Not sure where to start...

[TokerM]

Quick back story:

I've had a light background in mechanics/repair (replace a starter, alternator, general stuff...) and I'd like to get more into home work now that I finally have a car worthy of adding performance. So I signed up for a class in auto mechanics from the local cc/vo-tech. I was assuming they would have a beater car there that we would go over repairs. Different components on different weeks.

Nope... I showed up and it was "...and there's the brake lathe, that's the alignment machine, blah blah blah, so... whatcha working on?"

I really wasn't prepared for that and I have nothing sitting on tap to do.

This is where I could use a bit of help from you guys. Where should I start?

I understand that typically the induction is one of the first upgrades?

I don't have any salvage yards around that I can pick from (that I know of,) so just about everything we are talking about would be an order.

I say that because I've read some debates on an ls6 intake vs. a Fast intake. As I don't know of any ls6 intakes locally, I'm thinking of buying the Fast 92mm intake/throttle body. Thoughts there?

Under the hood, it's all stock z28. I'd like to also do the air intake. What are my options here? I'd like to do a good looking Y intake, but I don't really see where the filters fit! The battery is packed in behind the headlight where I would expect one of the filters. Would I need to do a lot of relocation work for that type of intake? I also have another option in that at one point the front end was damaged and the hood was replaced with a SS style hood. Is there an intake system that uses the scoop?

If I do that, I'm going to need to get a tune up, correct? Again, I'm too new to mechanics to attempt my own tune. A bit more specialized a question, but any advice on where to go, better, where NOT to go in western PA/east OH area?

Any other advice on small (~3hrs time) projects I can tackle while I have access to a lift/shop? Everything on the car is clean and good, just..... stock.

I'm also thinking of adding a subframe. Would it be a wise move to get a bolt on subframe for now, then once I finally redo all the suspension just weld that bolt on subframe in place?

The car is "eventually" headed for a autocross/-10sec drag car (I haven't decided,) but there's a dream of a '70 454 Chevelle daily driver project that has to happen first. I'm looking for easy, bolt-on, entry-level upgrades for now.

TLDR version: What do I do with a stock z28?

[SMWS6TA]

Welcome.

Bolt ons - in the sticky section you will see some of the most common stuff that has been done. Opinions range as far in regards to what is sometimes better.

Theses are the most common bolt ons you will see not necessary in order - NGK TR55 Plugs, MSD wires, Air Lid, SFC's, M6=Upgrade Clutch Kit/A4=Stall Converter, LS6 Oil Pump, P&P Throttle Body, LS6 Intake, LT Headers, CAT Delete if you can or CAT Back system, Muffler. Then you get to the suspension upgrades (some say do these first).

CAI/Air filters and type of oil (Mobile 1 vs Pensoil vs RP) have a wide range of opinions (some very heated). Another area like this is Headers and Mufflers.

SLP - IMHO only 2 good products they produce - Air Lid and Line Lock kit. Headers are crap!!

In my signature I've done all of this in the past 18 months.

[SMWS6TA]

I say that because I've read some debates on an ls6 intake vs. a Fast intake. As I don't know of any ls6 intakes locally, I'm thinking of buying the Fast 92mm intake/throttle body. Thoughts there?

I just installed my LS6 intake. Compare to the OEM LS1 = big difference. It is a good upgrade bang for the buck. I believe they (the LS6 vs 92mm FAST) are compatible in performance increases. Some of the other guys that know more about the FAST will chime in.

Under the hood, it's all stock z28. I'd like to also do the air intake. What are my options here? I'd like to do a good looking Y intake, but I don't really see where the filters fit! The battery is packed in behind the headlight where I would expect one of the filters. Would I need to do a lot of relocation work for that type of intake? I also have another option in that at one point the front end was damaged and the hood was replaced with a SS style hood. Is there an intake system that uses the scoop?

Like my first post SLP Air Lid is the most common choice. OEM needs to be broken into little pieces IMHO. I did it to mine so no one would ever suffer from it again. With the SLP no need to relocate it fits every hood. Using the scoop, I'll defer to the Camaro guys on this one.

If I do that, I'm going to need to get a tune up, correct? Again, I'm too new to mechanics to attempt my own tune. A bit more specialized a question, but any advice on where to go, better, where NOT to go in western PA/east OH area?

No tune needed for changing the air lid. Also stay with the OEM MAF. After market MAFs don't do well without a lot of tuning. FROST is a member and our tuning expert. PM him or check his web site - tunedbyfrost.com

Any other advice on small (~3hrs time) projects I can tackle while I have access to a lift/shop? Everything on the car is clean and good, just..... stock.

I've done all except the clutch in my garage. I chosed a lift for that because it just makes it easier to change a tranny.

I'm also thinking of adding a subframe. Would it be a wise move to get a bolt on subframe for now, then once I finally redo all the suspension just weld that bolt on subframe in place?

IMHO SFCs are a must for our cars period. They should have been installed at the factory. Weld ins are better, provide more rigidity (3 pts are the best), bolt ons are fine if you have no lift and you can always weld in later.

I'm looking for easy, bolt-on, entry-level upgrades for now.

see my first post

[garygnu65]

you can go to ls1howto.com for instruction on some mod project.look in the used parts for sale or trade toward the bottom of the forum main page.the fast 92 intake combo mite net you 10 rwhp more,they don't make it any more so look for a used one.a ls6 intake sells for $300,if you find a fast 78mm intake for less then $500 buy it.get some after market motor mounts.you can do a mail order tune by frost for $150.

[Cutlass]

Start with bolt on subframe connectors, Intake manifold, ported and polished throttle body, and long tube headers. If your car is an automatic transmission then add a higher stall torque converter to that must do list.

[TokerM]

No tune needed for changing the air lid. Also stay with the OEM MAF. After market MAFs don't do well without a lot of tuning. FROST is a member and our tuning expert. PM him or check his web site - tunedbyfrost.com

Again, I'm a bit new to this stuff... MAF=? Mass Airflow?

I wouldn't think I'd need a tune on the air lid, but I would with the intake/throttle body correct? And if it is required in the intake/tb, is the car drivable til I get the tune? I'd have to drive the car home after the mods, park it in the garage, then pull the ECM to send it off (having one car right now sucks ass.)

...the fast 92 intake combo mite net you 10 rwhp more...

I've heard a LOT of comments like this in regards to the Fast intake. That's honestly why I'm thinking of going with that intake over the ls6. I figure that 10hp more is, well... 10hp MORE. Unless the price difference between the two is insane, if I'm starting with a clean slate, I might as well put in the best stuff I can at the time. I'm also going under the guise that since I'm pretty new at the shade tree stuff, I should stick with as much new stuff as possible, not knowing if I'd buying used crap someone is trying to unload.

[Leeroyws6]

I've heard a LOT of comments like this in regards to the Fast intake. That's honestly why I'm thinking of going with that intake over the ls6. I figure that 10hp more is, well... 10hp MORE. Unless the price difference between the two is insane, if I'm starting with a clean slate, I might as well put in the best stuff I can at the time. I'm also going under the guise that since I'm pretty new at the shade tree stuff, I should stick with as much new stuff as possible, not knowing if I'd buying used crap someone is trying to unload.

yes the price difference is insane.you can pick up a gently used ls6 from a vette or something for $300 and the fast is like 8 or 9 hundred.

[TokerM]

yes the price difference is insane.you can pick up a gently used ls6 from a vette or something for $300 and the fast is like 8 or 9 hundred.

Yes.... yes that is insane.

Let me now add this to the mix... Am I seeing a 102mm intake/tb out? Does anyone know about this one? (About $1k new I think?) If the ls6 is a 78mm, I would think that almost an inch more of lung capacity is going to be much better down the line (eventual internal mods to cams, headers, etc...)

I'd like to say cost isn't the real issue here, but due to time constraints (I wasn't prepared to spend this much this fast, this was all supposed to happen towards the spring,) I'm either going to have to go for the ls6, or hold out on this mod for a few to six months.

Ignoring the time constraints, cost definitely isn't the issue, but I ABSOLUTLY wouldn't justify $600 for 10rwhp. If I go for the ls6 intake, what am I looking at for TB options?

[SMWS6TA]

Again, I'm a bit new to this stuff... MAF=? Mass Airflow?

I wouldn't think I'd need a tune on the air lid, but I would with the intake/throttle body correct? And if it is required in the intake/tb, is the car drivable til I get the tune? I'd have to drive the car home after the mods, park it in the garage, then pull the ECM to send it off (having one car right now sucks ass.)

Correct on MAF

You don't necessary need a tune right away if you switch out your intake, but in order to get full benefits under WOT you would want to. TB only no tune needed. BBK seems popular but there is some others that are good to. If budget is a priority then I can PM you a website for a place called S2 Performance. He sells P&P TBs for around $150. I'm currently using it and am satisfied so far with it. Frost can have your PCM reflashed and back within a couple of days, for express shipping it will cost a bit more but that is because of FEDX or UPS shipping

I've heard a LOT of comments like this in regards to the Fast intake. That's honestly why I'm thinking of going with that intake over the ls6. I figure that 10hp more is, well... 10hp MORE. Unless the price difference between the two is insane, if I'm starting with a clean slate, I might as well put in the best stuff I can at the time. I'm also going under the guise that since I'm pretty new at the shade tree stuff, I should stick with as much new stuff as possible, not knowing if I'd buying used crap someone is trying to unload.

I know nothing on the FAST 102. Shadymilkman might know some things on it.

Let me now add this to the mix... Am I seeing a 102mm intake/tb out? Does anyone know about this one? (About $1k new I think?) If the ls6 is a 78mm, I would think that almost an inch more of lung capacity is going to be much better down the line (eventual internal mods to cams, headers, etc...)

I'd like to say cost isn't the real issue here, but due to time constraints (I wasn't prepared to spend this much this fast, this was all supposed to happen towards the spring,) I'm either going to have to go for the ls6, or hold out on this mod for a few to six months.

Ignoring the time constraints, cost definitely isn't the issue, but I ABSOLUTLY wouldn't justify $600 for 10rwhp. If I go for the ls6 intake, what am I looking at for TB options?

Used LS6 can be bought for 300 like I did. Check craigslist and ebay. I got lucky and found one in my area for $325.

I would say that unless you are making this into a mostly drag and occasional street car, the LS6 is plenty enough. If your going for track every weekend and nothing else, FAST 102

[Cutlass]

If I recall correctly, the FAST92 is discontinued and you might have a hard time actually finding one (even though some sites still list them for sale) so you're only real choice is the FAST102. And you'd have a hard time completely that swap for less then $1300ish...or more considering you need a throttle body to go with it, LS6 cooling tubes, and maybe some other little accessories.
LS6 intake will cost you about $300 to $350ish

[67CamaroRSSS]

1st mod should ALWAYS be sub-frame connectors. These cars are a "twist-o-flex" design from the factory. I don't know about you but I like closing the doors and not hearing wind (or seeing water) whistle past me at 100+...

Beyond that the LS1 is like any other engine in that it's basically an air pump - better in and out for the airflow = bigger HP numbers. I'd start with the exhaust. besides the better sound it allows he engine to breathe easier.

And if you're an A4 the a 3400 or bigger stall will really wake the car up. I gained .5 seconds in the quarter from that alone (see sig for mods to my 02 Z28).

[67CamaroRSSS]

Also, is you're car a 2.73 or 3.23 gear car? This would apply if you have an auto tranny. Check on the drivers door for the RPO codes. GU2 = 2.73's; GU5 = 3.23's. 2.73 was the default gear for a Z28. It's how they were able to top 140 mph (I've been as fast as 145 when my car was stock) as a stock car.

If you have an M6 (6-speed manual) then you have (as a stocker) 3.42 gears. RPO code would be GU6.

[TokerM]

Trans = Row my own 6 spd

I should also really avoid any exhaust mods. Having never actually welded before (I'm a mechanical designer, I just tell people what kinds of welds to put on things,) asking me to weld up an exhaust would be like expecting your 6 year old to paint your living room. Sure, he could do it, but the results wouldn't be pretty.

Hence the bolt in 3-pt SFCs (UMI?) I assume I can weld them (more likely, HAVE them welded,) at a future date after some of the more major mods. Driveshaft loop a given when doing that too?

[67CamaroRSSS]

Trans = Row my own 6 spd

I should also really avoid any exhaust mods. Having never actually welded before (I'm a mechanical designer, I just tell people what kinds of welds to put on things,) asking me to weld up an exhaust would be like expecting your 6 year old to paint your living room. Sure, he could do it, but the results wouldn't be pretty.

Hence the bolt in 3-pt SFCs (UMI?) I assume I can weld them (more likely, HAVE them welded,) at a future date after some of the more major mods. Driveshaft loop a given when doing that too?

The adjustable torque arm that I have (see sig) mounts the TA off of the back of the tranny and has an integral DS loop to boot. FYI: The stock TA is nonadjustable (for pinion angle) and bolts to the tranny tailshaft. With continuous hard launches this puts an undue amount of stress on the tranny tailshaft which (in the long run) could result in a broken tailshaft.

Also, I left the welding of the exhaust (and bending of pipe) I have to a muffler shop.

You wanna play then sometimes ya gotta pay...

And, I hear ya about the weld reqts on drawings. I've been a designer for more than 30 years...

[TokerM]

...Also stay with the OEM MAF...

Back on this one, are you saying that there is never a need to change out the OEM MAF, or that I only need to worry about tuning when changing out the MAF?

Am I correct in that there is a honeycomb baffle over the OEM while mods are straight through? If so, I would think that at some point I'd like to open that up for the same reason as the SLP air lid getting rid of all the baffles.

While I'm on the air lid, is this (link) the cold air kit I see everyone using?

[TokerM]

The adjustable torque arm that I have (see sig) mounts the TA off of the back of the tranny and has an integral DS loop to boot. FYI: The stock TA is nonadjustable (for pinion angle) and bolts to the tranny tailshaft. With continuous hard launches this puts an undue amount of stress on the tranny tailshaft which (in the long run) could result in a broken tailshaft...

All that is starting to get into the final mods package I'll do for the car. Seeing as I haven't decided on where this car is headed, autocross or drag, I'd like to do all the suspension based on that decision. That's most likely 2 years away. As I mentioned, Before this goes to track-only/mostly I need another car to drive. I'm hoping to get enough knuckle-busting tinkering experience with these light mods to propel myself into the confidence to do a '70 Chevelle project car. Once that car is done, then I'll switch back to this for internal mods (cam, header, etc...) then a driveshaft/rear end change, exhaust, and finally, suspension/body.

I was asking about the DL now because as I'm looking at the 3-pt SFCs, they only tie into each other across the car when you add in a connecting DL. The engineer in me is saying that I need to "complete the X connection" for this to be an effective subframe, but that stupid engineer in me also tends to over-think/engineer everything he touches. If I'm fine leaving a DL off 'til I do the TA/DS, I'll do that.

[SMWS6TA]

Back on this one, are you saying that there is never a need to change out the OEM MAF, or that I only need to worry about tuning when changing out the MAF?

Am I correct in that there is a honeycomb baffle over the OEM while mods are straight through? If so, I would think that at some point I'd like to open that up for the same reason as the SLP air lid getting rid of all the baffles.

While I'm on the air lid, is this (link) the cold air kit I see everyone using?

MAF - I recommend keeping the screening. It protects the MAF, it protects the engine. Some will say de-screening it will give you XXX HP. Only way I would consider de-screening is if it became a track only car. Driving on the street you can get to much crap going into your intake. I've seen air filters fail and there is only one direction it goes to and that is towards the intake. I've personally have had a couple of leaves make it past the filter and get caught by the screen. So do so at your own risk. I've seen online here that the OEM MAF works best for almost everything. Now throwing on a super charger, turbos, or using methane fuel then your out of my realm of experience and in that I would have to deffer to those on here that do. I've also heard of tuning nightmares trying to get a couple of the aftermarket MAFs to work.


SLP Air Lid link - that is a fairly common one used here. You can get just the lid and be good, as far as the rest of the kit I would be concern with hyrdolock issues if I was caught out in the rain. Believe it or not but these cars can suck water up if you get caught on a flood road. Also look around I like Summit buy there are other places that might give you a better deal in price.

Don't forget to do the free air mod..


OP, I'm not trying to persuaded you from getting a new MAF or the above kit, it's your car, I'm just offering my opinion.

[TokerM]

After reading some of the stories of stuff found against the screen with the clear lid (leaves, grass, small children, etc...) I'm pretty much back in the OEM MAF camp

I wasn't really endorsing Summit there either, that was just the link I had up for the whole cold air kit. Now you have me worried about hydrolock! (Pittsburgh gets more rain annually than Seattle )

THANK YOU for mentioning the free air mod. I had no idea about that 'til you mentioned it here. Many blessings for that, although I suppose I did read it in some other threads, the ones that really talk about it didn't come up til I searched for "free air mod."

[SMWS6TA]

It's so simple even 86-Iroc could do it

All you need is a Dremel tool.

[TokerM]

Well...orders are placed...

I went with the UMI 3pt SFCs (no DL for now)

SLP CAI & lid. I did some reading on the hydrolocking issues, and from what I can tell the Fast Toys and Austin (Super Sucker) CAIs are the ones with the hydrolock issues due to the extended downspout. Fast Toys seemed to also include a baffle plate to add for bad weather, and I'm thinking that I shouldn't have any trouble fabricating my own "rainy day cover."

MSD 8.5 Cables & NGK55 Plugs. (How hard is it to get to the back plugs? I was looking at that and it seems a bit [understatement] tight. Do I remove the coils for better access?)

Tomorrow, just a simple oil change (K&N Performance Gold filters good?) and I decided to paint my brake calipers. I don't like the OEM rust look I have, and since everyone and their mothers have red brakes, I'll go with yellow.

There's 4 nights of busy-work for me to play with, my neighbor needs a new serp belt on his car, so I told him we'd take his car over for that (again, being new under the hood, a serp belt is a big job )

That's 5 nights... 6 for a night of silly cabin stuff (the signal/wiper/high beam arm/cam needs replaced (turn signals don't always shut off and high/low beams don't like to click on/off.) and other things. I'm really thinking of waiting on the intake 'til spring. I'm still internally debating the FAST/ls6 (I have a bad habit of going overboard so it looks like the FAST is winning, but some time might tame that down.) I think there my be room for one or two small projects here. (I don't like the idea of wasting a night on a rack with an ASE mechanic looking over my shoulder.)

So a couple other small ideas? Line lock seems like an unnecessary mod for now. Clutch was mentioned, but that sounds a bit intimidating, are we taking about dropping the tranny here? I'd like to add in a short throw shifter, but not if the job is that big. No exhaust for now (that welding BS... These mods aren't about getting other people to work on my car.)