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Keeps throwing P0327 code...driving me nuts!

This is a discussion on Keeps throwing P0327 code...driving me nuts! within the General Help forums, part of the LSx Technical Help Section category; If that doesn't work. What else could be at fault if the sensors are working? Any grounding issues would cause ...

  1. #21
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    If that doesn't work. What else could be at fault if the sensors are working? Any grounding issues would cause the sensors not to work, right?
    Last edited by PhantomHaZe; 06-28-2010 at 10:07 AM.

  2. #22
    Moderator Cutlass's Avatar
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    according to the service manual, its either a bad sensor, bad wiring between the sensor and PCM, a bad PCM, or an under or overtorqued knock sensor

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    So I fixed the exhaust. No banging y-pipe anymore. Sounds very good and smooth. Light it still on though.

    When I had the shop check it last time they said it was either the exhaust or the PCM. Even though they checked the PCM pins and said there didn't look to be any corrosion.

    I'm really at a loss here. I'm going off what they tell me...and if they say the sensors are working I would assume they are torqued down correctly. And they said they didn't use and pipe dope on them.

    All I can really do is tell them it's still on with exhaust fixed and see what they say. I know they are following the GM procedures on this.

  4. #24
    Senior Member JayTA98's Avatar
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    the only thing i can think of is either a bad sensor, the wires getting short out when they put the intake back. good luck.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by JayTA98 View Post
    the only thing i can think of is either a bad sensor, the wires getting short out when they put the intake back. good luck.
    That's all I can think of as well. And they said the sensors were both working. I'm thinking they fouled something on install.

  6. #26
    Senior Member JayTA98's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhantomHaZe View Post
    That's all I can think of as well. And they said the sensors were both working. I'm thinking they fouled something on install.
    Pulling the intake is not hard at all. I did the LS6 upgrade and I was debating if I should do it or not. It was not hard at all, just make sure that you either disconnect the brake booster hose behind the intake or disconnect the plug for the oil sender unit and route the brake booster hose away from it. IF YOU DONT DO THIS YOU WILL BREAK THE OIL SENDER UNIT. I learned that the hard way. Some of the write ups out there on how to remove the intake dont talk about it.

    If you decide to pull it inspect the knock sensor wire and plugs. remove the plastic tubing that covers them. I will also remove the sensors and look at them and make sure that they are not dirty or they got something on them. Then install them back to torque rating. Clean the connectors with electrical cleaner and let them dry out before putting back(electrical connector eats the plastic if you dont let it dry). Put some dielectric grease in the electrical plugs and put them back. If they didn't make the silicone dam around the sensors do so at this time.

    If everything looks good reinstall the intake and check again. Trace the wirring and inspected to make sure you are not getting a short out of the intake area.

    The only other thing I can think of is the shop or you are able to exchange the sensors and try new ones again.
    Last edited by JayTA98; 07-05-2010 at 06:37 AM.

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    Yeah. I know I could handle it given I had a day or two to do it. My problem is I already paid to get it done right. And I just seriously doubt the new knock sensor 1 was faulty as well. Plus according to them, the diagnostics say that both sensors are detecting knock when they tap near them. I bet they either didn't dry out the hole enough or they shorted out the pigtail during install. I don't buy themsaying the PCM might need replacement. I know it's a possibility. But I doubt it's the case, throwing the same code and all.

  8. #28
    Senior Member JayTA98's Avatar
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    I don't know how much you know this shop or how much you trust them but in a situation like yours(im not sure if this is how they are checking the sensors) my friend mechanic hooks up his laptop to my car and while im driving he checks if the knock sensors are actually working. I'm not sure what software he uses but we can see the sensors working while the car is driving.

    Did you pay them to find out what was wrong with the car or to specificly replace the knock sensors? If you pay to just get car fix then keep at them until they fix it. I have seen plenty of places that don't know what the heck they are doing or are just not honest. I'm hoping that not your case.

    They should address the issue if thats what the initial problem was. keep us posted.

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    I paid them at first to replace my sensors and harness straight up. My sensors their pigtail harness. No diagnosis since I knew the code and knew I soaked the sensor with a hose. They do the work and build the rtv dam. 5 or 6 days later it's back on. I'm liable if sensors failed, they are liable if wiring failed. They then take a look at it diagnostically for a whole day hook up wires behind intake to computer/ scanner etc. Among other things I assume and determine that sensors are working. They think it could be PCM but also said there was no exterior damage to point at it. They are a very honest and clean shop. I just don't think they've dealt with f-bodys/ls1's very much. I'm going to give them another chance to figure it out. I'll keep all posted.

  10. #30
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    PhantomHaze, everything you've mentioned about the shop's diagnostics procedures and processes points towards them being right on track. In my professional opinion, they are being honest and straight forward. Unfortunately this problem falls into the gray area of diagnostics and the actual fix may take a couple stabs at it before it actually gets fixed.
    Good luck!

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cutlass View Post
    PhantomHaze, everything you've mentioned about the shop's diagnostics procedures and processes points towards them being right on track. In my professional opinion, they are being honest and straight forward. Unfortunately this problem falls into the gray area of diagnostics and the actual fix may take a couple stabs at it before it actually gets fixed.
    Good luck!
    Yeah, I hear ya Cutlass. I appreciate you taking interest in my situation. I'll let them do what's recommended next. When I talked to the dyno guy over the phone a while back, he said many times if the tranny was ever pulled (mine was at 30k to get rebuilt) the wires for the knock sensors rap around the bell housing and get disconnected or torn...and that possibly water got into the open tear and shorted the wire further back.

    Either way, I'll go over it with the shop and report back. This has just been a lesson in patience.

  12. #32
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    Well, I talked to the shop today. Told them where I was so far with it. The only thing they could think of doing was uploading some update that came for the PCM after the car was made. It updates a problem with ignition pre-detonation, for like an p0175 code...don't remember what he said, but the computer tech he talked to said it could possibly be causing this code (they will only charge me $80 for labor if it doesn't work...and the full $200 plus if it does work. All this even though the shop has already said they were getting feedback from the knock sensors with the scanner hooked up to the pigtail behind the manifold. I dunno. It doesn't really seem like it's going to help anything.

    I almost just want to waste a whole Saturday and take the intake off myself and check the sensors/wiring . I just have a feeling something isn't right under there. Everything was fine until I washed the engine bay lightly that ONE day and after replacing all major components it's still the same code.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhantomHaZe View Post

    I almost just want to waste a whole Saturday and take the intake off myself and check the sensors/wiring . I just have a feeling something isn't right under there. Everything was fine until I washed the engine bay lightly that ONE day and after replacing all major components it's still the same code.
    I say go for it and while your in there swap the 2 sensors from front to rear and see if the code follows the sensor. I understand they are new and good quality ACDelco sensors....but its something to randomly try before forking out more money.

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    Yup. They are a good shop it seems to me. But since it's still throwing the same code, something says to me that the previous install didn't go right, either water/oil left on the valley got around the sensor soon after install or a sensor/wiring was fouled from the get go. And I know the shop is doing the best they can to fix it without taking it back off, trying to save me money in case it's not one of their parts.

    I'll be having a learning experience this weekend, taking off my intake and all. I'll see if my brother in law mechanic feels like teaming up with me.

  15. #35
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    go to ls1howto.com and look at the intake swap write up. Everything you need to know to pull the intake is in that write up. After you do it you'll kick yourself for waiting so long to do it. Very easy to do. After having done it a few times I can have my intake off literally in minutes. Biggest thing is to watch the brake booster hose and make sure it doesn't break off your oil pressure sending unit which is mounted just behind the intake on the drivers side.

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by 0rion View Post
    go to ls1howto.com and look at the intake swap write up. Everything you need to know to pull the intake is in that write up. After you do it you'll kick yourself for waiting so long to do it. Very easy to do. After having done it a few times I can have my intake off literally in minutes. Biggest thing is to watch the brake booster hose and make sure it doesn't break off your oil pressure sending unit which is mounted just behind the intake on the drivers side.
    I'm sure I will kick myself. And I'll forsure be kicking myself if I end up fixing it when I just paid a shop to and they failed.

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    Sorry to read all about your problems with your car, but who knows maybe you will be the one to fix it after you take out the intake. Please keep us informed after the job. Good Luck!

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhantomHaZe View Post
    I'm sure I will kick myself. And I'll forsure be kicking myself if I end up fixing it when I just paid a shop to and they failed.
    hey been there done that. I know that feeling. That's why I come here and try it myself. Shops are my last option. I have been very lucky with my problems that I posted in ls1.com. Orion, Cutlass and the rest of the gang are very helpful and had save me ALOT of money and headaches. Sometimes we have to spend money to learn a new skill and in the end when you get to fix it yourself the feeling is priceless. when you get to help a fellow LS1 owner with a problem that you know how to fix, thats when you get to say... Alllll righhttt!! Giggitti gigitti

  19. #39
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    Can you hear any spark knock under acceleration, low rpm's, Higher gear?
    It probably won't as long as the code is set and the pcm is retarding timing. I would clear the code (zone will do it for free) Then drive it under the conditions stated above. If you can hear the pinging than the sensors are doing their job. And there is a problem somewhere else.

    A couple other things to check.

    Check for faulty connection at PCM. Check knock sensor connectors for damage. Ensure knock sensor harness is not routed too close to high voltage wires, such as plug wires, or coils.

    I can provide you with a full diagnostic procedure if you would like. Info is from Shopkey

    Good luck

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blksnshn View Post
    Can you hear any spark knock under acceleration, low rpm's, Higher gear?
    It probably won't as long as the code is set and the pcm is retarding timing. I would clear the code (zone will do it for free) Then drive it under the conditions stated above. If you can hear the pinging than the sensors are doing their job. And there is a problem somewhere else.

    A couple other things to check.

    Check for faulty connection at PCM. Check knock sensor connectors for damage. Ensure knock sensor harness is not routed too close to high voltage wires, such as plug wires, or coils.

    I can provide you with a full diagnostic procedure if you would like. Info is from Shopkey

    Good luck
    I don't believe I hear any spark knock. It drives pretty smooth except for the timing being pulled with the light. At idle, more so when the car is warm, I hear a ticking from under the passenger side and can hear it standing away from it while its parked. It was making me think a plug boot was loose or plug not tightened enough. A while back after my plug and wire install, I heard a similar noise like that on that side and it was no. 8...loose and spinning relatively freely. I tightened it up and it went away. Now that I have my exhaust fixed I've started to hear that noise. I was thinking it was a plug again, but the no.8 boot is on and clicked and the plug can't be moved with my hand. I guess it could be no.6 the one next to it, but I'd have to take off the coil packs and AIR to get to it.

    I know this knock thing should be relatively simple. I wash engine. Get p0327 code. Shop replaces both sensors and wiring, build dam. Drive car for 5-6 days with no problem. Getting on highway and it comes back on, same code. I don't know if they've check all the wiring to the PCM for shorts. Just makes me think it's still under the intake...the problem that is, because a short elsewhere would most likely cut current to both sensors, not just the same one that was soaked before.

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