0w-30 owns all (if you can find it).

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    Quote Originally Posted by MegaMan View Post
    Interesting. Are you saying that a good conventional oil, changed at the proper intervals, will be just as "healthy" for a car as a good full synthetic?
    Absolutely YES. That is exactly what I am saying.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SSpdDmon View Post
    German Castrol Syntec 0w-30 owns all (if you can find it).
    Good oil....but isn't delivering any better or worse UOA's than Shaeffers/Pennzoil Platinum or RedLine...and now I'll twist your nose as you made a definitive statement.....I have seen and there is documentation on the oil guy website UOA section that clearly shows Castrol GTX and Pennzoil regular ol yellow bottle with better wear metal results that the same OCI utilizing Castrol German 0-30.....how's them apples?I sold 80 something quarts of that stuff recently as it was taking up too much shelf space Good oil though...but no "best" by any stretch of the imagination.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stricken1 View Post
    Yeah thats what I heard until I used PP last time...let me tell you the crap came outta my car like black syrup.....M1 has never ever looked that bad. I change my oil every 3k using syn oil I will never use PP again! Oh and I work for Pennzoil if that aint a statement I dont know what is.
    Well I hate to tell you this but Pennzoil Platinum was doing its job and cleaning all the shit out of your engine that Mobil1 left behind pal. If I drained out an oil and it wasn't "dirty"....that would bother the shit out of me as that oil didn't keep the carbon and dirt in suspension but allowed it to collect on my moving parts.....your statement is a slam on Mobil1....and an endorsement of Pennzoil Platinum....and as for the color statement...the color of any oil has absolutely nothing to do with the condition of the oil. Many chemistries in todays oil will turn the oil various colors or shades of darker when in contact with op engine temps and that has absolutely nothing to do with the health or lubricity of the oil. You may have a TBN of over 5-7 left and the oil is blacker than Wesley Snipes pecker....means absolutely NOTHING. If you work for Pennzoil you must be loading trucks cuz you rather lacking in basic oil knowledge friend. Have you had a UOA done on any of the oils you have ran in your car?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sarge View Post
    Good oil....but isn't delivering any better or worse UOA's than Shaeffers/Pennzoil Platinum or RedLine...and now I'll twist your nose as you made a definitive statement.....I have seen and there is documentation on the oil guy website UOA section that clearly shows Castrol GTX and Pennzoil regular ol yellow bottle with better wear metal results that the same OCI utilizing Castrol German 0-30.....how's them apples?I sold 80 something quarts of that stuff recently as it was taking up too much shelf space Good oil though...but no "best" by any stretch of the imagination.
    Were the comparitive wear results done on the same motor back-to-back? What was the delta between the two in terms of wear? How long were they run?

    As for my statement, I should have been a little more clear. "When talking true synthetics, GC owns all."

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    Quote Originally Posted by suede View Post
    I talked to the mechanic who works on every kind of car about oils one day and the synthetic came up. His take on it was synthetics are better for the change interval and better viscosity. He also said the one he recomended was mobil one and his least recomended was penzoil. I trust his word, he rebuilds engines for the local racecars and for anyone else too and has seen the results of each
    Lemme try and translate this for my own sake....."synthetics are better for the change interval"....WTF are you trying to say? Maybe he said I recommend synthetics for extended drain intervals? That would make sense. Yes synthetics have the ability to maintain their TBN for longer periods thus leading to the only advantage they have today over conventionals.....drain intervals over 5K miles....yes I agree..."and better visocity"...Viscosity is the measurement of the flow rate at certain tempratures.....so to say better viscosity is like saying better length or better width....WTF does that mean....once again...mebbe he said something like synthetics do not shear or withstand heat better than conventionals.....I can live with that sorta in a extreme way...a synthetics flashpoint will be higher than an conventional....conventionals will hold together over 300f.....hell if your engine oil temp is over 300f your pretty much fucked anyway....but OK...I agree again that synthetics have a much higher flashpoint than conventionals...."He also said the one he recommended was mobil one and his least recomended was penzoil. I trust his word, he rebuilds engines for the local racecars and for anyone else too and has seen the results of each"....yeah I hear folks say "my mechanic" told me this that or the other all the time and I learned along time ago to educate myself so I am not dependent on Ralph the mechanic for my engine knowledge.....I know great butchers also but they cant tell you shit on how to feed a cow.....lemme just say this....ask him for his data that drove him to that conclusion.....as there are so many variables to engine wear ( with air filtration being number one) that to base any oil statement on tearing down and engine is almost impposible...no ...it is impossible....ask him to provide some definitive data to show how Mobil1 is better than Pennzoil Platinum....Mobil1 is a GRPIII product now as we all know....this I gotta see.....he has no data...he is just pulling it out of his ass with no back up data at all and is probably comparing GRPIV Mobil1 engines with Pennzoil Conventional engines and that my friend is comparing apples to ice cream.....the reason I am sure he is pulling it out of his ass.....easy....data from labs compiled over the past year clearly show your mechanic is running his mouth and hasnt a clue what in the fuck he is talking about. Invite his ass here and we can discuss and share absolute definitive data and compare......

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    Quote Originally Posted by SSpdDmon View Post
    Were the comparitive wear results done on the same motor back-to-back? What was the delta between the two in terms of wear? How long were they run?

    As for my statement, I should have been a little more clear. "When talking true synthetics, GC owns all."
    Absolutely....done by yours truly.....and other LS1 drivers...go check it out for yourself....Blackstone Labs don't lie....and you never do back to back friend....you must trend to get accurate results....in other words...you run three OCI's with GC...send the third change in for a UOA....then three of the next brand so on and so forth....back to backs only reflect a mix of data the other oil produced.....most runs were 3K miles or less that I see....and mine were even less than that.....delta? Your talking PPM here .....but on average I would say Iron was 20% less....copper 10-15% less.....we should have a UOA posting section for oils.....so everybody could post up their UOA's...I got a shitload of them....

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    Here I'll help you out....I mean it's for the good of us all aint it?:
    LS1 Camaro on GC 0-30
    http://theoildrop.server101.com/foru...rue#Post853513

    Another one........
    http://theoildrop.server101.com/foru...0&fpart=1&vc=1

    LS1 ( Built) running Mobil1
    http://theoildrop.server101.com/foru...rue#Post765480

    New C6 LS2 Vette on Mobil1 breaking in the engine
    http://theoildrop.server101.com/foru...0&fpart=1&vc=1

    Chevy Truck running conventional Pennzoil..........LSX based engine by the way.....
    http://theoildrop.server101.com/foru...rue#Post250274

    Horrible UOA on a 04 GTO running GC 0-30...and no it aint me
    http://theoildrop.server101.com/foru...rue#Post249491

    Pure shit UOA on another fbody running GC 0-30...
    http://theoildrop.server101.com/foru...0&fpart=1&vc=1

    And me going from a top shelf $6 buck per quart 0-30 full synthetic to a $2 per quart diesal truck conventional oil....look at these numbers all you synthetic priest and tell me how in the hell this is possible? LOL.....
    http://theoildrop.server101.com/foru...0&fpart=1&vc=1

    Now I just did a quick search and found these....you can spend a few minutes and I bet you will learn a few things....still feel GC 0-30 is the bee's knee's and the top oil out there for our LS1's?

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sarge View Post
    Well I hate to tell you this but Pennzoil Platinum was doing its job and cleaning all the shit out of your engine that Mobil1 left behind pal. If I drained out an oil and it wasn't "dirty"....that would bother the shit out of me as that oil didn't keep the carbon and dirt in suspension but allowed it to collect on my moving parts.....your statement is a slam on Mobil1....and an endorsement of Pennzoil Platinum....and as for the color statement...the color of any oil has absolutely nothing to do with the condition of the oil. Many chemistries in todays oil will turn the oil various colors or shades of darker when in contact with op engine temps and that has absolutely nothing to do with the health or lubricity of the oil. You may have a TBN of over 5-7 left and the oil is blacker than Wesley Snipes pecker....means absolutely NOTHING. If you work for Pennzoil you must be loading trucks cuz you rather lacking in basic oil knowledge friend. Have you had a UOA done on any of the oils you have ran in your car?
    Look PAL you can put what ever the hell kinda oil you want in your car! I have used M1 for a hell of a long time and only switched oil once to see how Pennzoil worked..I said it came out like syrup very thick after 2700 miles. My engine is not dirty. No I dont load trucks Im a manager at a Pennzoil Lube shop. So I see the all mighty PP oil on a daily basis. My opinion is is not better or even as good as M1. So as I said before put Kendall oil in your car if ya want I dont give a shit! Next thing your gonna tell me is how good the pennzoil oil filters are....Idiot!

    Oh and how the hell am I slamming M1???? I said its better than PP. COMPRENDE??????

  10. #30
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    Very thick AND black after 2700??? Sounds like a good thing to me.
    You have sold me on not using Mobil 1 ever again. Not that I was going to anyways.


    And until you can back up your claims with actual data, I wouldn't be calling LS1.com's oil guru an idiot.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stricken1 View Post
    Look PAL you can put what ever the hell kinda oil you want in your car! I have used M1 for a hell of a long time and only switched oil once to see how Pennzoil worked..I said it came out like syrup very thick after 2700 miles. My engine is not dirty. No I dont load trucks Im a manager at a Pennzoil Lube shop. So I see the all mighty PP oil on a daily basis. My opinion is is not better or even as good as M1. So as I said before put Kendall oil in your car if ya want I dont give a shit! Next thing your gonna tell me is how good the pennzoil oil filters are....Idiot!

    Oh and how the hell am I slamming M1???? I said its better than PP. COMPRENDE??????
    Sure I get it....you dont. LOL. Manager of a quick lube place huh? Yeah there are some rocket scientist tribologist around there for sure....I'll stick with data and stay away from the quickie lube experts....and you base your opinion on color? Nope Pennzoil filters are not my choice and I base that on Southwest Research labs filtration and flow test.....metalurgy test from Dyson Analysis what do you base your opinion on? I know...the color of the filter....whatever....you feel good I feel good....

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    Listen...I may have came off as a know it all....and that was not my intentions at all....so I apologize if I offended you man.....we all are here to share and learn...it is when things are said as gospel with no fucking backup it can get sideways....so I'll post up data and you do the same and we can discuss like grown men and not have any chickenshit internet bullshit flamewars......deal?
    This is my signature. It is mine. Nobody else has one like it.

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    I will say it one more time I don't care who uses what. Everyone is bashing M1 now because they "MAY" have changed there base stock. People have opinions and so do I. I am not trying to get in to a keyboard fight here. You can say what you want about what I do for a living, I get paid well and run a very good shop. Hell you may have invented synthetic oil for all I know and thats great.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sarge View Post
    Listen...I may have came off as a know it all....and that was not my intentions at all....so I apologize if I offended you man.....we all are here to share and learn...it is when things are said as gospel with no fucking backup it can get sideways....so I'll post up data and you do the same and we can discuss like grown men and not have any chickenshit internet bullshit flamewars......deal?
    No issues at all.

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    Hey I was wondering if you had any opinions on oil additives..example Lucas, BG's MOA additive, Slick 50 ect ect.

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    Sure....no I didn't invent oil but was a key part of dev of the INTERNET as we know it.....does that count?
    I typically don't see any advantage to adding anything to the chemistry of todays oils.....SM rated oils have excellent add packs right out of the bottle.....Lucas VOA's have proven all it is really is a thickner....hell if your a 30 weight just go 40 weight and you just accomplished the same thing.....Engine cleaning is my hot button as a clean engine is a healthy engine....so I recommend AutoRX to all......and I should not have bashed or degraded what you do for a living and again I apologize.....I'd rather have a friend than a enemy any old day.....and I do love learning myself...it is a continuous process.....My issue with Mobil1 is they refuse to answer a simple straightforward question....when Pennzoil Platinum went from GrpIV to GRPIII they said straight up....this is what we did and this is why....and charge accordingly....Mobil1 is worse than a politician and continue to ask for $6 bucks a quart.....that is what pisses me off....Mobil1 is good oil....but not for that price....too many equal performers for much less money......

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sarge View Post
    Well I hate to tell you this but Pennzoil Platinum was doing its job and cleaning all the shit out of your engine that Mobil1 left behind pal. If I drained out an oil and it wasn't "dirty"....that would bother the shit out of me as that oil didn't keep the carbon and dirt in suspension but allowed it to collect on my moving parts.....your statement is a slam on Mobil1....and an endorsement of Pennzoil Platinum....and as for the color statement...the color of any oil has absolutely nothing to do with the condition of the oil. Many chemistries in todays oil will turn the oil various colors or shades of darker when in contact with op engine temps and that has absolutely nothing to do with the health or lubricity of the oil. You may have a TBN of over 5-7 left and the oil is blacker than Wesley Snipes pecker....means absolutely NOTHING. If you work for Pennzoil you must be loading trucks cuz you rather lacking in basic oil knowledge friend. Have you had a UOA done on any of the oils you have ran in your car?
    not to burst your bubble, but i ran my LT1 on mobile 1 10-30 for 125,000 miles and tore the motor down to build a stroker and the motor looked absolutely great. no sludge or deposits, looked really good and fairly clean for 125000 miles. Fram filters suck, do a cut open test.. penzoil and quaker crap same company..... i have been running Royal Purple in my LS1 and it now also has 125000. tore it apart to build a stroker and it looks better than my LT1 did... you cant always go on what someone said or their word.. i have done real time tests and i have proven facts time and time again... i have been building hig horsepower motors for 15+ years and have seen it all, and probly tried it all......howerever conventional oils are also good...its all a matter of preference


    kris

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    Quote Originally Posted by great_white View Post
    not to burst your bubble, but i ran my LT1 on mobile 1 10-30 for 125,000 miles and tore the motor down to build a stroker and the motor looked absolutely great. no sludge or deposits, looked really good and fairly clean for 125000 miles. Fram filters suck, do a cut open test.. penzoil and quaker crap same company..... i have been running Royal Purple in my LS1 and it now also has 125000. tore it apart to build a stroker and it looks better than my LT1 did... you cant always go on what someone said or their word.. i have done real time tests and i have proven facts time and time again... i have been building hig horsepower motors for 15+ years and have seen it all, and probly tried it all......howerever conventional oils are also good...its all a matter of preference


    kris
    Hey Kris....my bubble remains in good shape. I never have said Mobil1 is crap oil. I continue to say they are over priced as hell for what it is they are selling. I dont use Mobil1 because there are equal/better oils out there for less money and you dont have to deal with the misrepresentations and marketing hype you get with Mobil. With decent OCI's you can get the same great results with a conventional oil. I applaud your testing and research.....good man....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sarge View Post
    Hey Kris....my bubble remains in good shape. I never have said Mobil1 is crap oil. I continue to say they are over priced as hell for what it is they are selling. I dont use Mobil1 because there are equal/better oils out there for less money and you dont have to deal with the misrepresentations and marketing hype you get with Mobil. With decent OCI's you can get the same great results with a conventional oil. I applaud your testing and research.....good man....

    i hope i didnt offend you . wasnt my intension . and i agree on the conventional oil. especially on an LT1, they leak oil from the get go so putting a high dollar oil in those would be a waste... LT1 = a good motor - bad sealing from the factory...and SARGE you do alot of research and i respect that !


    kris

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    few things to keep in mind people is this


    how do you drive your car

    the heat where you live

    the cold where you live

    and believe it or not altitude



    kris

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